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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Consumer Hardware & Components > Moto v600 BT syncing?

Moto v600 BT syncing?
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southtdi
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Aug 16, 2004, 09:46 PM
 
Is ther a possibility that this will be enabled in a future release of iSync? My understanding is that the Symbian OS has somethig to do wiith it but is it a real big code rewrite or just something Apple has choosen not to bother with at this point? Could this be something that may be sped up with the recent partnering with Moto?

Tried to search but no real telling hits. Anyway I am about to get a V600 for free (long story) and would like to use this feature in the future. I was looking to buy a SE K700 but the Moto iis at my favorite price......free so i'll be going that way for now.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.
     
rmongold
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Aug 16, 2004, 11:59 PM
 
Nothing I've read gives me the impression Moto is in any hurry to get their end of the Bluetooth deal fixed - they've not implemented some feature in the firmware is the way I understand it, but can't get a whole lot more technical than that.

As far as Apple goes, my guess is that if they haven't implemented whatever workaround into the new Tiger Sync Engine, they probably won't. Just a hunch. Anyone whose been testing (or "testing") Tiger's prerelease builds might be able to shed some light on this one.

Anyway, all said and done, all the above is just speculation. With that in mind, I returned my v600 recently and have a K700 being shipped as I type (should get it tomorrow). I tried using the v600 with OnSync, but was fairly nonplussed by the somewhat lackluster performance I saw there. So I figured that I would go with a more feature-ful phone that I knew would work with iSync (as there just really ain't an easier way to fly).
     
maxintosh
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Aug 17, 2004, 12:03 AM
 
Moto's V600/V525/V500/e398 software has a lot of problems. There's nothing Apple can do on the iSync end because Motorola's Bluetooth implementation is horrible and doesn't support a lot of standard BT services. So unless they issue a firmware update, no. But knowing Motorola... that ain't gonna happen.
     
rmongold
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Aug 17, 2004, 08:27 AM
 
Originally posted by maxintosh:
Moto's V600/V525/V500/e398 software has a lot of problems. There's nothing Apple can do on the iSync end because Motorola's Bluetooth implementation is horrible and doesn't support a lot of standard BT services. So unless they issue a firmware update, no. But knowing Motorola... that ain't gonna happen.
Would the V710 also fall under this?
     
TiDual
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Aug 17, 2004, 08:51 AM
 
Originally posted by southtdi:
I was looking to buy a SE K700 but the Moto iis at my favorite price......free so i'll be going that way for now.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Well, as the *very* happy owner of a SE K700i, and given the other comments about moto, I would suggest you reconsider, even if it costs you a little more. The K700 works flawlessly (so far), using it via iSync, and also as a remote control (the sailing clicker thing). I never realized what all the BT fuss was about until I got this phone ... everything just "works". I could literally sell my Keyspan remote now (about $80) and the isync functionality is worth even more than that.

Haven't tried any of the "internet connection via BT phone" stuff yet, but reports from others suggest it is just as smooth.

My 2 cents
     
southtdi  (op)
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Aug 17, 2004, 12:22 PM
 
After reading this it still makes me want teh K700. What I might do is get the V600 and then dump it on eBay and use that towards the K700. I have played with the V600 already and it wasn't too bad but the BT part is annoying to me and that might not be that important of a feature to the PC users but for a Mac user that is a worthwhle one.
     
maxintosh
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Aug 17, 2004, 12:48 PM
 
Originally posted by rmongold:
Would the V710 also fall under this?
The V710 is even worse! From what I hear, Verizon has intentionally crippled it. It has no OBEX object push, which means you can't transfer pictures or ringtones from the phone without using VZW's expensive services. The only thing it works with is Handsfree profiles.
     
rmongold
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Aug 18, 2004, 01:31 PM
 
Originally posted by maxintosh:
The V710 is even worse! From what I hear, Verizon has intentionally crippled it. It has no OBEX object push, which means you can't transfer pictures or ringtones from the phone without using VZW's expensive services. The only thing it works with is Handsfree profiles.
Makes me just that much happier that I went with a GSM network (T-Mobile) over Verizon. I was looking for a Bluetooth phone, and heard about the v710 and was going to get it. Then it took too long to come out. So I got a K700i. LOVE IT. Best phone ever (or EVAR if you're Eug, I guess).
     
maxintosh
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Aug 18, 2004, 04:42 PM
 
Originally posted by rmongold:
Makes me just that much happier that I went with a GSM network (T-Mobile) over Verizon. I was looking for a Bluetooth phone, and heard about the v710 and was going to get it. Then it took too long to come out. So I got a K700i. LOVE IT. Best phone ever (or EVAR if you're Eug, I guess).
Yeah... Verizon is eeeevvvilll.
     
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Aug 18, 2004, 09:35 PM
 
I'd love to get a K700, but at $350 they're WAY too expensive. *sigh*

The only SEs around that are available (and affordable) are the T610/600, which I dislike. The 2 tone thing is yucky and I don't care to buy a phone that's been on the market for about 2 years.
Aloha
     
rmongold
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Aug 18, 2004, 11:12 PM
 
Originally posted by Link:
I'd love to get a K700, but at $350 they're WAY too expensive. *sigh*

The only SEs around that are available (and affordable) are the T610/600, which I dislike. The 2 tone thing is yucky and I don't care to buy a phone that's been on the market for about 2 years.
I agree that the K700 is very expensive, but for the phone you're getting, it's well worth the price. I couldn't be more pleased with it; the Bluetooth features work perfectly, I actually like the phone book, reception ain't half bad, the camera is decent (for a phone)... not sure what else I could ask for.

Just keep your eyes out - I'm sure they'll be coming down in price sooner or later.
     
mbryda
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Aug 19, 2004, 10:30 AM
 
Originally posted by Link:
I'd love to get a K700, but at $350 they're WAY too expensive. *sigh*

The only SEs around that are available (and affordable) are the T610/600, which I dislike. The 2 tone thing is yucky and I don't care to buy a phone that's been on the market for about 2 years.
There's always the T637....
     
Arty50
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Aug 20, 2004, 05:17 AM
 
The answer can be found here:

http://apple.weblogsinc.com/entry/41...3365288/#c5715

The answer seems to be pretty simple, and I'm glad to say encouraging. Despite the dreadful answers from Motorola - who should be ashamed at the poor and confusing advice given, they probably have the right idea.

The v600 does not support IrMC and almost certainly never will, and neither should it. It does support SyncML, as do just about all the other newer phones out there. Apparently Steve Jobs even said that iSync would use SyncML - but it currently doesn't. But the market forces are such that Apple will be forced to go with SyncML - and one would guess are already are working on it. I would bet that the next major release of iSync will work perfectly with a v600. (It had better - guess who has one that is a few hours old?)

I found these two links rather worthwhile.

This one for a quick overview of the history
http://jane.mahalito.net/pipermail/z...il/000081.html

And here to get a quick feel for the way the market is going.
http://www.weblicon.net/html/mobile_devices.html
IrMC is a protocol that allows syncing over bluetooth, and currently iSync relies on it for said function. One of the new features of Tiger will be SyncML support. So I'm willing to bet the V600 will work over Bluetooth once Tiger is out.
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southtdi  (op)
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Aug 20, 2004, 03:22 PM
 
We'll that would be cool. Again, I like the K700 alot but you have to understand that free is free in this price range of phones so it is hard to pass up.

As for the menu, I have been using a nokia and have been playing with a friends v600 already and it is a big improvemnt over the nokia. I can eaisly adjust to using it. The camera feature is not important to me as niether are games and such. All I care about is a good phone that syncs decently with my address book. I understand it won't sync addresses at all but i can live with that for now. The phone numbers are teh important item for me at this time.

I have no problem paying for things I like and want but iif I can find an equivelant for a much lower cost then I will go that route. Cars and computers are one thing but since I don;t live through my cell phone that is another.
     
Arty50
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Aug 20, 2004, 04:46 PM
 
I have to admit I'm disappointed with the lack of BT syncing for now. But USB syncing has been working just fine since the new iSync came out. Plus I can use the USB cable in the future if I ever want to upgrade my flash/flex (which will require Virtual PC also).

Anyway, I've had a V600 for the last 2 months and I love it.
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subego
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Aug 21, 2004, 06:38 AM
 
Originally posted by Arty50:
The answer can be found here:
First it was Moto's fault, now it's Apple's fault.

How are we supposed to keep this straight?
     
rmongold
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Aug 21, 2004, 09:59 AM
 
I would suggest we just blame both and call it a day

I'm an equal opportunity blame-caster.
     
Link
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Aug 21, 2004, 08:21 PM
 
Motorola supports syncml but never bothered to support the other syncing service. iSync DOES NOT WORK AT ALL with syncml and never has (mostly because they're used to having their head up Sony's butt)...

the next version of isync will include syncml support
Aloha
     
sith33
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Aug 21, 2004, 08:59 PM
 
The version of isync that's out now (1.5) supports the v600...
     
wuzup101
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Aug 22, 2004, 03:10 AM
 
I personally bought V600 before I bought my Powerbook and was looking foward to syncing up with it and such just to transfer files (ringers, pictures, etc...) between the two devices. So far this has worked without a hitch for me so I'm not concerned. I'm not a huge fan of having my entire schedule on a mobile phone anyway, for me there's no need. I have what I need and I like the build quality of the V600. I'm also a fan of the clamshell design and had 2 previous V60's so I was already used to the phone which was a major pluss. I'll obviosuly do some more BT research before buying another phone... but that wont be for a little while...
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southtdi  (op)
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Aug 22, 2004, 10:18 AM
 
We'll meet up with the friend with the phones last night to check out the v600 again.

For what it's worth these are not stolen, his company is a very large cargo company (not FedEx or UPS) based out of Holland but with offices all over the world. The main IT center for the americas is located here and he is up the ladder there. They have a very large contract with t-mobile (thousands of accounts around the world) so t-mobile kisses there butt by just providing them 50 to 60 phones at a drop. they have so many extra that the employees just claim them for themselves. company doesn't care and t-mobile doesn't care since it leads to new users.

Now since that is out of the way he brought a new K700 since he just got some. I brought my powerbook and played with them both. I really liked quite a few of the extras on teh K700 (mainly the remote and addresses with contacts) but I found for me that the V600 had a nicer looking interface and for me better reception. I also have to say that I felt the build qauilty of the V600 was better than the K700. Maybe because the V600 is a metal case (or they did an excellent job to make it feel like it) but it just felt sturdier. Ultimate thing I liked is when it was closed is was noticeably smaller than the K700 which again is important to me.

I could easily live with them both but for now I am just going to go with the V600. I don't mind the USB cable and it seems OnSync may solve the BT syncing with iSync for the time being until Tiger comes out or the make the big update to iSync, whichever comes first.
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rmongold
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Aug 22, 2004, 12:11 PM
 
I don't know. A lot of people here seem to be satified with the V600 needing a USB cable to work with iSync. Nothing against the phone (which does work quite well), but when I bought a Bluetooth phone, I was expecting it to be able to do more with Bluetooth than just connect to a headset (and other minor peripherals).

My qualms aren't so much with the V600 as a phone, but with Motorola's seemingly tacked-on implementation of such a handy feature. My K700 (which is thinner than a closed V600) just works as I expected.

On the other hand, the K700 is also a fine addition for those folks who have both Bluetooth on their PowerBooks (or other machine) and an Airport Express. One of the biggest complaints about Airport Express has been the lack of a remote to change tracks. With the K700 (or other phone with a full Bluetooth implementation), I've got that missing piece of the puzzle (if you add in Salling Clicker - very cool piece of software).

It just seems to me that spending $250 - >$300 on the V600 (T-Mobile prices), you're getting just a very good phone without a lot of the really really cool features you can get on something like the K700. Seems almost like a waste of money at that point to me. YMMV.
     
Link
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Aug 22, 2004, 07:30 PM
 
sailing clicker only works on SE phones!

With most offers, you can get a V600 for no more than $100. Some carriers even have rebates going down to $50....

The K700 isn't available with ANY carrier in the US. This means you have to buy the unlocked version which costs $350+. That's 7 times the price for a non clamshell.

There's an awful lot of things I'd rather blow that extra $250 on.. an ipod for instance, then I wouldn't need 'sailing clicker' which costs money because I'd have a whole damn MP3 player in my hand!

That or another game console.. or a freaking set of tires for the car (not that I need any right now), or a few weeks of food, or who knows what else..

If you can blow $250 to have a fancy camera and syncing your address book (which can be done on a T610 or nokia with BT), you are one frivolous person. That's just diving beyond need and saying I HAVE TO HAVE THIS PHONE.

Ok so maybe not so bad, I'm sure some of you got good deals on your K700s, but they just seem waaaay too damn expensive.
Aloha
     
southtdi  (op)
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Aug 22, 2004, 09:07 PM
 
That is my feeling with the K700. Great phone but the price is a bit too high. My argument, of course, is I can get the phone I want for free. as for the syncing via cable that doesn't bother me too much.

You also have to realize what has already been mentioned. The phone most likely once Tiger come out. We alrady know that Apple is going to implement the required protocol into iSync in the future so for that I can wait. Also, I don't feel that I am not getting the full benefit of BT since the syning with BT isn't the most important part. The BT handsfree kit for the car is what is far more important to me.

Sailing clicker is a nice feature too but, again, that really is just a toy to me than anything else. I am not a person who cares about the games, color faces, how many ringtomes and wallpapers, and the camera that is on a phone. I want a good phone to be used as a phone. Syncing my contact phone numbers is important but that is as far as it goes. If it done by cable or BT isn't that important to me. I can wait until iSync is updated to accomodate that feature.

As Link said there are far more important things I would rather spend the money on than a $300 cell phone. If I can get a grerat phone for free than by all means that is what I am gonna do.

BTW, yes the K700 is thinner than the moto closed but not by much. It is also longer than the V600 when it is closed. T-mobile is supplying them to large corporate accounts, like my friends, but that is probably teh only way to get them in the US outside of buying one direct.
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rmongold
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Aug 22, 2004, 11:51 PM
 
You may have me there... I am with T-Mobile (just switched from Sprint), and the cheapest I saw the V600 with them was $250 (and that was only if you bought online - in the store it was $300). I check with Cingular at the time as well, and they were selling it for $250. Now that may be a localized sort of thing, but when I bought the V600 for $300 and saw that I could get the SE K700 for only $80 more and it did EVERYTHING I wanted, it just made sense. As I said, YMMV.

Please don't mistake my comments for diminutive remarks toward those who bought the V600; it just didn't meet my needs or desires.
     
   
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