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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > Merom MBPs in September

Merom MBPs in September (Page 4)
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Simon
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Sep 6, 2006, 02:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by SierraDragon
IMO for graphics users 2007+ the difference between MB and MBP is huge right now: ExpressCard/34 slot, real graphics card, bigger screens, more pixels, Firewire 800 (in the 17" so far)...
Merom MBPs may see some or all of: bigger and/or faster hard drives, more accessible RAM, FW800 in 15" MBPs, etc.
That's not what I said. You're quoting me out of context.

The point I was making is that if Apple introduces Merom to the MBP only, this wouldn't change much about the performance/feature gap between the two.
     
salaryman
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Sep 6, 2006, 09:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by justinkim
Yes, I've noticed, too.

I'm currently in "not getting my hopes up" mode.

There's still a possibility that a (relatively) minor processor only upgrade is in the works and that it simply hasn't been getting the same attention as the more substantial rumored iMac and Nano upgrades.

Still in that mode, though
The one thing that keeps me hopeful is that most other PC manufacturers have already announced Merom-based laptops, so Apple not doing the same soon would probably have a negative effect on the share price.
     
Sakino
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Sep 6, 2006, 10:51 AM
 
With the Imac line being updated today, could this mean we might see a new Macbook Pro next week? If we don't see it next week, I would assume they are remodeling the Macbook Pro line and we might see a new case and redesign in the next month?
     
cashel
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Sep 6, 2006, 01:00 PM
 
at this point I could care less if they remodel it or not, I just want merom in the MBP, and I want it soon.
     
RevEvs
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Sep 6, 2006, 02:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by cashel
at this point I could care less if they remodel it or not, I just want merom in the MBP, and I want it soon.
Im of the opposite oppinion.

From reports, the Merom isnt that much faster, cooler or better on power consumption. Dont get me wrong, it is slightly better, but not amazingly so.

A case redesign would be good because it would mean apple have thought it through from scratch, they have taken into consideration the heat issues of current and future CPUs.

I would also like the keyboard, latchless-ness, and easy replaceable HD from the MacBook.

The Merom is overhyped at the moment - with Santa Rosa it will be great, but at the moment its just a CPU speedbump.
I free'd my mind... now it won't come back.
     
Kenstee
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Sep 6, 2006, 06:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by RevEvs
The Merom is overhyped at the moment - with Santa Rosa it will be great, but at the moment its just a CPU speedbump.
Well put! Certainly nothing to get excited about unless you truly need a new Apple laptop immediately - or when it comes out that is.
( Last edited by Kenstee; Sep 6, 2006 at 06:23 PM. )
     
zaghahzag
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Sep 6, 2006, 06:05 PM
 
from reports its between 5-20% faster on different things.. with battery life about 20% better. it will likely run cooler since it's faster b/c it will be idling more often. All things being equal, it will be a better laptop with a merom.

but it won't obsolete anything.
     
Babar
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Sep 6, 2006, 06:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by fuzzball963
Well mine's still on order but my ship date for the MBP got pushed back from the fifth to the 7th . Expected delivery on the 14th. Here's hoping they're upgrading it somehow .
Originally Posted by skitzogreg
In one day mine went from the ship date of the 1st to the 5th, then later that afternoon to shipping the 14th. Interesting.
Has your ship date been updated yet, does it still shows up as the 14th ?

Thanks
     
MattJeff
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Sep 6, 2006, 08:10 PM
 
I want this update NOW! it may not be a huge update but its a boost and i have waited long enough. You gotta keep up apple! they better not be waiting for the ipod deal to end.
--------------------------
     
Rev-O
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Sep 6, 2006, 09:46 PM
 
[wishful thinking]
I am more convinced that MBPs will get a nice case redesign and a 9-12 announcement! With the iMac getting a 24" version, bumped vid cards, and meroms inside only getting a 'quiet' release, I think that the MBP is getting held back for the big shindig, and that will means it will be more of an update than the iMac just got. MBP update > just announced iMac update!
[/wishful thinking]
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
     
fuzzball963
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Sep 6, 2006, 10:34 PM
 
Both the MBP and the Apple DVI adapter I ordered shipped today and are projected for delivery on Sept. 11 for the MBP and tomorrow for the DVI connector. So maybe not a core 2 duo but still I'm excited.

My first Mac . No more borrowing friends to use.

Anyone know if it's possible to drop my iTunes folder from my Windows PC to an external drive and have the MBP read off that instead of dropping 30GB of files onto my nice clean harddrive?
     
SierraDragon
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Sep 6, 2006, 11:11 PM
 
Any one additional thing, such as a larger and/or faster hard drive, or better GPU or RAM or DVD or FW800 or whatever would make the Merom MBP worth waiting for (for me). The Merom CPU speed bump may or may not be that big a deal - but it will likely affect prices in any event.

-Allen Wicks
     
Simon
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Sep 7, 2006, 03:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by fuzzball963
Anyone know if it's possible to drop my iTunes folder from my Windows PC to an external drive and have the MBP read off that instead of dropping 30GB of files onto my nice clean harddrive?
I've never done it with a Windows PC but I'd imagine it works just the same. I have my music on another drive. Just put an "iTunes Music" symlink in ~/Music/iTunes/.

Make sure the external HDD is always available when you run iTunes or won't be able to find your music and probably throw a fit.
     
fuzzball963
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Sep 7, 2006, 08:29 AM
 
So for those of us that are new to this whats a symlink and how then would I tell itunes to look on that drive ? I'll probably put one or two internet radio links into the itunes library on the hd then leave the rest of the music on the external drive but iTunes can handle multiple libraries so it should be okay.
     
Kenstee
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Sep 7, 2006, 09:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by zaghahzag
from reports its between 5-20% faster on different things.. with battery life about 20% better.
You're dreaming!

"Notebooks get only a small performance boost with Intel’s new processor, formerly code-named Merom, and battery life appears to remain about the same."

Macworld: First Look: PC World tests: Mobile Core 2 Duo okay, not great
     
wuzup101
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Sep 7, 2006, 10:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by shecky
a lot of schools have them as requirements (my alma mater has a laptop requirement program depending on your major, which for this year's design students is a decked out 15" macbook pro)
Indeed.... MANY college students have top of the line notebooks. When compared with the cost of going to many good schools, a decked out MBP doesn't seem that expensive. I'd say the vast majority of people that go to my school have (based on what I've seen walking around the commons) T series thinkpads or powerbook/MBPs with a bunch of regular MBs also scattered throughout. Many students also have more than one computer (I personally have a home built PC along with my powerbook).
Mac: 15" 1.5ghz PB w/ 128mb vid, 5400rpm 80gb, combo drive, 2gb ram
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salaryman
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Sep 7, 2006, 01:02 PM
 
According to this source Apple won't be releasing Merom MBPs until 2007!

Apple to delay Merom notebooks

Arse
     
mikochu
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Sep 7, 2006, 02:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by salaryman
According to this source Apple won't be releasing Merom MBPs until 2007!

Apple to delay Merom notebooks

Arse
I can't understand the cockney in that article... wtf. lol
Michael Reyes | www.mikochu.com | Power Mac G5 DC 2.3ghz, 2.5gb RAM, 320/250gb HD, Dual Sceptre 20" LCDs | MacBook Pro 2.0ghz, 2gb RAM, 80gb HD, 15.2" LCD, booq Vyper M2 sleeve, OGIO No Drag | iPhone 3G 16gb | iPod 60gb (5g), iPod2Car in the car | iPod 20gb (4g) in an iHome in the bathroom :)
     
11011001
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Sep 7, 2006, 03:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by fuzzball963
So for those of us that are new to this whats a symlink and how then would I tell itunes to look on that drive ? I'll probably put one or two internet radio links into the itunes library on the hd then leave the rest of the music on the external drive but iTunes can handle multiple libraries so it should be okay.
You don't have to mess around with symlinks (symbolic links, it's like an alias).

(terminal command: ln -s sourcePath destinationPath)

Do the easy thing! iTunes->Preferences->Advanced->General->iTunes Music location->Change.

Wish they would do the same for iPhoto, I have resorted to symlinks for that though.
     
hookem2oo7
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Sep 7, 2006, 03:26 PM
 
there is a terminal command to change the iphoto library location...i've done it so all users share the same library, but i can't remember exactly what it was or where i found it
     
iBorg
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Sep 8, 2006, 06:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by MattJeff
they better not be waiting for the ipod deal to end.
--------------------------
LOL - count on that! The iPod rebate already does NOT include the new C2D iMacs, it's for "Core Duo" Macs. They, of course, used the iPod rebate to help clear inventory in preparation for C2D units.

Why in the world would they offer a $179 rebate to sell the new C2D units which will already be back-ordered severely due to demand? Not going to happen!



iBorg
     
azt33
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Sep 8, 2006, 06:26 PM
 
If they are waiting for the iPod deal to end, then we have to wait till the 7th of October here
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MattJeff
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Sep 8, 2006, 09:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by iBorg
LOL - count on that! The iPod rebate already does NOT include the new C2D iMacs, it's for "Core Duo" Macs. They, of course, used the iPod rebate to help clear inventory in preparation for C2D units.

Why in the world would they offer a $179 rebate to sell the new C2D units which will already be back-ordered severely due to demand? Not going to happen!



iBorg


my dreams are crushed.... haha way to Mess up my plan!
     
Nuks
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Sep 9, 2006, 09:26 AM
 
^Hahaha, me too. I was hoping that they would announce the new macbooks this week, as the offer ends on the 16th. However, now that I realize the C2D iMacs aren't included, the macbook probably won't. Now I'm rushing to order mine, to make sure I get it soon in case they DO announce them! I already promised the ipod to someone, she's got her money ready to pay for it, and I can't let her down now! (That, and I don't want to be out 200 bucks on this. I need all the money I can get!)

Shitty deal, isn't it.
     
slugslugslug
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Sep 9, 2006, 10:18 AM
 
Along the same lines, if they intro a new generation of nanos this week, they probably won't be included in the offer.
     
iBorg
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Sep 9, 2006, 05:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by azt33
If they are waiting for the iPod deal to end, then we have to wait till the 7th of October here
Apple will probably do like they did with the iPod rebate here in the States - when the C2D iMac was announced, the iMac purchase no longer qualified for the iPod rebate, only the Core Duo product lines.

Again, the only reason for these promotional rebates is to move products that are approaching "End Of Life" status, wherein sales rates have to rise promptly to clear "old" inventory before new products debut.



iBorg
     
MattJeff
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Sep 9, 2006, 07:10 PM
 
that saddens me
     
Nuks
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Sep 9, 2006, 07:31 PM
 
I'm planning on getting a mighty mouse too (2-3 weeks for shipping). Does anyone think if I buy the macbook and mighty mouse now, but ask for thyem not to ship the macbook until the mighty mouse is ready to go (ie: 2-3 weeks), I'll end up getting a Merom macbook?
     
mikochu
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Sep 10, 2006, 06:33 PM
 
I'd just cancel the order on the Mighty Mouse. You'll regret your purchase as soon as you get gunk in the scroll ball. So..within a week.
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salaryman
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Sep 11, 2006, 08:26 AM
 
I don't think Merom MBPs are going to happen just yet (certainly not tomorrow anyway - that's all about TV and video).

I think Apple would have released them last week when they announced the iMac and Mac Mini updates. Why wouldn't they include MBP updates at the same time if they were imminent?

Looking at the Dell site, I've noticed that if you want a 2.33GHz merom in a laptop, it will cost you an extra $430. There's no way Apple will bump up the price of their MBP just to fit this chip in - it's already expensive and this upgrade would make it prohibitively so.

It's a shame but I can't see them updating it until the price is reduced, which means when quantities are sufficient, which means the end of the year or early next year.

This is mere speculation of course and I'd love to be wrong!
     
veryniceguy2002
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Sep 11, 2006, 08:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by salaryman
I don't think Merom MBPs are going to happen just yet (certainly not tomorrow anyway - that's all about TV and video).

I think Apple would have released them last week when they announced the iMac and Mac Mini updates. Why wouldn't they include MBP updates at the same time if they were imminent?

Looking at the Dell site, I've noticed that if you want a 2.33GHz merom in a laptop, it will cost you an extra $430. There's no way Apple will bump up the price of their MBP just to fit this chip in - it's already expensive and this upgrade would make it prohibitively so.

It's a shame but I can't see them updating it until the price is reduced, which means when quantities are sufficient, which means the end of the year or early next year.

This is mere speculation of course and I'd love to be wrong!
I think Apple hold back the MBP announcement because some features in the MBP are part of the jigsaw of the 12 Sep media event... My speculation would be Apple update the AirPort to 802.11n like protocol (let's call this Airport-n), which has enough bandwidth to stream video... you can stream the video from AirPort-n to the new MBP which also features 802.11n.

Howz that?!
     
Elektrix
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Sep 11, 2006, 08:36 AM
 
If they were going to switch to 802.11n on the MBP, why wouldn't they do it on the new iMacs?
     
veryniceguy2002
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Sep 11, 2006, 08:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by Elektrix
If they were going to switch to 802.11n on the MBP, why wouldn't they do it on the new iMacs?
Either the 802.11n can be done as an internal upgrade new iMac (using the existing antenna), or Apple thinks most iMac users connect to broadband using wires other than wirelessly... It's also harder to upgrade MBP. Also, may be Apple use iTunes movie store to sell Airport-n, which in turns use Airport-n to sell MBP??? Pure guessing here, but I guess we will know tomorrow?!?!?!
     
salaryman
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Sep 11, 2006, 11:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by Elektrix
If they were going to switch to 802.11n on the MBP, why wouldn't they do it on the new iMacs?
word. it would make absolutely no sense to only upgrade MBP. surely they would upgrade all models simultaneously.
     
ghporter
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Sep 11, 2006, 05:31 PM
 
There IS NO 802.11n YET. There is a draft in a very crude stage of development, but that's all. Historically, Apple has NOT implemented anything but finalized standards. So no standard=no "upgrade."

IMO, it's just not gonna happen.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
Simon
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Sep 12, 2006, 03:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter
Historically, Apple has NOT implemented anything but finalized standards. So no standard=no "upgrade."
Maybe I'm just mixing stuff up in memory, but I thought that when Apple released AP Extreme, the 802.11g standard hadn't been entirely finalized either.
     
veryniceguy2002
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Sep 12, 2006, 05:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter
There IS NO 802.11n YET. There is a draft in a very crude stage of development, but that's all. Historically, Apple has NOT implemented anything but finalized standards. So no standard=no "upgrade."

IMO, it's just not gonna happen.
From my memory Apple released Macs with 56k modem before V.90 modem standard... Also, I think ADC (Apple Display Connector) was used on Macs before it became a "standard". Certainly iChat didn't use any standard protocol when it first released...
     
skyline1986
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Sep 12, 2006, 06:42 AM
 
i will be waiting until next year feb or march, to purchase my 1st macbook pro merom.
     
ghporter
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Sep 12, 2006, 08:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by veryniceguy2002
From my memory Apple released Macs with 56k modem before V.90 modem standard... Also, I think ADC (Apple Display Connector) was used on Macs before it became a "standard". Certainly iChat didn't use any standard protocol when it first released...
When 56k modems came out there were two competing standards, called X2 and K56Flex; this dichotomy spurred the standards world to come up with a single standard, and the result was V.90. iChat is an application that does something there is NO standard for, so that's not a good item to compare with.

My point was that networking protocols are different-Apple has ALWAYS supported network standards rather than proprietary protocols. They invented AppleTalk because there was no microcomputer standard that did what AT does at the time-and then embraced what came after. And they did NOT bring out AirPort until the 802.11b standard was finalized, in spite of the buzz about what was "coming soon." In fact, Apple was the first major marketer of 802.11b wireless networking...

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
veryniceguy2002
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Sep 12, 2006, 08:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter
When 56k modems came out there were two competing standards, called X2 and K56Flex; this dichotomy spurred the standards world to come up with a single standard, and the result was V.90. iChat is an application that does something there is NO standard for, so that's not a good item to compare with.
X2 and K56Flex can't even considered as standards. They were priorietary, owned by US Robotics and another firm... can't remember it now. When Apple initially started offering Ethernet (back in Mac II era) it was offered as AAUI interface, and you need to buy a connector to get back to 10BaseT or 10Base2. Now, don't tell me Apple follow standard back then.

Originally Posted by ghporter
My point was that networking protocols are different-Apple has ALWAYS supported network standards rather than proprietary protocols. They invented AppleTalk because there was no microcomputer standard that did what AT does at the time-and then embraced what came after. And they did NOT bring out AirPort until the 802.11b standard was finalized, in spite of the buzz about what was "coming soon." In fact, Apple was the first major marketer of 802.11b wireless networking...
Apple dropped AppleTalk protocol back in original OS X 10.0 (brought it back in 10.1)!

My point is Apple can use 802.11n draft protocol (may be like how Netgear implemented), and then upgrade to official 802.11n protocol when the standard has finalised, via an firmware upgrade. That be can done by the user. What Apple doesn't want is to hold on the product until next year (i.e. miss the Christmas season) and watched rival like Amazon.com or others operated the movie store business online business for much longer than it needs. For Apple, they need to create platforms to watch it other than their desktop PC, hence they need Airport-n capable MBP to stream video, and stream from AirPort-n to the set-top box like device on TV...

We will know very soon
     
ghporter
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Sep 12, 2006, 09:47 AM
 
Let's agree to disagree on this. I think Apple's history with network connection standards indicates they won't go down the proprietary path. Faster, MIMO-based networking would indeed be a good thing, but I don't see a means to build "forward compatible" equipment that would include draft n capabilities and still be what we expect from Apple (easy to use, "it just works" sorts of products).

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
poynter
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Sep 12, 2006, 02:08 PM
 
Is there a certain time today that we can say we're not getting any new MBP's?
-tony
     
justinkim
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Sep 12, 2006, 02:14 PM
 
Jobs seems to be hitting the end of his speech, and no mention yet. I'd say we have a little more of a wait for new MBP's.
     
justinkim
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Sep 12, 2006, 02:18 PM
 
Store's back online and the MBP's are unchanged.
     
dimmer
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Sep 12, 2006, 02:55 PM
 
Historically, Apple has NOT implemented anything but finalized standards.
I'd never want to get into a fight with ghp, but that's not 100% true: the Airport Extreme product was released before 802.11g was -rationalized-, but with the promise that if the standard changed, a firmware upgrade would make it compliant: you gotta bear in mind here that the standards get set, reviewed and finally rationalized (process takes months). The original AirPort 802.11b stuff was indeed all "true blue". 802.11n is still nascent and there's little point in even looking at it: right now, we could do better by focusing on making 802.11g work well within it's operational parameters (sad fact: take the marketing speed of WiFi and cut it in ten to get something like what you'll really see).

AAUI was a common, standards based interface used by Apple, IBM and Toshiba (and others): it allowed for an ethernet interface in a small form factor that could work with think, thin and twisted pair physical networks: Apple moved away from it when twisted pair networks become standard.
     
fleaplus
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Sep 12, 2006, 03:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by iBorg
LOL - count on that! The iPod rebate already does NOT include the new C2D iMacs, it's for "Core Duo" Macs. They, of course, used the iPod rebate to help clear inventory in preparation for C2D units.

Why in the world would they offer a $179 rebate to sell the new C2D units which will already be back-ordered severely due to demand? Not going to happen!



iBorg
Back in September 2003 I purchased a first generation 15" AlBook, which at the time was just a couple of days old and was able to get the $200 off ipod deal with it.
     
ghporter
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Sep 12, 2006, 05:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by justinkim
Store's back online and the MBP's are unchanged.
Rats.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
ghporter
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Sep 12, 2006, 05:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by dimmer
I'd never want to get into a fight with ghp, but that's not 100% true: the Airport Extreme product was released before 802.11g was -rationalized-, but with the promise that if the standard changed, a firmware upgrade would make it compliant: you gotta bear in mind here that the standards get set, reviewed and finally rationalized (process takes months). The original AirPort 802.11b stuff was indeed all "true blue". 802.11n is still nascent and there's little point in even looking at it: right now, we could do better by focusing on making 802.11g work well within it's operational parameters (sad fact: take the marketing speed of WiFi and cut it in ten to get something like what you'll really see).

AAUI was a common, standards based interface used by Apple, IBM and Toshiba (and others): it allowed for an ethernet interface in a small form factor that could work with think, thin and twisted pair physical networks: Apple moved away from it when twisted pair networks become standard.
G was a standard when Apple released products for it, even though there were rough spots the IEEE smoothed out later. There is NO 802.11n standard yet, nor for the next year or so at least. Thus no need for Apple to release anything related to N yet. AAUI was a good standard, but ethernet is better because it's more flexible and more widely adopted; it isTHE LAN standard in most of the world, and Apple helped get it there. Macs had ethernet networking before Windows version 3.11 (Windows for Workgroups) was even thought of.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Sep 12, 2006, 06:04 PM
 
Showtime....pfft.
     
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Sep 12, 2006, 06:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by justinkim
Store's back online and the MBP's are unchanged.
Crap. C'mon, Apple! I'm dyin' here!



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