[BRussell]

Originally posted by gwrjr33:
<STRONG>I won't be posting on these boards anymore.</STRONG>

Well, this sucks. Who am I going to argue with, now that Scott and gwr are gone? I would hope that they would both please reconsider.

[tooki]

<STRONG>
But tooki doesn't agree and he gets to make the rules. And that should be the end of it. Except he didn't just enforce the rules. He also felt the need to spin the story. </STRONG>

Umm, I am stuck between a rock and a hard place -- if I take actions without explaining, then I get accused of being some kind of Big Brother. But if I try to explain my actions, people can misunderstand what I am trying to say, or may simply disagree, and then there is no end to what I get accused of.

<STRONG>
Added to that was his presumption that he needed to enlighten those of us who are Americans as to how others see and hear what we say. </STRONG>

Which - as long as I do it in a polite way, and without letting it color my judgement, is perfectly OK. (BTW, I am American myself.)

<STRONG>
Even that would have been all fine and good if he had extended a shred of the same understanding towards Scott. He didn't. This makes him both an equivocator and a hypocrite.</STRONG>

I never said Scott_H couldn't voice his opinions. But any moderator does have to remain polite, and most certainly cannot let his views color his good judgement, which Scott_H unfortunately allowed to happen.

<STRONG>
I won't be posting on these boards anymore.</STRONG>

That's your prerogative. I hope you'll stick around and see that, while I may not be perfect, my intentions are sincere, and that I do my best to find solutions that let everyone express themselves, as long as they remain polite.

tooki

[Bodhi]

I can't believe what I have seen here over the past couple months. What in the hell has happened to MacNN???


Where in the hell is Monish? This place is falling apart. It's no longer about the Mac or fun banter. It's about letters being posted about Moderators stealing accounts from other boards...letters asking that other members be banned from the boards...threads by members asking if they should be banned...

This site is going downhill with no brakes. I used to love MacNN. But since the demise of AI, the poor communication by the guy with the inflated ego who runs this site, Monish and his moderators, the innacurate news postings on the front page...is there anything that can save MacNN now? Mods - I feel for you guys. I have no idea how you do it. The lack of support and information from Monish must be a bitch.

but please everyone. Enough! How many people need to be banned and kicked off in three months time??

[tooki]

Indeed. Monish's support has essentially disappeared, we're running this on our own.

As for the other stuff, there are still hard feelings between MacNN and some other Mac sites, and some dishonest people decided to try to slander MacNN by posting things like said letter, whose contents were completely fabricated.

As for the quality of the news.... well I must confess that I have to go to MacMinute for accurate coverage. :-(

It's also rather disheartening that every step I take to try to keep things calm and fair around here is met by scorn and accusations, usually by people who have grossly misunderstood what's been said, and then, when we try to clarify, they accuse us of lying or changing the story, and nothing that we can say will convince them otherwise, because they have convinced themselves that everything we say is a lie!

tooki

[CaseCom]

Originally posted by tooki:
<STRONG>It's also rather disheartening that every step I take to try to keep things calm and fair around here is met by scorn and accusations, usually by people who have grossly misunderstood what's been said, and then, when we try to clarify, they accuse us of lying or changing the story, and nothing that we can say will convince them otherwise, because they have convinced themselves that everything we say is a lie!

tooki</STRONG>

Take heart. Plenty of people (myself included) support you guys. No matter what you do some people won't be happy. Everyone puts Misha on a pedestal now that he's gone, but I remember some people trying to label him a "hypocrite."

Frankly I don't know how you guys do it between work and/or school ... Monish has left you in a bad spot.

[Bodhi]

I want to clarify something in my post. I meant the lack of communication between Monish and his Moderators. The Mods are doing the best with what they've got.

What the hell happened to Monish? Who pays the bills for this site? Does he make money off of this? Is he in Paris somewhere staring at himself in a mirror?

[ 09-16-2001: Message edited by: Bodhi ]

[BRussell]

Originally posted by Bodhi:
<STRONG>What the hell happened to Monish? Who pays the bills for this site? Does he make money off of this? Is he in Paris somewhere staring at himself in a mirror?</STRONG>

It's looking like that News Factor deal probably would have been for the best.

[tooki]

THAT I don't think... NFN seems to love absolutist rule, including censorship of even the mildest criticism (at least MacNN is willing to listen to people, rather than declare them a threat and eliminate them). If NFN had taken over, the forums would no doubt be dead.

tooki

[gorgonzola]

Let me clarify what our position is. Our point is not whether we feel patriotic or not (and I feel I speak for all of us when I say we most certainly do feel that way), but more that we made a decision independently of our personal inclinations as to how much discussion we will tolerate.

As many reporters and political figures have been saying repeatedly on the many television channels reporting on this incident, one of the worst things that could happen is that we change our way of life in this country, and that our fundamental freedoms which we have upheld for the last hundred years and more are taken away in order to be more careful and prevent future incidents of this kind. As a former Senator said, "If that happens, then they have really won."

Our point is that we personally do not agree with anti-American sentiment, and we will debate it until everyone is sick of the issue. But just like it was two weeks ago, this country and this forum has always been a place where anyone can express any viewpoint, and we have always prided ourselves on the fact that even if we vehemently disagree with certain viewpoints expressed here, we will never censor them and always allow them to be expressed.

Now, as many will be quick to point out, one has to draw a line somewhere. Our line is drawn clearly in our Terms of Service. Ca$h's latest account (as of this writing ;-) has not been banned because he has been behaving absolutely fine (again, as of this writing ;-). When he starts posting with a name like "muslimnuker," we will not allow him or anyone with a username like that to post here.

It's not that we don't agree with you when you say you disagree or are upset with certain posts made here, it's that we feel it is our responsibility to allow the greatest variety of opinions possible, even if we as people don't agree with them.

I've babbled a little bit in this post, but I hope you understand what I was saying. I live in Manhattan, and Earthlink's nodes here were messed up, so I am coming in a little bit late on this issue.

-gorgonzola.