[Eug]

There are always two sides to a story. Things aren't always black and white... Oh wait... Nonetheless, if there is any shred of truth to this, then I'd be quite disappointed.

Student Sues School After Barred From Being Sole Valedictorian

A black Arkansas teen who graduated top of her class is suing her high school for racial discrimination after the principal decided to name a white student with a lower GPA as co-valedictorian.

Kymberly Wimberly, 18, told ABC News she always dreamed about being at the top of her class at McGehee High School.

"When I found out I was valedictorian, I was ecstatic," she said.

That soon changed when Wimberly's mother, Molly Bratton, who works at the school as a media specialist, overheard school officials saying they wanted to avoid the "big mess"

Here is another article with a bit more meat to it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...76Q74B20110727

BTW, ironically enough I had just finished watching Blazing Saddles again today, shortly before I read this article.

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Kymberly Wimberly

Awesome.

[Eug]

But they changed the "i" to a "y".

[olePigeon]

What do you expect from a state that puts Invisible Pink Unicorns at the same level as evolutionary biology?

[Eug]

I learned something new today.

[turtle777]

I bet Obama would not have gotten a black vo-valedictorian.

-t

[lpkmckenna]

This girl did not just earn the highest marks, she did it while also being a teen mom. In other words, she's superhuman. At the same time, the teen mom thing probably contributed to her school's attitude towards her.

[subego]

Thank god we're in a post-racist world.

[OAW]

So let me see if I have this straight .…

1. Both sides acknowledge the black student had a 4.0 GPA.

2. Both sides acknowledge the white student had a lower GPA.

3. Black student is told she is valedictorian. Next day she is told she must share the honor with the white student with the lower GPA.

4. Black student alleges racial bias.

5. School officials say valedictorian honors is based on GPA and class credits. White student had more credits. Even though the black student took AP and honors courses.

6. Black student says the # of course credits is only applicable in the event of a tie in GPA.

7. School officials … :::::::crickets::::::::



OAW

[Eug]

Originally Posted by subego 

Thank god we're in a post-racist world.

I wonder if she would have gotten the gig if she were black, with that performance.



But... It was a really good paper.

Originally Posted by turtle777 

I bet Obama would not have gotten a black vo-valedictorian.

[Captain Obvious]

lol


this is going to get bounced out of court due to its stupidity.

Reading the filings made by the black student's attorney (all of it nicely one sided for the news cycle) we find the following:

The impression that the student was the sole valedictorian came from a passing conversation between the mother and some HS counselor. No member of the main administrative staff made any formal declaration that this was the case. In fact the student herself was not told she had won the honor because it was the mother who informed her of this claim.

Shortly thereafter the mother overheard a conversation between faculty (who have no say in this valedictorian issue) where according to her statements no racially inflammatory comments were made. She interpreted something as ambiguous as, "big mess" to have racial undertones with no other supporting statements that they were so.

She ran into the black superintendent of schools that same school day and expressed her lunatic Henry Gates like interpretation of what she felt was happening and he pacified her with some supportive words that it would all come back to the grades. There does not appear to be any evidence he was even aware of the facts of the situation prior to this and given the timeline and his rather removed position from issues like these he probably wasn't. And in fact his statements to the press all reinforce the argument that what ended up happening had no racial component to it.

Finally the next day the school's principal clarified the situation to her and offered to break the news to the student but by this point the woman already had it in her mind there were racist boogeymen out to get her kid.

The rest of the statements like how none of the AP teachers are black or that there is a disproportionate amount of white students in advanced studies classes don't seem to be related to the valedictorian issue.

The girl's mom is looking for a payday because she knows full well that its she who will end up taking care of her bastard grandchild that her very intelligent and responsible daughter had at the ripe old age of 16.

It would have been helpful if the news story also included the court documents filed by the school. That would make for a far less interesting story though.

[Eug]

Yeah, I think the lawsuit is dumb to be honest. However, I also think the idea of a co-valedictorian is odd too. There is definitely something odd about the events.

If the story by the girl is true - ie. She was told I'd be valedictorian and then the next day she was told she'd only be co-valedictorian, with someone with lower grades, then she has every right to be pissed.

[Wiskedjak]

I have only one question: why did the school want co-valedictorians and is there precedent for their argument?

[ort888]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious 

lol


this is going to get bounced out of court due to its stupidity.

Reading the filings made by the black student's attorney (all of it nicely one sided for the news cycle) we find the following:

The impression that the student was the sole valedictorian came from a passing conversation between the mother and some HS counselor. No member of the main administrative staff made any formal declaration that this was the case. In fact the student herself was not told she had won the honor because it was the mother who informed her of this claim.

Shortly thereafter the mother overheard a conversation between faculty (who have no say in this valedictorian issue) where according to her statements no racially inflammatory comments were made. She interpreted something as ambiguous as, "big mess" to have racial undertones with no other supporting statements that they were so.

She ran into the black superintendent of schools that same school day and expressed her lunatic Henry Gates like interpretation of what she felt was happening and he pacified her with some supportive words that it would all come back to the grades. There does not appear to be any evidence he was even aware of the facts of the situation prior to this and given the timeline and his rather removed position from issues like these he probably wasn't. And in fact his statements to the press all reinforce the argument that what ended up happening had no racial component to it.

Finally the next day the school's principal clarified the situation to her and offered to break the news to the student but by this point the woman already had it in her mind there were racist boogeymen out to get her kid.

The rest of the statements like how none of the AP teachers are black or that there is a disproportionate amount of white students in advanced studies classes don't seem to be related to the valedictorian issue.

The girl's mom is looking for a payday because she knows full well that its she who will end up taking care of her bastard grandchild that her very intelligent and responsible daughter had at the ripe old age of 16.

It would have been helpful if the news story also included the court documents filed by the school. That would make for a far less interesting story though.

Ugh. I've deleted my response to this post like 10 times now.

All I have to say is this, this reads like a post written by someone with a lot of deep seeded racial issues. Maybe I'm reading you wrong, but man, seriously.

[andi*pandi]

Having co-valedictorians is silly. Valedictorian and Salutatorian. Based on GPA. It's not like being voted Prom Queen, no selection committee. You are or you aren't.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

I have only one question: why did the school want co-valedictorians and is there precedent for their argument?

Exactly. This is the only thing that is important.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Having co-valedictorians is silly. Valedictorian and Salutatorian. Based on GPA. It's not like being voted Prom Queen, no selection committee. You are or you aren't.

"Your best? Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and f*ck the prom queen."

[ort888]

This all took place in a impoverished town of 5,000 people in rural Mississippi. I'm sure there is no racial bias there. Nope. Obviously these people must be full of it. Being black in rural Mississippi is surely AWESOME and these people are obviously just trying to jack the system. Why are black people always whining about everything? Seriously. Wah, I'm being persecuted, wah.

It's not like they are middle class white christians. Now those guys have it rough.

[The Final Dakar]

It's odd but finding out she has a kid turned the story on its ear for me. I feel like it's not that she's black – it's that she's a single mother who is top in her class, and that somehow sends the wrong message (Having an unplanned kid doesn't necessarily ruin your life!).

Whatever, I'm just trying to think outside the box.

[Jawbone54]

Living in the South (probably less than 3 hours away from this town), I can say that although we still carry a stigma as the most racist area of the country, things are much, much better than in generations past. Racism still exists, but 95% of the white people I've lived around in the past decade have never uttered a racist comment or given any indication that they carried racist feelings.

I don't agree with giving co-valedictorian status to someone with a lower GPA -- it should have been Kymberly's alone. What bothers me is how anyone who might agree with the decision is instantly branded a racist. Phantom racism in a world that is becoming increasingly less racist has the potential to set progress back more so than a small percentage of ignorant, hateful people. The South's greatest problem with racism is not just a Caucasian problem -- most white people are actually toeing the line of overcompensation, attempting to make amends for the past.

I work closely with several African-Americans, particularly a mother of one of my students who grew up in California before moving here. We discuss the South's racial issues pretty regularly, and she told me that she has heard 10x as much racism coming from the black community, which she attributes as a by-product of them being told for decades just how determined white people were to hold them back. This is a tremendous recent example of race baiting hindering progress in racial perceptions.

Race relations have to make progress, and it's going to take more than just Caucasians changing their mindsets to get it done. It also needs to happen in the African-American, Hispanic, Asian, and Middle-Eastern communities. Minorities often get a free pass, but racism is not a one-way street.

And yes, the argument for Kymberly's lawsuit does have quite a few holes in it. That doesn't mean that racism was not in play, but I have a feeling that accusing the school of racism was the first course of action that came to mind. If it applies, then it applies, but it's indicative of a problem just as large.

[subego]

Well, whatever you want to call this, it sure as hell isn't "white overcompensation".

[Jawbone54]

I certainly acknowledge that legitimate white racism is far more likely in a small, rural town, but even in smaller areas like Haughton, Benton, and Oil City (all Louisiana), racism is far less prevalent than non-Southerners would think.

[Eug]

Anecdotes are just anecdotes, but... When a colleague of mine visited his sister, he couldn't stay with her in their apt building because his wife wasn't white. To everyone's surprise the building had an unofficial no mixed race couples policy. This was a decade ago, but geez.

Then again, when Clarence Thomas pulled the race card when addressing the allegations from Anita Hill, that just really annoyed me. I have no idea if her allegations had any truth to them, but race had nothing to do it, yet he pulled the race card anyway.

[The Final Dakar]

How do you pull the race card when your accuser is the same race?

I was a bit young to remember those hearing aside from the wonderful SNL skits.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

I have only one question: why did the school want co-valedictorians and is there precedent for their argument?

I want to know this as well.

If there is precedent- based on the same criteria- then her case would be pretty shaky.

On the other hand, if there isn't- then the school officials are a bunch of idiots who deserve every bit of lambasting they get, including wearing the racist charge.

That said- yeah, the $75,000 lawsuit is just stupid. Rather than being about an actual principled stand, that makes the whole thing look like just another shake down for cash. No matter what, no one has been wronged to the tune of $75,000.

[OAW]

The bottom line is that this should be fairly simple to determine what's going on here one way or the other. The Valedictorian of a class is generally understood to be the student with the highest GPA. The Salutatorian is generally understood to be the student with the second highest GPA in the class. And of course, in the case of a tie either A) there is a "Co-" appended to these awards, or B) some other criterion has to be used to determine who gets the award solely. Now if this particular school uses a different set of criteria than this norm then it can easily publicize this written, pre-existing policy. And then that's the end of it! Yeah it'll still kinda suck for the black student involved ... but it clearly couldn't be chalked up to a case of racial bias. But if they can't ... well then this black student has a legitimate gripe. Forget all the speculation about this or that person's motives or what so-and-so had to say. Just break out the policy and call it a day.

OAW

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

How do you pull the race card when your accuser is the same race?

I was a bit young to remember those hearing aside from the wonderful SNL skits.

Well, he said he was a victim of a "high tech lynching"- IE: by the media and the Democrat party.

Personally, I think he was right. I mean, the 'charges' brought up by Hill were ludicrous, yet with the media coverage and fake outrage by the 'suddenly puritan' left you'd have thought the man murdered about 35 people. OMG! 10 year old 'she said' allegations of *gasp!* pubes on a coke can and *double gasp!!* porno tapes!!! The horrors!

But it wasn't just about his being black. It was because he is black and DARES to be a conservative, not down on the plantation of liberalism.

[OAW]

^^^^^^

Clarence Thomas was accused of playing the so-called "race card" by using his "high tech lynching" phrase as Crash outlined above. Which was especially ironic considering how he is a man who is so staunchly anti-affirmative action (despite the fact that he benefited from it in his own educational and career background) ... a man who made a career out of being truly conservative to the core and/or by ingratiating himself to conservative whites by advocating what they wanted to hear (depending upon one's perspective) ..... yet when his own ass was on the line he was quick to "go there" even though he routinely condemns such language when others who look like him use it. Legitimately or not.

Now I watched those hearings end to end. And needless to say people have different interpretations on what was going on. All the witnesses who testified regardless of their political persuasion were well-educated and credible IMO. But at the end of the day it was a classic case of "he said - she said". From two decades earlier. So I personally felt that the man's nomination shouldn't have been derailed by the accusations. Clarence Thomas was nominated to fill the Supreme Court seat that was held by the late, great Thurgood Marshall. Having been nominated by President George H. W. Bush it was obvious that he was not going to be cut from the same cloth as his predecessor who is quite literally an icon in the African-American community. And it was most definitely politically shrewd on the part of President Bush to nominate a conservative African-American to fill the only seat on the Supreme Court ever held by an African-American. Any misgivings the Dems had about his ideology would be tempered by the fact that African-Americans are the most reliable Democratic voting bloc. So they had to tread lightly. I remember having conversations with other African-Americans at the time discussing how even though he was a Republican he couldn't possibly be that bad. Not a black man born and raised in the South. Figured he'd be a black Republican along the lines of a Colin Powell or Condi Rice. But oh how wrong we were! But the irony I spoke of above continues. The man is supremely unsympathetic to any claims of racial bias ... unless it impacts him personally or involves something related to his own background. Oh well ... it is what it is.

OAW

[Eug]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Personally, I think he was right. I mean, the 'charges' brought up by Hill were ludicrous, yet with the media coverage and fake outrage by the 'suddenly puritan' left you'd have thought the man murdered about 35 people. OMG! 10 year old 'she said' allegations of *gasp!* pubes on a coke can and *double gasp!!* porno tapes!!! The horrors!

Huh? Around here, that would get you fired or at least a very severe reprimand, and no it doesn't matter what race you are.

[The Final Dakar]

Didn't more women say they wish they had spoken up like Anita Hill years later?

[BLAZE_MkIV]

The closest thing I can find is the schools student handbook and while it mentions graduation and honor and awards it doesn't mention how the valedictorian is determined or valedictorian at all.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Huh? Around here, that would get you fired or at least a very severe reprimand, and no it doesn't matter what race you are.

Leveled a decade later, with not a shred of proof, by someone who continued to follow you around from job to job and never said a peep at any time prior to your being nominated for the Supreme Court?

Yeah right.

[Waragainstsleep]

Surely the question should be "Has the school ever had co-valedictorians before?" If not, racist. If so, tough luck.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

I certainly acknowledge that legitimate white racism is far more likely in a small, rural town, but even in smaller areas like Haughton, Benton, and Oil City (all Louisiana), racism is far less prevalent than non-Southerners would think.

I've found the general level of racism to pretty equal across the Northern and Southern states, the big difference is Southerners are more open about it.

If something's changed, I'd put my money on less openness rather than less racism.

Either way, "the South... not as racist as you think" isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Either way, "the South... not as racist as you think" isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.

It's no "New Jersey and You, perfect together," but it does have a nice ring to it.

[Captain Obvious]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Having co-valedictorians is silly. Valedictorian and Salutatorian. Based on GPA. It's not like being voted Prom Queen, no selection committee. You are or you aren't.

That may have been true back in the 50s but not today.

In an era of weighted AP courses, extra curriculars , early college classes and about another dozen factors that can be considered in class rankings its not as simple as cumulative GPA.

The real bottom line is that there does not appear to be any evidence that her status as sole valedictorian was even made official by anyone in a position to certify it was true.

Originally Posted by ort888 

This all took place in a impoverished town of 5,000 people in rural Mississippi. I'm sure there is no racial bias there. Nope. Obviously these people must be full of it. Being black in rural Mississippi is surely AWESOME and these people are obviously just trying to jack the system.

Oh i see, you're one of those judicial scholars that wants the court system to operate on liberal public opinion and personal vendettas. That burden of evidence is just so antiquated and time consuming.
Anyway we'll let you get back to planning your Casey Anthony lynch mob and roasting of the Duke lacrosse team.

[osiris]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

It's no "New Jersey and You, perfect together," but it does have a nice ring to it.

Additionally "Heh, it's not New Jersey." would've been accepted.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious 

That may have been true back in the 50s but not today.

In an era of weighted AP courses, extra curriculars , early college classes and about another dozen factors that can be considered in class rankings its not as simple as cumulative GPA.

The real bottom line is that there does not appear to be any evidence that her status as sole valedictorian was even made official by anyone in a position to certify it was true.

Eons ago, when I was doing a summer project at my local hometown university, I got an award for having the highest grades amongst those doing those projects for the courses before the project started. That perplexed me, as I knew I didn't have the highest grades. I had excellent grades, but definitely not the highest, so I told them that. They repeated that I did. I again said I didn't. After much investigation it turned out the administration had boosted my score several points, because I had gotten those grades at a different university, which was known to be more competitive, with higher entrance requirements and harder classes.

[OAW]

^^^^

Hence my post earlier. The school can clear this up pretty quickly by releasing the written policy they have in place for determining the Valedictorian. That will either support this young lady's allegations or it won't. Ultimately this will be either be settled out of court or at trial. But I must say that I'm not dismissive of her complaint because the school has yet to do this really simple thing that would shut her completely down ... provided that everything was on the up and up.

Again, the school is claiming that course credits are factored in. The black student is claiming that course credits are only applicable in the event of a tie when it comes to GPA. Releasing the written policy would answer that question one way or the other. The silence from school officials on this point is quite interesting.

OAW

[ort888]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious 

Oh i see, you're one of those judicial scholars that wants the court system to operate on liberal public opinion and personal vendettas. That burden of evidence is just so antiquated and time consuming.
Anyway we'll let you get back to planning your Casey Anthony lynch mob and roasting of the Duke lacrosse team.

There is this underlying current on this board of a deep seeded hatred for any minority that dares bring up race issues. I find it somewhat disturbing and offensive. People act as if racism doesn't exist anymore. IT DOES.

You're doing the opposite, slinging terrible insults like...

The girl's mom is looking for a payday because she knows full well that its she who will end up taking care of her bastard grandchild that her very intelligent and responsible daughter had at the ripe old age of 16.

lunatic Henry Gates like interpretation

You don't know these people. You don't know this school. You are letting you deep hatred of any minority ever bringing up race cloud your judgement.

It comes down to grades. You're valedictorian or you aren't. The school needs to explain their actions. We've heard one side, let's wait for the other before condemning these two people to being gold digging drains on society.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

"Your best? Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and f*ck the prom queen."

My wife was the prom queen.

Okay, it was in Canuckistan, but it still counts.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

but it still counts.

Sounds like a topic for a poll.
(No I won't)

[subego]

Originally Posted by BLAZE_MkIV 

The closest thing I can find is the schools student handbook and while it mentions graduation and honor and awards it doesn't mention how the valedictorian is determined or valedictorian at all.

Great.

You and your goddamn primary sources.

[Waragainstsleep]

It looks like the girls mother IS looking for a payday since no-one was damaged to the tune of $75k. I don't think its racist to say that part since it seems to me that people of all ages, races and means have a tendency to litigate. Particularly in the US.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious

The girl's mom is looking for a payday because she knows full well that its she who will end up taking care of her bastard grandchild that her very intelligent and responsible daughter had at the ripe old age of 16.

Asshole-ism like this is why you've been in my ignore list for so long, and I only see your asshat-ery when someone quotes it.

[BLAZE_MkIV]

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep 

It looks like the girls mother IS looking for a payday since no-one was damaged to the tune of $75k. I don't think its racist to say that part since it seems to me that people of all ages, races and means have a tendency to litigate. Particularly in the US.

You're forgetting how good valedictorian looks on a resume when your fresh out of school. An extra 2 months of contributions to your 401k at the beginning will be worth more than that.

[Captain Obvious]

Originally Posted by ort888 

You don't know these people. You don't know this school. You are letting you deep hatred of any minority ever bringing up race cloud your judgement.

Umm, no. Your lemming like political correctness overrides any critical thinking process time and again in your posts. It seems the cry of racism triggers some sort of Pavlovian response in you that feels the need to defend the claim as legitimate even if there is no actual proof to substantiate it. Its sad.

As for "any" minority group... no.
Crying wolf over the presence of invisible racist specters is the sole domain of African Americans in this country. There's an ingrained cultural victim mentality that their community suffers from that's been fostered over generations. That's sadder. No other minority group in the West seems to embrace this perspective that the world is continuously cheating them as African Americans do. That attitude and propensity to hurl accusations doesn't seem to translate along the same racial lines in the rest of the world.

If you were truly as progressive as you claim you'd be pissing in your pants that cases like this are treated seriously when there are real injustices in the world that get drowned out by people like this who are looking to make a buck by playing a race card

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

Asshole-ism like this is why you've been in my ignore list for so long, and I only see your asshat-ery when someone quotes it.

Sorry who the **** are you again?
You're so insignificant in these discussions that I can't say you made any lasting impression on me.
But clearly you still care enough about my posts to bitch like a little girl so knock yourself out.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious 

I will say it.

Obama already has the n***** vote locked up

Another fine Captain Obvious post which pairs well with your current one.

[Kerrigan]

Fully 96 percent of black voters supported Obama

(Just sayin')

[subego]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Fully 96 percent of black voters supported Obama

(Just sayin')

You're being intentionally obtuse.