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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Desktops > 1st mini mac 7200 RPM HD upgrade...

1st mini mac 7200 RPM HD upgrade...
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Thade
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Jan 27, 2005, 01:21 PM
 
I've been considering this "mod" so I'm intersted in what you guys think of these results compared to the stock drive or even a similar speed 3.5" drive. I'm also not sure how the results might vary after a RAM upgrade...

http://discussions.info.apple.com/[email protected]

J
     
eddiecatflap
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Jan 27, 2005, 02:53 PM
 
what aboot cooling ?

it's very tight in there already
     
Thade  (op)
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Jan 27, 2005, 02:59 PM
 
I don't think the Hitachi runs a whole lot hotter (if at all) than the standard drive

http://www.hitachigst.com/hdd/support/7k60/7k60.htm
     
Eriamjh
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Jan 27, 2005, 08:26 PM
 
Pffft.... A couple sites have already done it.

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Hi I'm Ben
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Jan 27, 2005, 09:23 PM
 
a 3.5 drive eh? So you just gonna run the mini without a case on it? that will look super neat. and really, putting a new HD in a mini is not a big deal. Easier then upgrading an iBook.
     
wedgewood
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Jan 28, 2005, 02:14 AM
 
This is a 2.5 inch hard disk for notebook. Hitachi sells 7200 rpm notebook hard disk.
1.33 GHz 12" powerbook, 1.25GB
     
mikerally
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Jan 28, 2005, 06:13 AM
 
This is good news.

I'm very keen to see how the Seagate Momentus 2.5 inch 100GB 7200RPM drive will fare against the Hitachi when it comes out soon.

Checking out Tom's Hardware Guide, there's a thorough comparison/benchmark of all the currently shipping drives. The Hitachi blew the socks off anything else that was there (being the only 7200RPM drive and all).

On a side note, any word on that 2GB PC2700 DIMM?
     
wedgewood
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Jan 28, 2005, 06:48 AM
 
2GB PC2700 does not show in the market. The major DRAM manufacturers like Samsung have changed their production line to DDR2. So you do not have a chance to get 2GB PC2700 memory.
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Mykul
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Jan 28, 2005, 09:59 PM
 
I have already upgraded my mac mini with a 100GB Seagate drive and 1GB of ram. It runs great! Doesn't seem to be running any hotter...just dramatically faster.

Have Fun!

<><
mykul
     
Tsilou B.
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Jan 29, 2005, 09:32 AM
 
Originally posted by wedgewood:
2GB PC2700 does not show in the market. The major DRAM manufacturers like Samsung have changed their production line to DDR2. So you do not have a chance to get 2GB PC2700 memory.
That doesn't seem to be correct. I found a 2GB PC2700 DIMM from Transcend:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?Q50F21A5A

It's a single DIMM, not some kind of "memory kit" consisting of 2 or more DIMMs.

(Edit: I had to use redirection via makeashorterlink.com, because this board does not support very long URLs)
     
Tsilou B.
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Jan 29, 2005, 09:52 AM
 
Originally posted by Tsilou B.:
That doesn't seem to be correct. I found a 2GB PC2700 DIMM from Transcend:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?Q50F21A5A

It's a single DIMM, not some kind of "memory kit" consisting of 2 or more DIMMs.

(Edit: I had to use redirection via makeashorterlink.com, because this board does not support very long URLs)
Btw, this DIMM won't run in a mini because it's a buffered DIMM, but I think if there are 2GB PC2700 buffered DIMMs, then unbuffered 2GB PC2700 DIMMs will also exist.
     
Tsilou B.
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Jan 29, 2005, 10:11 AM
 
Originally posted by Tsilou B.:
Btw, this DIMM won't run in a mini because it's a buffered DIMM, but I think if there are 2GB PC2700 buffered DIMMs, then unbuffered 2GB PC2700 DIMMs will also exist.
I just found out that SAMSUNG says an unbuffered 2GB PC2700 DIMM that should be fully compatible with the mini (product number: M381L5623MTM) is in "Mass production". So I'm quite sure that it is (or will be) possible to update the mini to 2GB RAM.
     
Tikas
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Jan 29, 2005, 10:20 AM
 
Well, 780 EUR for 2Gb DIMM, it's about 1000 USD these days, i would buy iMac if i need that much RAM.
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sensate
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Jan 29, 2005, 12:05 PM
 
I've seen 2GB PC3200 sticks. Often the 3200 is cheaper than the 2700. I believe I've heard they'll work in the mini just fine.
     
seabasstin
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Jan 29, 2005, 04:20 PM
 
I know you guys are doing the What if charade when You are talkingabout the 2GB ram; but for those practical souls who are thinking this is a serious discussion, you CANNOT put 2GB of ram in the computer because unlike on a PC Apple generally (as in always) firmware locks the ram capacity at their Max.
They could release an update to allow this upgrade on the mini but that would be a miracle.

so all you would have is a very expensive 1GB chip.
     
sayonaraML
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Jan 29, 2005, 05:06 PM
 
Hi:
I have an eMac and am wondering if it would be possible to boot from a mini (basiaclly just using the monitor of the eMac aling with the keyboard and peripherals). Doable? bad idea?
     
sensate
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Jan 29, 2005, 05:46 PM
 
Uh...sebasstin, I think you might be mistaken. The Pismo was Apple-specced as 512, but will take 1G. See here for example.
     
hayesk
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Jan 29, 2005, 05:49 PM
 
Originally posted by seabasstin:
I know you guys are doing the What if charade when You are talkingabout the 2GB ram; but for those practical souls who are thinking this is a serious discussion, you CANNOT put 2GB of ram in the computer because unlike on a PC Apple generally (as in always) firmware locks the ram capacity at their Max.
They could release an update to allow this upgrade on the mini but that would be a miracle.

so all you would have is a very expensive 1GB chip.
Bull. I've seen PowerBooks in the past sold with "512MB Max" or whatever, and only to have people put larger ones later when they come on the market.

It can vary from machine to machine, but to say Apple always locks this in firmware is false.
     
typoon
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Jan 29, 2005, 07:59 PM
 
Originally posted by seabasstin:
I know you guys are doing the What if charade when You are talkingabout the 2GB ram; but for those practical souls who are thinking this is a serious discussion, you CANNOT put 2GB of ram in the computer because unlike on a PC Apple generally (as in always) firmware locks the ram capacity at their Max.
They could release an update to allow this upgrade on the mini but that would be a miracle.

so all you would have is a very expensive 1GB chip.
I'm also going to tell you that you are wrong. That is what Apple "supports" If you run into a problem because of RAM don't go crying to them but it WILL work. It's only the HD that has a hard limit. The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
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Superchicken
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Jan 29, 2005, 08:08 PM
 
Originally posted by sayonaraML:
Hi:
I have an eMac and am wondering if it would be possible to boot from a mini (basiaclly just using the monitor of the eMac aling with the keyboard and peripherals). Doable? bad idea?
You'd have to be running wires to the eMac, technically it could be done, but it would probably require cutting up the back of the eMac or something. You'd need to have some sort of monitor running to the eMac and such. Either that or you could run the eMac and run something like VNC or Apple Remote Desktop to control it...
     
iDaver
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Jan 29, 2005, 08:48 PM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
What???!
     
iDaver
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Jan 29, 2005, 08:50 PM
 
Originally posted by mikerally:
I'm very keen to see how the Seagate Momentus 2.5 inch 100GB 7200RPM drive will fare against the Hitachi when it comes out soon.
Have you heard when this is due? I'm anxiously waiting for 7200 80s or 100s.
     
petard
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Jan 29, 2005, 09:57 PM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
I'm also going to tell you that you are wrong. That is what Apple "supports" If you run into a problem because of RAM don't go crying to them but it WILL work. It's only the HD that has a hard limit. The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
That must depend on the G4... my MDD G4 handles a 200GB HD no problem. It sees all 200GB.
     
SmileyDude
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Jan 29, 2005, 10:43 PM
 
Originally posted by seabasstin:
I know you guys are doing the What if charade when You are talkingabout the 2GB ram; but for those practical souls who are thinking this is a serious discussion, you CANNOT put 2GB of ram in the computer because unlike on a PC Apple generally (as in always) firmware locks the ram capacity at their Max.
They could release an update to allow this upgrade on the mini but that would be a miracle.

so all you would have is a very expensive 1GB chip.
I'll chime in with my own personal experience -- I had a iBook G3 366mhz. The official specs say 384mb max (128mb on the board, 256mb in the slot). I had a 512mb stick in there that gave me 640mb total. It happens quite a bit with Apple to support more than they originaly said. Personally, I find the opposite to be true in the PC world.

And, I'm pretty sure that I read a quote from an Apple rep that said that once the 2gig sticks were available, that the mini would support it. (BTW, wouldn't the mini be the only G4 that supports the 2gig chips since the 32-bit macs top out at 2gig max, and the mini is the only one that has a single DIMM slot?)
dennis
     
megasad
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Jan 29, 2005, 10:52 PM
 
Originally posted by Superchicken:
Originally posted by sayonaraML:
Hi:
I have an eMac and am wondering if it would be possible to boot from a mini (basiaclly just using the monitor of the eMac aling with the keyboard and peripherals). Doable? bad idea?
You'd have to be running wires to the eMac, technically it could be done, but it would probably require cutting up the back of the eMac or something. You'd need to have some sort of monitor running to the eMac and such. Either that or you could run the eMac and run something like VNC or Apple Remote Desktop to control it...
sayonaraML, listen not to what Superchicken tells you; it is very easy to do what you want to do.

Start the Mac mini up in Target Disk Mode (connect your eMac's keyboard to it, hold down T whilst turning it on). Then, plug the keyboard back into your eMac, connect the Mac mini to the eMac with a FireWire cable, and turn the eMac on whilst holding down the Option key. Choose the mini's hard drive as the start up volume, and you'll be using the screen, speakers, optical drive, keyboard and mouse (and any other peripherals) of your eMac, but using the hard drive of the Mac mini.

To make the Mac mini always be the start up disk for the eMac, just change make it so in System Preferences. So long as the mini is turned on, in Target Disk Mode, and conncted to the eMac, when you turn the eMac on, it will start from the mini. If the mini is not connected, the eMac will simply try to start up from its own hard drive.

However, why you'd want to do this is lost on me... It's just like using an external, slower hard drive on the eMac... And if, like me, you've got a 7200rpm hard drive in your eMac, that just doesn't make any sense.
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robertka
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Jan 30, 2005, 03:46 AM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
I'm also going to tell you that you are wrong. That is what Apple "supports" If you run into a problem because of RAM don't go crying to them but it WILL work. It's only the HD that has a hard limit. The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
That's not true. Early G4 machines top out at 132 GB on the hard drive due to the limitations of the ATA/66 bus. All machines built around the ATA/66 specification are faced with this limitation. It has nothing to do with the G4. A G5 or Pentium 4 would have the same problem. If you partition the drive, or install an ATA/133 or SATA card in those machines, you can get past that barrier. In fact, Hard Disk Speed Tools from Intech has a driver that allows those machines to get past the 132 GB barrier without upgrading to a newer drive bus.
     
yikes600
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Jan 30, 2005, 04:10 AM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
That's some pretty bad misinformation right there. Robertka has it right. I just want to add that Apple didn't add big drive support until the 2002 Quicksilver.
     
jamesl
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Jan 30, 2005, 03:32 PM
 
Hi

Is the drive in the mac mini likely to be considerably slower than my current ibook g3 latest edition?

I am concerned that software will runs low as a result of the smaller speed hard drive

Please let me knpw
     
megasad
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Jan 30, 2005, 04:18 PM
 
Originally posted by jamesl:
Hi

Is the drive in the mac mini likely to be considerably slower than my current ibook g3 latest edition?

I am concerned that software will runs low as a result of the smaller speed hard drive

Please let me knpw
The hard drive in the Mac mini will either be the same speed as that in the iBook, 4200rpm, or, if you're lucky, faster, at 5400rpm. I have both a 600MHz iBook and a 1.25GHz eMac, and I can assure you that the Mac mini will slaughter the G3 iBook.
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typoon
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Jan 30, 2005, 04:22 PM
 
Originally posted by yikes600:
That's some pretty bad misinformation right there. Robertka has it right. I just want to add that Apple didn't add big drive support until the 2002 Quicksilver.
Sorry, my Bad. I thought that it was because of the Bus of the G4's that it wasn't able to handle larger than 132 Gigs. I also knew that it was the older machines that couldn't handle more than that. didin't realizeit changed when we go to the Quicksilvers.


thanks for the correction everyone.
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Bugsi
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Jan 30, 2005, 10:37 PM
 
I dropped a 250 GB drive into my G4 800 MHz iMac and all of it is seen just fine. As others stated, the hard drive barrier is an ATA-66 barrier. ATA-100 with a firmware update, and all ATA-133 bus controllers do not have the 132 GB barrier.
     
DeathMan
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Jan 31, 2005, 03:08 AM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
Sorry, my Bad. I thought that it was because of the Bus of the G4's that it wasn't able to handle larger than 132 Gigs. I also knew that it was the older machines that couldn't handle more than that. didin't realizeit changed when we go to the Quicksilvers.


thanks for the correction everyone.
It has to do with the IDE controller on the older Macs. The newer ones were fitted with a better controller.
     
zappy
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Jan 31, 2005, 03:42 AM
 
Originally posted by DeathMan:
It has to do with the IDE controller on the older Macs. The newer ones were fitted with a better controller.
Where can I find out what IDE controller I have got and if it supports big hard disks? I have an old G4/400/AGP.
     
lobo_digitol
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Jan 31, 2005, 04:03 AM
 
Originally posted by typoon:
I'm also going to tell you that you are wrong. That is what Apple "supports" If you run into a problem because of RAM don't go crying to them but it WILL work. It's only the HD that has a hard limit. The G4 can ONLY support up to 132 Gig HD the G5 can do more.
( Last edited by lobo_digitol; Jan 31, 2005 at 04:12 AM. )
     
TalonDJ
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Jan 31, 2005, 03:30 PM
 
Originally posted by zappy:
Where can I find out what IDE controller I have got and if it supports big hard disks? I have an old G4/400/AGP.
You might try xlr8yourmac.com for information about your machine. I am not sure if they have it. I have G4 upgraded B&W G3 and I use a third part ATA100 card and it reads my 160gig drive just fine. Some models of B&W g3s had a drive corruption issue that forced me to add that card. The built-in Bus might not read the larger drive but an add-on card can.
     
bitjumper
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Feb 2, 2005, 01:30 AM
 
Recieved my Hitachi 7200 rpm HD today. Followed the installation as per the service guide posted here. Everything runs so much quicker - and I mean everything. Finder windows, Mail, and surprisingly even browsing. I still only have 512M of RAM (although 1M is on order).

The installation was more difficult that I thought it would be.

- Cracking open the case was nervracking. But all went okay, no damage.
- Removing things wasn't so bad.
- But when putting things together I had to do it actually three times:

. First, I didn't get the wireless and bluetooth antenna wires back under the circuit board right so the antennas wouldn't reach to their proper spot.
. Second, the power button cable got pinched by the time I noticed.
. Third, those metal flaps under the cover seemed to be bent a little so I couldn't
close the cover.

Everything ended up great.

It is running cool and quiet and I have no extra fan noise.

Erik
     
FeralCat
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Feb 2, 2005, 02:37 PM
 
Originally posted by megasad:
sayonaraML, listen not to what Superchicken tells you; it is very easy to do what you want to do.
Hrm. I think that he was asking whether he could just use the 17" CRT display from the eMac for a Mac mini display:

Originally posted by sayonaraML:
Hi:
I have an eMac and am wondering if it would be possible to boot from a mini (basiaclly just using the monitor of the eMac aling with the keyboard and peripherals). Doable? bad idea?
Emphasis added. So, I think that you missed the point: he wants to run the Mac mini processor/HD/RAM, etc., but the eMac as a display. So I think that Superchicken is right.

Is it doable? Probably. Is it a bad ideaŠ? Probably. I think that CRTs are cheap enough that you could find a used one somewhere locally for under $50. Heck, I just had a co-worker give me a 17" CRT for free that's capable of 1280x1024...
     
SmileyDude
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Feb 2, 2005, 10:34 PM
 
Originally posted by FeralCat:
Is it doable? Probably. Is it a bad ideaŠ? Probably. I think that CRTs are cheap enough that you could find a used one somewhere locally for under $50. Heck, I just had a co-worker give me a 17" CRT for free that's capable of 1280x1024...
I'll chime in on this one as well -- CRTs are cheap and almost free in most cases._ I lucked into finding a 17" Viewsonic CRT in my office building a month or two ago that someone had thrown out (I guess they upgraded to an LCD -- monitor is in perfect shape). Keep your eyes open, and you might find one (or two or three ).

Another good source is the Free section of craigslist. It really depends on if you're in an area that craigslist services, but if so, just camp out in the Free section and see what you can get.
dennis
     
   
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