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OreoCookie · Jul 14, 2014, 09:10 AM

What an excellent game, lots of chances on both sides. The first 45 minutes were just a piece of beauty, but in the second half, both teams lost their cohesion a bit (even though they were still fighting very hard). Even in the extension both teams went for the win rather than the penalties. And Götze's goal was just a piece of beauty.

Germany got a bit lucky that Höwedes didn't see red early on and Neuer didn't receive a card for his stunt. But overall, I think the result was well-deserved and Argentina was harder to beat than I had initially thought.

I was just irked by choosing Messi as the best player of the tournament: he was Argentina's key player in the group stage, no doubt, but neutralized in the second stage. Even in Argentina's own team, I think their crown jewel was their defense and not Messi.

Shaddim · Jul 14, 2014, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

And if Germany hadn't missed that header, they would've won earlier.

Or the two other shots they had. Argentina had another opportunity that went wide.

Saying that somebody "would've won" if they hadn't missed is...well.

The teams were well-matched, and it was a awesome game. Germany put a LOT of pressure on towards the end, though, and came through deservedly.

I said Argentina executed their defense to perfection, and if Messi hadn't missed what was essentially a penalty kick (Germany never had a try that was so open), this all would have been very different. That's just a fact.

OreoCookie · Jul 14, 2014, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

I said Argentina executed their defense to perfection, and if Messi hadn't missed what was essentially a penalty kick (Germany never had a try that was so open), this all would have been very different. That's just a fact.

Essentially a penalty kick? Looks more like twice the distance.

And the German defense isn't made up of manikins (Argentina had more corners but ended up with 0 shots on goals). I think Argentina had two much, much, much better chances than Messi's free kick (which ended up somewhere on third floor above the German goal) -- and if Argentina had converted one of them into a goal, we would have seen a very different game.

sek929 · Jul 14, 2014, 06:27 PM

I don't think Shaddim was referring to that free kick, Messi had a rare mis-step in the box earlier in the game IIRC.

Fun game to watch, lots of ebb and flow of possession on both sides of the ball. Gotze's one timer off the chest trap was beautiful. Thankfully the match did not go to PKs.

Spheric Harlot · Jul 14, 2014, 06:29 PM

I find it hard to believe that Shaddim would point to THAT scene as a missed opportunity.

The goal they made that was offsides was a real chance, and there were at least two direct shots at the goal that went wide, and a close save or two by Neuer.

OreoCookie · Jul 14, 2014, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

I don't think Shaddim was referring to that free kick, Messi had a rare mis-step in the box earlier in the game IIRC.

Maybe you're right. (Shaddim, please correct me if you meant a different free kick.) But in any case, I think Argentina's best two chances of the game had nothing to do with Messi. To me, Argentina's best player of the night was Mascherano, not Messi.

Originally Posted by sek929

Fun game to watch, lots of ebb and flow of possession on both sides of the ball. Gotze's one timer off the chest trap was beautiful. Thankfully the match did not go to PKs.

Couldn't agree more. I was close to a heart attack at a few points in the game (e. g. when the Argentina »scored« (the score on TV changed briefly) even though I saw that their players were offsides).

Shaddim · Jul 14, 2014, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

I don't think Shaddim was referring to that free kick, Messi had a rare mis-step in the box earlier in the game IIRC.

Yep, that's the one. It was extremely un-Messi-like, the whole match he looked lost.

turtle777 · Jul 14, 2014, 07:47 PM

I still don't understand how you think this was even remotely like a penalty kick.

The chances of scoring from that distance, with all the players on the field, were miniscule.

-t

Shaddim · Jul 14, 2014, 07:52 PM

BTW, I'm not saying Germany didn't deserve the win, they did. Hell, they were the best team in the World Cup, my point was, and is, that Argentina executed the perfect defense to stop them. Fatigue simply became too much of a factor.

Shaddim · Jul 14, 2014, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

I still don't understand how you think this was even remotely like a penalty kick.

The chances of scoring from that distance, with all the players on the field, were miniscule.

-t

turtle777 · Jul 14, 2014, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

BTW, I'm not saying Germany didn't deserve the win, they did. Hell, they were the best team in the World Cup, my point was, and is, that Argentina executed the perfect defense to stop them. Fatigue simply became too much of a factor.

I agree with that.

Their defense was strong.
But their strategy (scoring a goal on a quick counter attack) was never very likely.

I guess they knew that their chances of winning would never be as high as if they reached penalty kicks after OT.

-t

Spheric Harlot · Jul 14, 2014, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

I still don't understand how you think this was even remotely like a penalty kick.

The chances of scoring from that distance, with all the players on the field, were miniscule.

No: absolutely zero. A goalie like Neuer has WAY too much time to see it coming from that distance than to let it through.

OreoCookie · Jul 14, 2014, 08:22 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

I still don't understand how you think this was even remotely like a penalty kick.

The chances of scoring from that distance, with all the players on the field, were miniscule.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by turtle777

Their defense was strong.
But their strategy (scoring a goal on a quick counter attack) was never very likely.

Yup, but they spent the majority of their manpower there. Initially the Argentinian coach practically allocated 7~8 players in the defense (4-4-1-1, and they pulled the midfielders way back to plug up all the spaces). Eight. Don't get me wrong, it was the best strategy option for Argentina.

Originally Posted by Shaddim

[...] my point was, and is, that Argentina executed the perfect defense to stop them.

I wouldn't use the word perfect, for the Argentinian team this was the best strategy to stop them. Argentina had to use it because in the second stage of the tournament the Argentinian team lacked the firepower in the front (because Messi was effectively neutralized by the defenses of the better teams), and the strongest part of their team was their defense (that's how German scoccer worked for a while, quite successfully in fact).

ShortcutToMoncton · Jul 14, 2014, 09:01 PM

I think Messi deserved the Golden Ball as much as anyone else. He scored half his teams goals, assisted on another, created more chances for teammates than anyone else, and essentially did it all as a one-man attack show. With Di Maria down, every team rightfully keyed in on him and his "support" was anything but. Great performance.

The Final Dakar · Jul 15, 2014, 01:55 PM

FIFA is pissed that Rihanna touched the World Cup trophy? What a joke org.

mattyb · Jul 16, 2014, 05:34 AM

They're just jealous that she didn't touch their balls.

I'll get my coat.

Jawbone54 · Jul 16, 2014, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by Jawbone54

4. Who will win? My money is on Germany.

Ahem...

mattyb · Jul 16, 2014, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by Jawbone54

Ahem...

Jawbone54 · Jul 16, 2014, 05:01 PM

That's all I ever wanted.

ajprice · Jul 17, 2014, 07:52 AM

So, Germany win the World Cup. This weekend is the German Grand Prix, Nico Rosberg is a German driver in a German team, and had a special paint job on his helmet ready to go. Yay Germany.

FIFA see this, and aren't happy. Nico must change his helmet, an image of the World Cup is 'intellectual property' and can't be used by a German driver celebrating Germany winning the World Cup, no sir!

BBC Sport - Nico Rosberg: World Cup helmet to be changed after Fifa objection

FIFA may just be a bigger bunch of muppets than the FIA.

Doc HM · Jul 17, 2014, 08:04 AM

One multi billion $ sport has hissy for at secondilti billion dollar sport. Common sense suspended. More news at 11.

ajprice · Jul 17, 2014, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by Doc HM

One multi billion $ sport has hissy for at secondilti billion dollar sport. Common sense suspended. More news at 11.

True. Here's the new design

The Final Dakar · Jul 17, 2014, 08:42 AM

How dare one sport give another sport free publicity! (Not to mention respect)

Waragainstsleep · Jul 17, 2014, 08:51 AM

I really ****ing hate FIFA.

OreoCookie · Jul 17, 2014, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

I really ****ing hate FIFA.

They're nobody's darling these days: the organization is highly corrupt (e. g. giving the world cup to Russia in 2018 and Qatar (?!?!) in 2022). Them complaining about free publicity is the least of their problems. FIFA is lucky that soccer is the most popular sport on the planet.

turtle777 · Jul 17, 2014, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by OreoCookie

FIFA is lucky that soccer is the most popular sport on the planet.

I'm sure that's the only reason why they got to where they are.
It's not that they just "got" lucky. A highly successful sport, with billions of dollars involved, breeds corruption.

-t

Waragainstsleep · Jul 17, 2014, 01:58 PM

A few years back the top teams in Europe kept threatening to break away from their current domestic leagues and form their own european super league and I hated the idea. While I'd prefer the leagues to keep their current members as they are, I think the clubs would be wise to just form new governing bodies and do away with FIFA and UEFA altogether.
I'd love to know what that "non-profit organisation" does with the licensing money it charges EA Sports to make the ludicrously popular console game each year. I'd wager it would more than cover their operating costs by itself and thats before the membership and registration fees they undoubtedly charge everyone for the privilege of giving up a chunk of their IP to that scumbag Blatter and his cronies.