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Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 10:36 AM

Main office machine...

Thursday, last week, through to today.
1) Back up 3 Tb of data to a really slow LaCie RAID network thingy.
2) Install 8 Tb of drives.
3) Install 10.5.8
4) Recover 3 Tb of data from really slow LaCie RAID network thingy.
5) Reconfigure everything.
6) Play around with new 10.5 only apps. Discover that they're largely crap and designed for people with learning difficulties.
7) Discover that File Buddy and Spotlight don't work in 10.5
8 ) Find 10.4 disc and pop it in the drive. Wipe and install.
9) Recover 3 Tb of data from really slow LaCie RAID network thingy.
10) Reconfigure everything.

Hey, Apple, make a proper f'ing operating system in which everything works instead of arsing about with mobile devices.

turtle777 · Apr 30, 2010, 10:40 AM

Wait. You just upgraded from 10.4 to 10.5 ?

Welcome to 2007.

re: FileBuddy - wow, didn't realize it didn't run in 10.5. I guess I haven't used it in 3 years. *shrug*

-t

SpaceMonkey · Apr 30, 2010, 10:44 AM

Sounds like you should have played around with 10.5 before you did all of that.

turtle777 · Apr 30, 2010, 10:47 AM

Btw, what do you mean with "Spotlight" didn't work ?

Maybe you would have to re-create the Spotlight database.

For me, Spotlight works much better in 10.6 than it ever worked in 10.4

-t

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by turtle777

Wait. You just upgraded from 10.4 to 10.5 ?

No, that was last week.
This week I just downgraded from 10.5 to 10.4.

I've spent much time over the last few months laughing at peeps who've upgraded to 10.6 and Logic 9 and now seem to spend most of their time arguing with their computers instead of making money.
Production systems = no upgrade unless absolutely required. As this week's experiment has demonstrated.

turtle777 · Apr 30, 2010, 10:51 AM

OIC.

-t

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey

Sounds like you should have played around with 10.5 before you did all of that.

I've got three machines running 10.5 but they're task dedicated and didn't seem to have problems. Of course, I hadn't used Spotlight or File Buddy on them since neither of them carry the same amount of files or chaos that the office machine does.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by turtle777

Btw, what do you mean with "Spotlight" didn't work ?

Maybe you would have to re-create the Spotlight database.

For me, Spotlight works much better in 10.6 than it ever worked in 10.4

Two things really:
1) When you grab a "show all files" 10.5 lumps everything together in a Finder search-like window. If I wanted a Finder search window, I'd do a search from Finder, not Spotlight.
2) It searches in Safari caches, even when you've got it set not to.

Of course, the difference between it working for you and not working for me may be that you might not have a couple of million files in 3 Tb sitting on yer machine.

I noticed other problems too. Drop a bunch of files into a folder then do a get info on it. Still shows the folder state before you dropped the files into it (i.e. empty or with the already existing files counted).
Plus, File Buddy not working was a deal breaker. I use "find duplicates" all the time.

The main question is, though, are Apple (and tech companies in general) going for the low hanging fruit? i.e. "they're only going to post pics to Facebook using this machine so we don't need to test it that much".
Same's happening in the music biz - most modern gear is a joke, designed for bedroom musos.

Spheric Harlot · Apr 30, 2010, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by Doofy

Logic 9

Working *much* better than Logic 8 here.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

Working *much* better than Logic 8 here.

On 10.6, on a Mac Pro, with MotU drivers and a copy of Guitar Rig 4?

Spheric Harlot · Apr 30, 2010, 11:43 AM

On 10.6 on a three-and-a-half-year-old MacBook.

I avoid MotU hardware and don't use Guitar Rig.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

I avoid MotU hardware and don't use Guitar Rig.

Well, there you go then.

(I don't use Guitar Rig either. I still have a thing for the smell of real valves.)

ghporter · Apr 30, 2010, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Doofy

Production systems = no upgrade unless absolutely required. As this week's experiment has demonstrated.

The more effective way to do this is, instead of "no upgrade," to "upgrade only after exhaustive testing of 'anticipated improvements in new software and OS features' shows they're worth the effort. That would mean a separate machine similar to the production machine, and extra work by someone who knows what he/she is doing, but it would allow you to know before you even bother with the "really slow LaCie RAID network thingy..." Sorry you had such a "wonderful" time with this stuff, Doofy.

Apr 30, 2010, 03:08 PM

So, let me get this straight. You didn't test that your third party app worked on 10.5, and this is Apple's fault?

As for Spotlight, it works better in 10.5 than 10.4 - just recreate your indexes and be done with it.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by hayesk

So, let me get this straight. You didn't test that your third party app worked on 10.5, and this is Apple's fault?

Yes. If they didn't change their minds on file metadata storage every five minutes and paid a little attention to backwards compatibility, there wouldn't be a problem.

Originally Posted by hayesk

As for Spotlight, it works better in 10.5 than 10.4 - just recreate your indexes and be done with it.

So, it's so good that I need to recreate my indexes a day after it's created then on a fresh install?

It's shit. Period.

voodoo · Apr 30, 2010, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by hayesk

So, let me get this straight. You didn't test that your third party app worked on 10.5, and this is Apple's fault?

As for Spotlight, it works better in 10.5 than 10.4 - just recreate your indexes and be done with it.

An overview of File Buddy 9

They claim FileBuddy works in everything above 10.3.9 -- but maybe they are just being dishonest

Anyway Doofy, the OS itself isn't so bad but I'm not into tech-porn (i.e. looking under the hood), but yes there are so many UI oddities and ****ups that I just don't understand what Apple is doing about the Finder, the UI, the utillity of the OS from the perspective of a casual user who has to interact with the actual file system, etc.

boy8cookie · Apr 30, 2010, 03:41 PM

10.6/10.5 spotlight is much faster than 10.4 spotlight, but only after everything is properly indexed (coming from someone who's searching through 16TB of video files).

The Final Dakar · Apr 30, 2010, 03:44 PM

That's a lot of porn!

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by voodoo

An overview of File Buddy 9

They claim FileBuddy works in everything above 10.3.9 -- but maybe they are just being dishonest

Yeah, they are. The developer's gone AWOL for a year or two now.

boy8cookie · Apr 30, 2010, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar

That's a lot of porn!

a butt-load.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by boy8cookie

10.6/10.5 spotlight is much faster than 10.4 spotlight, but only after everything is properly indexed (coming from someone who's searching through 16TB of video files).

Those are some very small video files if there's two million of them.

reader50 · Apr 30, 2010, 06:27 PM

I use DupScan to find duplicates, and EasyFind for serious searching. Spotlight lacks too many controls, like adding folders or file types. So it fails to find items or contents when they're right in front of you.

boy8cookie · Apr 30, 2010, 06:27 PM

There's not 2 million, but I still see a large difference in search times. Seems like that difference would only be multiplied with additional files.

Doofy · Apr 30, 2010, 07:14 PM

Originally Posted by boy8cookie

There's not 2 million, but I still see a large difference in search times. Seems like that difference would only be multiplied with additional files.

It's only about 30 seconds per search.
But speed isn't an issue. It's the way the results are presented which is the issue.

Again, it's Apple being all fatherly and trying to make you do things in whatever way they deem fashionable this week.

ghporter · Apr 30, 2010, 09:28 PM

I agree with reader50-Spotlight is good for quick and dirty searches, but it's just not flexible enough, nor smart enough, to do anything really complex. And it'll provide every stinkin' email you ever sent or received that has anything close to your search term, without providing the one PDF or DOC that you're actually looking for.

imitchellg5 · Apr 30, 2010, 09:47 PM

It's much better than Windows Search though... I love that I can search for a broad term in Windows and get a couple results, but search for a specific app and get no result...

AKcrab · Apr 30, 2010, 11:58 PM

Spotlight finds what I need, every time. I suppose I'm pretty much "average user".

mattyb · May 1, 2010, 04:07 AM

I guess that its just my very high level of intelligence, but I've never needed to use Spotlight. Doesn't ORGANISING your files help?

Joking aside, I have/use Quicksilver, but I'm not sure if its as good with TB of files as it is with my 400GB.

TETENAL · May 1, 2010, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by ghporter

And it'll provide every stinkin' email you ever sent or received that has anything close to your search term, without providing the one PDF or DOC that you're actually looking for.

If you don't want e-mails in the search results, just turn them off in the Spotlight preferences.

ghporter · May 1, 2010, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by TETENAL

If you don't want e-mails in the search results, just turn them off in the Spotlight preferences.

Well yeah...when I remember. Which is seldom, unfortunately, because sometimes I DO want to search in emails. And the Spotlight prefs for mail are for Mail, not Entourage... In fact I just now found the stupid preference setting-IN Entourage-to turn that off. Thanks for spurring me to action.

Now that I've made that change, how do I tell Spotlight to clear its cache so I won't see those emails anymore?