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Nokia+Windows Phone7
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Paco500
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Feb 10, 2011, 04:51 PM
 
Will be announced tomorrow. I'm not sure Nokia has better options, but I don't see it helping them stop the bleeding. There hardware is pretty good, but they've got zero mojo.

Thoughts?
     
turtle777
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Feb 10, 2011, 04:56 PM
 
LOL, it's been tried over and over again: Loser + Loser = Big Winner ?

Sony Ericsson anyone (Do they still make phones) ?

-t
     
ort888
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Feb 10, 2011, 05:00 PM
 
Who was it that just said...

"two turkeys does not equal an eagle"

It was one of those Google guys. It was kinda funny... Although I do think that Windows Phone 7 has some potential to be a player. Maybe.

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Spheric Harlot
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Feb 10, 2011, 05:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
LOL, it's been tried over and over again: Loser + Loser = Big Winner ?

Sony Ericsson anyone (Do they still make phones) ?
Weren't Sony Ericsson hugely successful at least in the Euro market in the last couple years before smartphones happened?
     
-Q-
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Feb 10, 2011, 05:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Sony Ericsson anyone (Do they still make phones) ?
Yes. YouTube - sonyericsson's Channel

Whether or not it will be a success is another matter entirely. They made money last year, but sales and units shipped were way down.

Sony Ericsson Q4 2010: Less sales, less devices, more profit
     
Salty
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Feb 10, 2011, 11:38 PM
 
Sadly it still doesn't combine all my least favourite cellphone companies together. (They'd need to somehow partner with LG)

Nokia's software has been garbage for a long time, I'm glad to see they're acknowledging it. That said going to Windows phone isn't going to really help them. They're still going to be just a manufacturer unless Microsoft is letting them significantly alter the OS. I mean yes in some ways they'll probably make the best hardware. (Assuming they stop putting in processors that are half the speed of the competition) But at that point you're just the best hardware for a weird OS that has very little consumer interest.

I'd almost say Nokia would be good to go with Android but instead of trying to skin it simply putting out EXACTLY what Google gives as a reference and just tack on some optional apps and services that will only work with Nokia phones. But really Nokia's a dead company walking.
     
P
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Feb 11, 2011, 06:07 AM
 
Big win for Microsoft. Not really a loss for Nokia, other than acknowledging that they're in trouble - something anyone with an interest in smartphones already knew.

Nokia's problem is execution. They've had all the good ideas, but haven't managed to execute. Their services strategy was a disaster, and the reorg after Ollila left as well. What they need to do is get back to making good hardware and put focused software on it. Since they currently cannot make software, maybe selecting a platform that they can't modify is a good thing.
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Spheric Harlot
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Feb 11, 2011, 06:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
Big win for Microsoft. Not really a loss for Nokia, other than acknowledging that they're in trouble - something anyone with an interest in smartphones already knew.

Nokia's problem is execution. They've had all the good ideas, but haven't managed to execute. Their services strategy was a disaster, and the reorg after Ollila left as well. What they need to do is get back to making good hardware and put focused software on it. Since they currently cannot make software, maybe selecting a platform that they can't modify is a good thing.
I keep reading that it's an "execution" problem.

I think it's a lot more fundamental than that.

They have brilliant ideas for functions, and they implement them so that they work, and on nice hardware, too.

But they completely fail to realize that a good product is not at all just a collection of clever features.

That's why they're a perfect fit for Microsoft: Check-list development and marketing, but no ****ing clue how normal people actually work. (Though WP7 actually looks like MS took a hint.)

We'll see how it works out.

I'm skeptical, though, because even if Windows Phone 7 turns out a good platform, there's no reason to believe that Nokia would be the first business partner in history that didn't get completely ****ed over by Microsoft eventually.
     
P
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Feb 11, 2011, 09:09 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
I'm skeptical, though, because even if Windows Phone 7 turns out a good platform, there's no reason to believe that Nokia would be the first business partner in history that didn't get completely ****ed over by Microsoft eventually.
True, but then Nokia did some good ****ing over of their partners in Symbian, so they're due for a reaming.
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turtle777
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Feb 11, 2011, 09:24 AM
 
Maybe so. As a customer, I'd rather stay safe and out of this.

-t
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 11, 2011, 11:25 AM
 
Huge opportunity for Microsoft here, and a good opportunity for Nokia. From what little data is available of Windows Phone 7 sales, it does seem to be catching on in Europe more quickly than Android. While I don't think Windows Phone 7 will automatically save Nokia, one thing is for certain: Symbian could have killed Nokia.
     
Paco500  (op)
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Feb 11, 2011, 12:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Huge opportunity for Microsoft here, and a good opportunity for Nokia. From what little data is available of Windows Phone 7 sales, it does seem to be catching on in Europe more quickly than Android. While I don't think Windows Phone 7 will automatically save Nokia, one thing is for certain: Symbian could have killed Nokia.
I've not seen any sales figures or estimates that show your interpretation- where are you getting your data?

I think it could be a good thing for Microsoft, it will give them some legitimacy, but I don't see it helping Nokia much. I doubt Windows Phone 7 will ever approach Symbian's current market share, much less at it's height, and Nokia will have a much smaller piece of the pie.

I don't think anything will save Nokia. They will likely keep losing sales and market share until they eventually get bought out.

The scenario reminds me of other former giants trying to make a last gasp by tying their future to a commodity platform. SGI moving to WinNT. Sun embracing x86 and open-source. Palm releasing WinMob phones.

None of those companies could make a go of it and they were all moving to platforms or technologies with actual market share. Nokia is betting it's fortune on getting a part of a relatively tiny market.

I don't think it will even delay their death, just change the last few lines of the obituary.
     
Doc HM
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Feb 11, 2011, 02:12 PM
 
Nice share price reaction there Nokia. 10 year low?
This space for Hire! Reasonable rates. Reach an audience of literally dozens!
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 11, 2011, 02:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by Paco500 View Post
I've not seen any sales figures or estimates that show your interpretation- where are you getting your data?
HTC tweeted at the European launch of Windows Phone 7 (which was before the US release) that they had greater sales over the first two months with their WP7 sales than they had with the release of the original legend. I have no idea how it's doing in the longer term obviously, but it seems like there are at least some people in Europe who were looking forward to it, which may mean that Nokia will be able to get some forward momentum going again.
     
ctt1wbw
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Feb 11, 2011, 02:36 PM
 
I'm not sure it matters one way the other. Nokia sat too long on its ass and enjoyed being number one in global sales. Now look at the crap that they're churning out... Unless they start making phones that people want, they could put Windows Phone 7 or the iOS on there and I'm not sure it would matter.
     
exca1ibur
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Feb 11, 2011, 02:43 PM
 
     
lpkmckenna
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Feb 11, 2011, 06:37 PM
 
This is an act of desperation by Nokia. They probably didn't go with Android because Microsoft stuffed their mouths with gold.
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 11, 2011, 06:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by lpkmckenna View Post
This is an act of desperation by Nokia. They probably didn't go with Android because Microsoft stuffed their mouths with gold.
Wait what? Android is free, they pay licensing to Microsoft.

OTOH, their first concept phone looks stunning: Link
     
lpkmckenna
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Feb 11, 2011, 07:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Wait what? Android is free, they pay licensing to Microsoft.
I assume you mean "isn't free."

A quick Google tells me that only HTC has agreed to pay licensing fees to MS. Just because HTC agreed to roll over doesn't mean squat. Motorola is contesting this in court. Just because MS says something doesn't make it true.
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 11, 2011, 07:47 PM
 
Why are Motorola contesting it? Motorola don't have a Windows Phone 7 device.
     
lpkmckenna
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Feb 11, 2011, 08:18 PM
 
Oh! I thought you were trying to say something I've heard many times on the 'net: Android isn't really free, because phone manufacturers must pay licence fee to MS since Android contains patented MS technology. (MS demanded patent fees from HTC and Motorola for their Android phones. HTC paid, Motorola said "sue us.")

But you weren't saying that. Ok then, sorry.

When I say MS "stuffed their mouths with gold," I mean MS probably offered a really good licensing deal to Nokia, revenue sharing from Bing, etc.

It isn't surprising the new Nokia CEO switched to Microsoft. He worked there as recently as September of last year. He's a fully-programmed mole.
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 11, 2011, 08:38 PM
 
No big deal. I think we were both confused.

I'm sure they offered some sort of good deal to Nokia. It would have been just as easy for Nokia to have gone with Android at this point (and most current Nokia phones are capable of running Android 2.3 if you're brave enough), so I have no doubt that ever since Elop came to Microsoft that this has been a deal in motion. Perhaps Nokia even had their eye on Windows Phone 7 from the start and had been courting Elop. We may never know.
     
Hawkeye_a
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Feb 11, 2011, 10:14 PM
 
Nokia + WiMP.... a formidable force IMHO. Partnering with the largest mobile handset manufacturer in the world.... i definitely didn't see that coming.
     
freudling
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Feb 12, 2011, 12:50 AM
 
This will work. Looking forward to the innovation from these guys. I agree with Nokia. MeeGo just wasn't enough of a departure from Symbian/Android. Same thing basically repurposed. Windows Phone 7 is for realz... good move.
     
imitchellg5
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Feb 12, 2011, 12:56 AM
 
Actually it seems that Nokia will continue working on MeeGo. Well, assuming enough people are there to actually work on it.
     
Spheric Harlot
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Feb 12, 2011, 05:39 AM
 
Apple Outsider � Microsoft Buys Nokia for $0B

So in the span of one year, we have Microsoft failing to acquire Nokia, “losing” a top executive, and now having one of the most recognizable mobile hardware vendors in the world under its thumb. There’s no question in my mind that the next generation of flagship Windows Phones will come from Nokia, and for that, Microsoft will have unprecedented influence over the hardware that runs its software. We like to think of Steve Ballmer throwing chairs when his executives leave. I think this time he told Elop, “Fine. Go get me some hardware I can own.” Elop did.

But what will they do with it? Microsoft has had some success in hardware, notably in its Xbox division—but not so much in making it profitable. Nokia’s problems, according to Elop, are with focus and execution—two things I wouldn’t say Microsoft is known for. (The length of Elop’s memo is an irony in and of itself, to that end.) All in all, this was one of very few choices Nokia could have made; it’s certainly better than staying the course, which is what I feared we would hear today. For Microsoft, though, it’s huge.

I have absolutely no qualms about calling this new regime at Nokia a puppet government. This is far and away the most brilliant move of Ballmer’s tenure. Whether it pays off is another question entirely.

[UPDATE: Former Microsoft exec Chris Weber has just been named President of Nokia Inc. (US). This is a coup, folks.]
     
turtle777
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Feb 12, 2011, 02:29 PM
 
Pwned.

-t
     
Salty
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Feb 13, 2011, 01:48 AM
 
I think it'll mean a lot more copies of WP7 getting sold but a lot fewer Nokia devices.
     
Lateralus
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Feb 13, 2011, 07:28 AM
 
This will only weaken Nokia further, but it will without a doubt turn WP7 into a contender. And I'm quite happy with that. To me, WP7 is the most interesting of the smart phone OSes and to have had to watch it wither and die would have sucked.
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lpkmckenna
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Feb 13, 2011, 04:03 PM
 
     
Brien
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Feb 13, 2011, 04:36 PM
 
Well there you go.
     
Langdon
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Feb 14, 2011, 09:20 PM
 
     
   
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