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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > macOS > WinTel vs. VPC in Dual G4's.

WinTel vs. VPC in Dual G4's.
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Metzen
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Dec 14, 2001, 10:29 PM
 
Ok, the official word by Connectix is simply:

Dual Processors don't work with VPC. No matter how hard you try.

BUT! Wintel on the other hand has this to say:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1"face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial">code:</font><HR><pre><font size=1 face=courier>
"The OpenOSX CD installs separate disk images
with FreeDos, Linux, DLX Linux, NetBSD and
OpenBSD pre-installed. The user may install
Pentium/x86-based operating systems of their
choice. OpenOSX has tested Windows <font color = blue>95</font>, and
are preparing instructions for installing
Windows <font color = blue>98</font> and Windows NT <font color = blue>4.0</font>.

Thanks to Mac OS X's advanced
architecture, multiple G4 CPUs are utilized
and are emulated as a single powerful
Pentium(R) processor.
Mac OS X is a true
chameleon of operating systems, users may now
run a long list of operating systems within
it: Mac OS <font color = blue>9</font>, Windows <font color = blue>95</font>, <font color = blue>98</font>/NT, DOS, Linux,
Unix, BSD, etc. software seamlessly."
</font>[/code]

Anyone out there care to make a guess how WinTel can pull off using dual proc's (still unproven though) and whether or not it is faster/more effiecent then VPC?

If anyone with a dual G4 can try this out and get back to us, that'd be great.

[edited for formatting]

[ 12-14-2001: Message edited by: Metzen ]
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juanvaldes
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Dec 14, 2001, 10:39 PM
 
If I could get my hands on it I might...if I do I will let people know.
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- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
     
dtriska
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Dec 14, 2001, 11:11 PM
 
Originally posted by Metzen:
<STRONG>Ok, the official word by Connectix is simply:

Dual Processors don't work with VPC. No matter how hard you try.</STRONG>
Have a look at the right side of this page, under "New Features for Enhanced Usability & Compatibility."
     
Metzen  (op)
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Dec 14, 2001, 11:43 PM
 
Originally posted by dtriska:
<STRONG>

Have a look at the right side of this page, under "New Features for Enhanced Usability & Compatibility."</STRONG>
Sorry, I guess my original comment was a bit misleading. VPC does not support using dual processors to increase emulated processor speed, not through emulating 2 procs or emulating 1.

For some reason alot of people haven't seen the speed increase 5.0 makes with it's "dual" proc support.
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction.
E. F. Schumacher
     
CharlesS
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Dec 14, 2001, 11:57 PM
 
Originally posted by juanvaldes:
<STRONG>If I could get my hands on it I might...if I do I will let people know.</STRONG>
You can download it here. It's open source.
http://bochs.sourceforge.net/

Don't buy the WinTel thing, that's just OpenOSX repackaging open source software and then selling it for money again. Why pay extra when you don't have to?

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
Metzen  (op)
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Dec 15, 2001, 12:02 AM
 
Originally posted by CharlesS:
<STRONG>

You can download it here. It's open source.
http://bochs.sourceforge.net/

Don't buy the WinTel thing, that's just OpenOSX repackaging open source software and then selling it for money again. Why pay extra when you don't have to?</STRONG>
Technically, you could say the same thing about any Linux operating system as well.
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction.
E. F. Schumacher
     
dtriska
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Dec 15, 2001, 12:46 AM
 
Originally posted by Metzen:
<STRONG>VPC does not support using dual processors to increase emulated processor speed, not through emulating 2 procs or emulating 1.</STRONG>
Huh?
     
Metzen  (op)
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Dec 15, 2001, 01:59 PM
 
Originally posted by dtriska:
<STRONG>

Huh?</STRONG>
VPC uses (in version 5.0) one (G4) processor to do actual (Intel) emulation and the other is exclusively for updating the screen.

Nevermind. I just found out everything I wanted to know from http://www.xlr8yourmac.com
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction.
E. F. Schumacher
     
juanvaldes
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Dec 15, 2001, 05:12 PM
 
Originally posted by CharlesS:
<STRONG>

You can download it here. It's open source.
http://bochs.sourceforge.net/

Don't buy the WinTel thing, that's just OpenOSX repackaging open source software and then selling it for money again. Why pay extra when you don't have to?</STRONG>
I knew it was somewhere, could anyone give me a hand in compiling this app?
The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it always to be kept alive.
- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
     
ducasi
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Dec 15, 2001, 08:10 PM
 
Hi,

I downloaded bochs, compiled it up, and got it working!

I must say I'm underwhelmed... Don't go looking here for a replacement for VPC. It's slow and has very limited hardware support. It is single-threaded and so does not take advantage of dual CPUs, while it takes 100% of whichever CPU it is running on.

Checking out OpenOSX's Wintel product, they have taken bochs and at least turned it into something that can be used easily on a Mac. It appears to have a Mac interface to configure it, and they have added cdrom support. They do claim their version takes advantage of multiple CPUs, but I'm not sure how, considering that if it were easy to add threading the bochs authors would probably have done it by now themselves.

One thing I am concerned about is that bochs is licenced under the GPL, which means any enhancements OpenOSX have made should also be under the GPL, and thus freely available.

Their web site does not appear to have anywhere you can download their enhanced version of bochs, and seem to imply that their enhancements are covered by a separate licence.

I'm not an lawyer, but I wonder if they are breaking the terms of the GPL. I trust not. If you buy their CD and it comes with all the source, and their modifications are GPL-licenced, it should be OK, and you could even give away their changes too!

They claim the CD is licenced under the GPL and the "OpenOSX WinTel License", but no details of this second licence are given. They make out t be supporting open source software, but is the stuff they write themselves open source? Who knows?

Based on other people's stated views on OpenOSX (e.g. the Fink project, or MacGimp), I'd avoid them.

Hopefully other people will come forward and enhance bochs for all Mac OS X users.

Cheers!
     
curmi
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Dec 15, 2001, 08:47 PM
 
Originally posted by ducasi:
<STRONG>Hi,

I downloaded bochs, compiled it up, and got it working!</STRONG>
Isn't Bochs an X-Window application, not an Aqua application? So you need to be running an X-server as well.

If so, WinTel is not going to be competition for VPC.

[ 12-15-2001: Message edited by: curmi ]
     
ducasi
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Dec 16, 2001, 05:55 AM
 
Originally posted by curmi:
<STRONG>

Isn't Bochs an X-Window application, not an Aqua application? So you need to be running an X-server as well.

If so, WinTel is not going to be competition for VPC.

[ 12-15-2001: Message edited by: curmi ]</STRONG>
Bochs can run on lots of platforms. It has an X Windows System front end, but it also has a Win32 front-end, a Mac OS front end, and even a Mac OS X front end.

Guess which one I was using!
     
   
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