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rm199 · May 15, 2006, 04:35 PM

iTunes finally has some competition (it has been fairly stagnant for a while now) - just using WM11 player in parallels and I really like it. Sure the 'gloss' look is cheezy but the album art viewing is a great way to handle a library IMO.

The best bit? Apple will not let WM11 get a leg up for long...

voodoo · May 15, 2006, 04:55 PM

WiMP is an app I hate with feeling. Version 11 no exception. iTunes can be improved a lot but damn compared to the WiMP option it is far superior as a music player. iTunes could be a lot better video player but at least it doesn't make me angry like WiMP.

V

kmkkid · May 15, 2006, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by voodoo

WiMP is an app I hate with feeling. Version 11 no exception. iTunes can be improved a lot but damn compared to the WiMP option it is far superior as a music player. iTunes could be a lot better video player but at least it doesn't make me angry like WiMP.

V

Getting angry at software suggests you may have more than a problem with WMP

Horsepoo!!! · May 15, 2006, 06:49 PM

iTunes needs a complete overhaul.

If Apple doesn't do something with iTunes in the next couple years, they'll lose this media race.

Thinine · May 15, 2006, 07:02 PM

They just need to realize that iTunes shouldn't be the be-all end-all of media applications. Move it back to music only, and launch another program for video. Granted, they'll be integrated pretty tightly, but that's better than the cluster **** WMP has become. Either this, or move iTunes more towards an overarching media application (starting with a new name). Of course, you have to realize that QuickTime plays into this whole situation pretty heavily, which makes for bigger problems than just the interface.

sushiism · May 15, 2006, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by kmkkid

Getting angry at software suggests you may have more than a problem with WMP

So you wouldn't get angry if your toaster burnt your breakfast 5 times out of 8 because it had such a badly conceived interface.

Horsepoo!!! · May 15, 2006, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by Thinine

They just need to realize that iTunes shouldn't be the be-all end-all of media applications. Move it back to music only, and launch another program for video. Granted, they'll be integrated pretty tightly, but that's better than the cluster **** WMP has become. Either this, or move iTunes more towards an overarching media application (starting with a new name). Of course, you have to realize that QuickTime plays into this whole situation pretty heavily, which makes for bigger problems than just the interface.

That's exactly it. iTunes either needs a huge overhaul to better integrate it's new features (video playback, podcasting, etc.)...right it now it's an interface geared for music with video and podcasting glued to it.

Or, as you said, move iTunes back where it belongs: music. And create a new app or two for podcasting and video.

My worst fear is that Apple wants iTunes for Windows to be exactly the same as the Mac version...this means iTunes will never use CoreAudio features, CoreImage/CoreVideo features (album cover browsing and visualizer effects), Spotlight and other OS features that would fit iTunes perfectly. Kinda sad.

The more Apple waits for an overhaul, the more likely they'll just stick with the old code (kinda like Adobe and Photoshop.) iTunes is starting to feel like the least interesting 1st party app on OS X.

ghporter · May 15, 2006, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by sushiism

So you wouldn't get angry if your toaster burnt your breakfast 5 times out of 8 because it had such a badly conceived interface.

The second time it did so without a good reason (my own setting problems, the bread getting stuck, etc.) that toaster would be history. No doubt about it. And if I didn't like the interface to start with, I wouldn't buy the thing.

WMP has a (very limited) place and role. iTunes has a (very expansive and helpful) place and role as well. The issues I have with iTunes are very minor when compared to all that's wrong with WMP. For a non-iTunes, Windows song manager, ripper, and CD burner, I use MusicMatch.

kmkkid · May 15, 2006, 09:05 PM

Originally Posted by sushiism

So you wouldn't get angry if your toaster burnt your breakfast 5 times out of 8 because it had such a badly conceived interface.

The two cannot even be compared in this way. oi.

- - e r i k - - · May 15, 2006, 11:11 PM

I have no problem with iTunes handling of Video and Podcasts other than that I have to create smart playlists to make them play in sequence or shuffled.

Thinine · May 15, 2006, 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!!

That's exactly it. iTunes either needs a huge overhaul to better integrate it's new features (video playback, podcasting, etc.)...right it now it's an interface geared for music with video and podcasting glued to it.

Or, as you said, move iTunes back where it belongs: music. And create a new app or two for podcasting and video.

My worst fear is that Apple wants iTunes for Windows to be exactly the same as the Mac version...this means iTunes will never use CoreAudio features, CoreImage/CoreVideo features (album cover browsing and visualizer effects), Spotlight and other OS features that would fit iTunes perfectly. Kinda sad.

The more Apple waits for an overhaul, the more likely they'll just stick with the old code (kinda like Adobe and Photoshop.) iTunes is starting to feel like the least interesting 1st party app on OS X.

I agree with most of this. iTunes (like QuickTime) needs to be separated into cross platform and platform specific code. Basically the only code that needs to be cross platform is the ID3 tag parser and the iTMS renderer. All of the UI code could be platform specific. I'd especially like to see iTunes use CoreData for it's database storage. Frankly, the Windows version can keep the existing code, the Mac version would just have to be able to read and export it.

Aside from those points, I'd also like to see iTunes' plugin SDK get a major overhaul. There should be two types of plugins, the cross platform ones, and the Mac specific ones (like the one that uses Quartz Composer). The current SDK is pretty old and nasty (I don't think it's changed much since the first version, which inherited from whichever player it was based on that I can't remember).

willed · May 16, 2006, 05:50 AM

The thing is, Apple is never going to make it so that when you plug your iPod in, two seperate apps (or 3 if you want one for podcasting too) start up and all start syncing with the iPod.
Perhaps they should have stuck with the iSync idea - all your syncing in one place. Then they would be able to have as many different media apps as they wanted which could all sync with only that one app running.

voodoo · May 16, 2006, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by kmkkid

Getting angry at software suggests you may have more than a problem with WMP

Yes, not only to I have a problem with WiMP - I have an issue with it as well

Back to the ground: I think it has horrible horrible interface and I don't like the Windows Media format. mp3, mp4 are fine but wma or wmv, no thanks. A matter of taste perhaps, but yeah. I really don't like WiMP.

V

sushiism · May 16, 2006, 10:59 AM

I love how the windows vista / wmp11 promo site doesn't work in safari. How can you win me back if you don't let me view your site MS?

Severed Hand of Skywalker · May 16, 2006, 11:04 AM

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!!

iTunes needs a complete overhaul.

If Apple doesn't do something with iTunes in the next couple years, they'll lose this media race.

I agree with you. It looks like an OS9 App. The text on the left is to small and all around it just LOOKS boring.

Apple should really use that front row look where it has a black background and has the album covers with automatic reflections.

You can then browse your music as if you were flipping though your CDs.

voodoo · May 16, 2006, 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

You can then browse your music as if you were flipping though your CDs.

Agreed. iTunes should have something like Coverflow. Make some use of the album covers.

http://www.steelskies.com/coverflow/

V

TETENAL · May 16, 2006, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

The text on the left is to small.

iTunes→Preferences→General

Severed Hand of Skywalker · May 16, 2006, 01:01 PM

Originally Posted by TETENAL

iTunes→Preferences→General

I know that but either way it comes off as blending in and unimportant.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · May 16, 2006, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by voodoo

Agreed. iTunes should have something like Coverflow. Make some use of the album covers.

http://www.steelskies.com/coverflow/

V

Well the look is the right idea but browsing your music like that is a pain in the ass.

Apfhex · May 16, 2006, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by willed

The thing is, Apple is never going to make it so that when you plug your iPod in, two seperate apps (or 3 if you want one for podcasting too) start up and all start syncing with the iPod.
Perhaps they should have stuck with the iSync idea - all your syncing in one place. Then they would be able to have as many different media apps as they wanted which could all sync with only that one app running.

Perhaps iSync could be accessed from within these apps, much like how address book can be accessed from within Mail. There could even be a Menu Extra for it... oh wait, there already is.

Instead of iTunes, iSync would automatically open and sync whatever you had told it to (music playlists, videos, calendars, addresses, etc.).