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olePigeon · Jan 6, 2009, 04:05 PM

The latest victim of Scientology is Jett Travolta. I knew it the instant they said Jett died from a seizure. Scientologists refuse to treat mental disorders, saying they're just a weakness of character. Aliens put evil thetans into peoples' brains and make them have autism and seizures.

Sure enough, the Travolta family refused to treat Jett's autism or seizures with medication that would have allowed Jett to live a pretty normal life. Now he's dead.

I guess it's unfair to single out Scientology since there are quite a few religions that don't allow medical treatment, insisting that a god or gods will miraculously cure the person. However, the irony is just resounding given the name of the religion.

Chongo · Jan 6, 2009, 05:41 PM

Jett had an army of medical personal and he was on seizure medication. The CoS is against psychiatric drugs, not medically necessary drugs. This was discussed at great lengths last night on all three cable news channels.

Powerbook · 06:24 PM

Uh. The main question here is, when will America learn that Scientology is NOT a religion, but a money making cult, sect, scheme, whatever??? Getting hold of labile, gullible persons and wring them out of every Dollar has nothing to do with a religion. Even their semi official motto by Ron Hubbard is "Make money, make more money, make that other people make money for you." (circa quote)

My solution would be: Once you go Scientology, you lose custody over your underage children. Simple as that. I understand that part of the United States' mantra is the big personal freedom thing, but there should be laws against dragging your children into your misery.

Regards,
PB.

turtle777 · Jan 6, 2009, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by Powerbook

Uh. The main question here is, when will America learn that Scientology is NOT a religion...

Wouldn't that require willingness to learn first ?

-t

TheWOAT · Jan 6, 2009, 06:21 PM

Apparantly there is news that the kid was taken off the seizure meds, and was having a severe seizure once a week. (Heard on news radio today)...

olePigeon · Jan 6, 2009, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by Chongo

Jett had an army of medical personal and he was on seizure medication. The CoS is against psychiatric drugs, not medically necessary drugs. This was discussed at great lengths last night on all three cable news channels.

I heard/read he was taken off medication because John Travolta said that the Scientology treatments were working.

hyteckit · Jan 6, 2009, 06:27 PM

So Scientology is just like most religions.

Chuckit · Jan 6, 2009, 06:33 PM

Most religions these days make an effort not to kill their adherents. Scientology and Christian Science are novelties in this sense. One might hypothesize a connection between misusing the word "science" and making dangerous mistakes that kill people.

Chongo · Jan 7, 2009, 12:49 PM

I'm wonder, can if Hubbard's death be included in CoS count since he "discarded his body"? (and had Vistaril in his system according to the toxicology report)

brassplayersrock² · Jan 7, 2009, 12:56 PM

wait? travolta is a scientologist? *puts head down in shame as I rip off my john travolta fan club poster from the wall, and tosses it next to my will smith fan club poster*

Shaddim · Jan 7, 2009, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

So Scientology is just like most religions.

So, we could assume, from your post, that most atheists are mentally damaged?

Ooooo, generalizations are fun!

turtle777 · Jan 7, 2009, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

So, we could assume, from your post, that most atheists are mentally damaged?

Ooooo, generalizations are fun!

-t

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

So, we could assume, from your post, that most atheists are mentally damaged?

Ooooo, generalizations are fun!

What are you saying? You are mentally damaged? I agree.

I'm not an Atheist. I'm God. Remember? I f*cked God and had Jesus. You forgot already?

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 05:38 PM

Shaddim,

Tell me. Don't most religions believe in curing disease outside of modern medicine?

Exorcism? Holy Water? Prayer? Witch Doctor? Praying to the God(s). Refusing medical treatment because of religious believes?

Guess most religious people are mentally damaged.

Oooo, generalizations are fun!

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 05:40 PM

If you think most religions believe in "refusing medical treatment because of religious beliefs" you really need to go do some homework.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

If you think most religions believe in "refusing medical treatment because of religious beliefs" you really need to go do some homework.

I never said that. Reread it again.

Most religions believe in curing disease outside of modern medicine.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 05:48 PM

But very few, in fact, a tiny portion of them actually practice prayer in place of medicine.

Or like the CoS, sit you in a depravation room with no water reading you the Scientology mantra.

Admit it, you came in here to badmouth religion instead of actually talking about the subject at hand, which is Scientology and the people they have killed due to their negligence.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 05:51 PM

Yes, most religions are mental nutcases when it comes to medical treatment.

Thanks to Pres. Bush, Doctors and Nurses can now refuse medical treatment on religious and moral grounds.

http://bootheglobalperspectives.com/...ffset=0&id=250

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

But very few, in fact, a tiny portion of them actually practice prayer in place of medicine.

Or like the CoS, sit you in a depravation room with no water reading you the Scientology mantra.

Admit it, you came in here to badmouth religion instead of actually talking about the subject at hand, which is Scientology and the people they have killed due to their negligence.

Oh look. Lets pick on Scientology. Lets not talk about religion and medical treatment.

What we are discussing here is religion and medical treatment. Believing in treatment outside of modern medicine.

Maybe you don't want a civil discussion and want this thread to be a solely Scientology bashing thread?

Shaddim · Jan 7, 2009, 05:53 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

If you think most religions believe in "refusing medical treatment because of religious beliefs" you really need to go do some homework.

This is beyond his/her comprehension.

The vast majority of religions do not exclude medical treatment in any way. They firmly believe in prayer in addition to properly prescribed treatment. This flies in the face of some extreme views held by certain Scientologists, Christian Scientists, and Jehovah's Witnesses.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

Oh look. Lets pick on Scientology. Lets not talk about religion and medical treatment.

What we are discussing here is religion and medical treatment. Believing in treatment outside of modern medicine.

Chuckit already covered that, besides small radical sects most religions do not use prayer IN PLACE OF medical treatment.

In Scientology that's pretty much their thing, only they replace prayer with an even more ridiculous set of rules.

Shaddim · Jan 7, 2009, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

What are you saying? You are mentally damaged? I agree.

I'm not an Atheist. I'm God. Remember? I f*cked God and had Jesus. You forgot already?

Oh dear, your tumor has gotten worse, now it's affected your reading comprehension.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

Oh look. Lets pick on Scientology. Lets not talk about religion and medical treatment.

What we are discussing here is religion and medical treatment. Believing in treatment outside of modern medicine.

Maybe you don't want a civil discussion and want this thread to be a solely Scientology bashing thread?

Got any more sentences you'd like to add before I quote you next time?

You want this to be a religion-bashing thread, how is that any better from wanting to bash scientology for killing another one of it's followers?

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

Got any more sentences you'd like to add before I quote you next time?

You want this to be a religion-bashing thread, how is that any better from wanting to bash scientology for killing another one of it's followers?

No. I just don't see how Scientology is much different from the other religions when it comes to medical treatment.

Most religions believe in cures outside of modern medicine.

Face it. Most religions are nuts that way.

How is mental illness treated in Scientology?
How is mental illness treated in Christianity? Exorcism?

Oh look, exorcism killed another person. Let me start a new thread: Christianity killed another person.

Homosexuality is a mental illness to Christians. We must beat the gayness out of them.

Face it. Most religions are nuts that way.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 06:16 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

How is mental illness treated in Christianity? Exorcism?

What?!? I was raised Catholic and I never heard the priest say once that medicine was 'evil' and that only prayer or divine intervention was the way to get healthy.

What you're doing here is taking a TINY subsection of a major religion and projecting it to billions of followers as if the transitive property works for humans too.

Christianity is such a broad term I don't really understand why you would use it. Oh I know why! It's because you've got this honking chip on your shoulder and you take any chance you can to vomit your hatreds of religion.

I'm not religious, but I'm not stupid enough to condemn the masses for the actions of a few.

Also, you are free to leave any religion at any time you'd like, it's not so easy with the CoS.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

What?!? I was raised Catholic and I never heard the priest say once that medicine was 'evil' and that only prayer or divine intervention was the way to get healthy.

What you're doing here is taking a TINY subsection of a major religion and projecting it to billions of followers as if the transitive property works for humans too.

Christianity is such a broad term I don't really understand why you would use it. Oh I know why! It's because you've got this honking chip on your shoulder and you take any chance you can to vomit your hatreds of religion.

I'm not religious, but I'm not stupid enough to condemn the masses for the actions of a few.

Also, you are free to leave any religion at any time you'd like, it's not so easy with the CoS.

Reread it again. I love that you keep putting words into my mouth with every response.

I never said the priest thinks medicine was "evil". They just believe in cures outside modern medicine.

You get treated with medicine. Then you get spray will holy water and get the mental disease exorcised out of you.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

You get treated with medicine. Then you get spray will holy water and get the mental disease exorcised out of you.

Where do you get this stuff? Some high-school Atheists blog or something?

and no, I have no want to re-read anything you've typed in this thread.

Edit: I'd also like to add... You said that I wasn't interested in a real discussion, but let's see your first post in this thread.

Originally Posted by hyteckit

So Scientology is just like most religions.

Yeah wow, real discussion material right there

This has used up the last few minutes of time that I can allocate to wasting on you.

Your generalizations have been, for the lack of a better word, amusing.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

Where do you get this stuff? Some high-school Atheists blog or something?

and no, I have no want to re-read anything you've typed in this thread.

Well, it's quite obvious you don't read at all.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:26 PM

So Scientology is just like most religions; Believing in cures outside modern medicine.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 06:30 PM

...and most religions actively use them IN PLACE OF medical treatment...oh wait, no they don't.

Edit: I guess since this took less than a minute to type I can still not go over my 'futile arguments' minutes.

Chongo · Jan 7, 2009, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

So Scientology is just like most religions; Believing in cures outside modern medicine.

No, Scientology is anti Psychiatry, The Church of Christ, Scientist and J- Witness are the big two that teach against all medical care.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:48 PM

Is homosexuality a mental illness? If so, how is it cured or treated?

I wonder what you religious people think.

Chuckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:49 PM

Hyteckit, have you ever actually met any religious people? There are very few religions that believe holy water is an adequate replacement for medical treatment.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

Hyteckit, have you ever actually met any religious people? There are very few religions that believe holy water is an adequate replacement for medical treatment.

I went to Catholic School and Sunday School. What do you think?

My previous roommate held Bible Studies in our apartment.

I'm Asian, so my tradition involved multiple religions, syncretism.

Chuckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:52 PM

And did he believe holy water was a suitable replacement for medical treatment?

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

I went to Catholic School and Sunday School

I went to both and have never heard such nonsense.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

I went to both and have never heard such nonsense.

That Catholics believe in cures outside modern medicine like prayer and exorcism, or demons are the cause of mental illness?

sek929 · 12:35 AM

No, that they would not believe in outside cures enough to refuse their own people actual medical treatment, which was your original point.

If your new point is that most religious people believe that the power of belief and prayer can heal then I guess you are correct, even though you're quite shifty.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

No, that they would believe in outside cures enough to refuse their own people actual medical treatment, which was your original point.

If your new point is that most religious people believe that the power of belief and prayer can heal then I guess you are correct, even though you're quite shifty.

There you go. You agree with me.

Scientologist is like most religions in the regard that they believe in cures outside modern medicine. That was my original argument.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 07:15 PM

No, your original argument was that the CoS is like other religions because they REMOVED MEDICAL CARE FOR THEIR OWN BRAND OF TREATMENT.

Since then you've changed your argument yet remain willfully ignorant. A move I refer to as "The Kevin."

Shaddim · Jan 7, 2009, 07:16 PM

Scientologist is like most religions in the regard that they believe in cures outside modern medicine. That was my original argument.

and there's something wrong with prayer and medicine being used together?

No, it wasn't your ORIGINAL argument, you're now backpedaling.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:21 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

and there's something wrong with prayer and medicine being used together?

No, it wasn't your ORIGINAL argument, you're now backpedaling.

How am I backpedaling?

My original argument.

"So Scientology is just like most religions."

Then you responsed with a personal attack.

Then I ask "Don't most religions believe in curing disease outside of modern medicine?"

You guys just jump to conclusions.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:26 PM

Similarities between a Scientologist and Christian when it comes to mental illness.

They both believe in cures outside modern medicine.
For Scientologist, Aliens are the cause.
For Christians, Demons are the cause

Difference between a Scientologist and Christian when it comes to mental illness.

Scientologist have more faith in the believes over modern medicine.
Christians have more faith in modern medicine than their believes.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 07:35 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

How am I backpedaling?

My original argument.

"So Scientology is just like most religions."

Which was in response to...

Originally Posted by TheWOAT

Apparantly there is news that the kid was taken off the seizure meds, and was having a severe seizure once a week. (Heard on news radio today)...

Originally Posted by olePigeon

I heard/read he was taken off medication because John Travolta said that the Scientology treatments were working.

So yes, indeed, your original argument was that major religions are the same as Scientology because they often remove or refuse medical treatment and use their own dogma instead.

This is false, and you knew it so you changed your argument to fit what you've already said.

Like I said, you are a true follower of Kevin's Church of BS.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

No, it wasn't your ORIGINAL argument, you're now backpedaling.

It'll be fun to see his second round of backpedaling.

Maybe he'll try to convince us that the Sistine chapel is also known as the Sixteenth Chapel.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:39 PM

Shaddim, are there any Scientologist at your Church?

Since there are Atheists who attend, I wonder.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:42 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

Which was in response to...

Originally Posted by olePigeon

I heard/read he was taken off medication because John Travolta said that the Scientology treatments were working.

So yes, indeed, your original argument was that major religions are the same as Scientology because they often remove or refuse medical treatment and use their own dogma instead.

This is false, and you knew it so you changed your argument to fit what you've already said.

Like I said, you are a true follower of Kevin's Church of BS.

I heard/read he was taken off medication because John Travolta said that the Scientology treatments were working.

Hell, if prayer was working, why would you continue taking drugs?

For fun?

So Scientology is just like most religions; Believing in cures outside modern medicine.

sek929 · Jan 7, 2009, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

So Scientology is just like most religions; Believing in cures outside modern medicine...and actively using them in place of medical treatment.

Fixed™

That's your original stance, I'm not interested in what you've concocted since then.

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

Fixed™

That's your original stance, I'm not interested in what you've concocted since then.

Once again, putting words into my mouth.

Is that how you win arguments because you lack the intellect to do so?

hyteckit · Jan 7, 2009, 07:56 PM

Difference between a religious person who believes in cures out of modern medicine and a person who doesn't believe in voodoo crap like exorcism.

A religious person with voodoo crap beliefs:

Treats with modern medicine. While on modern medication, they do their holy water and exorcism on the side, or whatever voodoo crap. Believes it is working and sick person is cured. Stops taking medicines since they believed person is cured. Person dies. Or they just died from exorcism.

So Scientology is just like most religions; Believing in cures outside modern medicine.

A person with doesn't believe in voodoo crap:

They doesn't believe that exorcism or prayer works. Continue on modern medicine as they believe it is what's keeping the person healthy, and not some voodoo crap.