[Scotttheking]

I'm just curious, what reasonable stuff would you all like to see in the next powermac. General technologies, not specific stuff like processor speeds or HD sizes, but all the general stuff.

Here is what I'd like to see, and until I see the first 3 I won't buy a new mac.

• DDR Ram
• ATA-100 or above
• G5, preferably duals (or higher)
• case with at least 2 5.25 drive bays
• agp plus 5 pci slots
• next rev of firewire
• usb2, at least 4 ports, usb 1.1, at least 4 ports
• analog audio in and out
• a 2 button mouse with scroll wheel
• vid card with analog, NORMAL digital, svideo out, and they can leave adc if the want

What do you people think?

[Cipher13]

Your wishes are identical to mine; the lowest priority of those, for me, is the mouse.

However, I'd REALLY REALLY like a goddamn CD eject button.

EDIT: They will not give two 5.25" drives because it'll interfer with their 'brilliant' keyboard eject button idea.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: Cipher13 ]

[Scotttheking]

Oh yeah, normal eject

after the first 3, they are in no particular order for me.

usb2, at least 4 ports, usb 1.1, at least 4 ports

Eight total USB ports, then?

USB ports are backwards and forwards compatible -- 2.0 devices will work in 1.1 slots and vice versa. Now, 2.0 devices will be strangled by the bandwidth of 1.1 slots, but they'll still work, just slowly.

Therefore, four or six USB 2.0 ports should work, and frankly less than four would be rather stingy.

[zac4mac]

I'd like to see at least one USB and FW on the front of the tower.
That way I don't need to get at the back to hook up my camera or iPod.

Faster is better

[eep!]

Originally posted by Cipher13:
<STRONG>EDIT: They will not give two 5.25" drives because it'll interfer with their 'brilliant' keyboard eject button idea.</STRONG>

They (apple) could have the eject key bring up a menu with all cd/cd-rw/dvd disks on it so you can open them when they're empty and other disks if they are mounted, e.g. zip disks, disk images, flash cards, or even floppies if you've got them.

just an idea

{edit}how about two AGP pro slots? (is that even possible?) get two cards with dual display support... presto-chango - four monitors!

you could put the front mounted usb and firewire ports inside a little flip down 'pod' under the front handle (the bottom one) that way the machine would look the same but have added functionality.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: eep! ]

[EmAn]

Originally posted by Cipher13:
<STRONG>EDIT: They will not give two 5.25" drives because it'll interfer with their 'brilliant' keyboard eject button idea.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: Cipher13 ]</STRONG>

Why wouldn't the keyboard eject work with another drive? It works with my USB CD-RW drive so why wouldn't it work with another internal drive?

[satchmo]

I know that might be difficult given the power and heat that one produces, but I'd like to see a quieter G4/G5 tower.

Unfortunately for those who use one at home, the current G4's sounds like a jet engine!

[Nimisys]

DDR Memory, with dual channel capability
RapidIO or HyperTransport System Bus
RAID Controller Built In (ATA or SCSI, it matters not)
1x3.5 external bay
2x5.25 external bay
as many 3.5 internals as they can jam in there

Move to an open hardware status allowing 3rd party Mobos and to make the CPU's available to be purchase seperatly (allowing direct Apple upgrades)

[G4ME]

I want Quad prossers just because it sounds cool, even if its only four 733s, or even 500s that would be the ultimate. Also faster ram, DDR has been out for so long and we haven't adapted it.

[xyber233]

I want two 5.25" drives even if that means.....2 eject keys ! I guess I can take DDR too.

[Hawkeye_a]

G5

[Deestar]

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
<STRONG>I'm just curious, what reasonable stuff would you all like to see in the next powermac. General technologies, not specific stuff like processor speeds or HD sizes, but all the general stuff.

Here is what I'd like to see, and until I see the first 3 I won't buy a new mac.

• DDR Ram
• ATA-100 or above
• G5, preferably duals (or higher)
• case with at least 2 5.25 drive bays
• agp plus 5 pci slots
• next rev of firewire
• usb2, at least 4 ports, usb 1.1, at least 4 ports
• analog audio in and out
• a 2 button mouse with scroll wheel
• vid card with analog, NORMAL digital, svideo out, and they can leave adc if the want

What do you people think?</STRONG>

Pretty much the same but I would add Optical and AC3 audio ports for Dolby digital/DTS sound for DVD and eventually games.

[sodamnregistered]

(2) 5.25 inch bays is really my main peeve.

I have a superdrive that I'm afraid will die an early death copying CD-ROM data and similar. Would love to toss a cheap $60 8x CD-R in there to augment Superdrive.

I would love a non-acrylic case option. An ugly steel case if you will. I think this whole "pretty case" marketing scheme adds $1000 to the price of the Mac and that alone hurts their share/attractiveness.

An 867MHz should be $1600, not $2600.

Dell and Gateway can sell P4 machines with flatscreens for $999. It's just too huge a price difference for the market to bear. Macs are pretty much 3x as expensive.

[Clive]

Originally posted by sodamnregistered:
<STRONG>(2) 5.25 inch bays is really my main peeve.</STRONG>

Errrrrrr, am I missing something here or are there not two 5.25 bays on the front of a G4 already (and have been since the El Capitan case was introduced) - ie a CD/DVD and a bay for a Zip drive.


-- Clive

[sodamnregistered]

Originally posted by Clive:
<STRONG>

Errrrrrr, am I missing something here or are there not two 5.25 bays on the front of a G4 already (and have been since the El Capitan case was introduced) - ie a CD/DVD and a bay for a Zip drive.


-- Clive</STRONG>

Who wants a zip drive anywhere near their computer?

You could not put a Superdrive and a cheap CD-R in the same tower without a blowtorch.

The bezel makes it look like you could put 2 5.25 devices in their, but it's like a 100 foot glass of water on the horizon the the desert.

The wants/needs:

1 firewire & 1 usb port on the front
2 5.25" drive bays accessible from the front
dual 1ghz G4's (to replace my dual 450's)
max ram at 2gb plus.. not 1.5gb as is curent. AND 4 ram slots like my g4.
internal firewire port
onboard support for 4 (four) ata100 drives w/o adding a card.


The wishes - aka way out there:

200mhz motherboard
dual agp for dual monitors
quieter tower
more organic looking tower - keep handles!
how about an ipod docking spot on top/side of the tower.. snap it in and watch it go.. :-)

[cdhostage]

I want a cool-looking two-button mouse with a scroll wheel. Faster processors are going to come anyway... let's talk about non-obvious enhancements...

[SkiBikeSki]

I would like to see the use of PC-2400 DDR (333MHz). That would put Apple a step ahead of AMD. Expand the 3.5" bay to 5.25", there is no need for a 3.5" bay at all. And how about the option to BTO a Mac with a DVD-R/RW and a CD-RW; the super drive isn’t convenient for duplicating CD’s. Faster FireWire and USB 2.0, and front ports for both. ATA-133 should be easy enough to pull off, since the current bus already supports 4 devices, just a speed bump is needed. RAID isn't necessary, since software RAID is a part of OS X. I think the current array of PCI slots is fine, since it come with a lot of stuff built in. I have a PC with six PCI slots, but after I added standard stuff like network, sound, FireWire, and modem cards it only has 2 free. A Power Mac with all the same features has 4 free. Dual AGP is wasteful, since you only needed that sort of bandwidth for 3D games, and who is going to program two games to run in tandem. A PCI video card works fine to run a monitor for just 2D stuff. Ditch ADC, and just have DVI, power, and USB ports. A 2-button wheel mouse is a must; if the OS supports it then why not give it. A fourth RAM slot would be good too, now that a lot of people use OS X, let use take advantage of its great memory management. Audio input has got to come back. Sure the iMic works well, but I’d rather have it built in. Finally a G5 must be in there. The G4 as been around too long, and is just too slow. It really should be well over 1GHz by now, but Moto is somewhat incompetent sometimes. The G5 should come in at speeds of about 1.0GHz, 1.3GHz, and 1.6GHz, and maybe 2x1.3GHz. After all those features get added, the Power Mac is now where it should be, so the price can stay the same; right now it is over-priced.

I’m pretty sure I covered a lot of people concerns, and gave some explanation too. Feel free to add to the base I created.

[chris v]

At least 4 RAM slots, since OS X can handle more than 1.5 gig. More built in ATA bus/slots for internal drives, perhaps 4. Ship with stereo speakers, at no extra cost. Dual 5.25 drives (CD- DVD) should at least be a BTO option.

CV

[ajprice]

Everything Scotttheking said.
A new case (this Quicksilver is still the blue and white G3 case, no matter how much they tweak it). Keep the door and somekind of handles.
At least G4 Pro/Cube speakers standard.
Some way of making it fanless.
Standard Airport Card (That goes for all macs)

A 1.2 JigaWatt processor so I can go back to 1985 and party like it's 1999.

[silverlode]

I thought you said *reasonable*?

Four USB ports? How many users have more than two USB devices (i.e., keyboard and mouse)?

Four internal ATA100 slots w/o adding card? How many users will ever have more than one drive in their computer? Probably the ones that aren't reading these forums. My point is that there is a point of diminished returns for Apple. It makes more business sense to cater to some kind of midpoint.

New enclosure would be great to help sales, but let's be honest, the B/W --&gt; Quicksilver case rocks. Easy to upgrade, still looks great, etc.

Fanless, cheaper, ports on front, drive bays...?!?

Dream on people!!

(just my thoughts)

[slipjack]

Definitely:

DDR Ram
100 ATA (c'mon... controllers are $70 for the MAC, not to mention the PC...)
better Audio (in/out)
FRONT ports for Firewire, USB, audio
Quieter... but I'll give that up for G5

Wish list:

Quad G4 Mac
1 gig+ Dual Mac

[JBytes]

I'd really like Apple to give us quieter machines. Now, I know it's not possible to get
silent G4 towers [a la Cube and iMac]; but for crying out loud [no pun], I don't want a jet engine on my desk.

--JBytes

[G4ME]

What would be the point of faster Firewire, it currently is at 400mbs, and your hd can only do about 100mbs on a good day with a raid, so faster firewire would be usless. same with USB 2 (which was created by the devil).

[Zoom]

Originally posted by silverlode:
<STRONG>
Four USB ports? How many users have more than two USB devices (i.e., keyboard and mouse)?</STRONG>

Me, for one. I have six USB devices: keyboard, mouse, printer, camera, PDA cradle, VST floppy drive. I could easily have a USB scanner and external drive, too. I think having 4-6 USB 2.0 ports would be great, but I understand the comment about diminishing returns for Apple. They need to target the center of the Bell curve, and you're probably correct that most people are fine with two ports (especially since you can plug the mouse into the keyboard). But for a "pro" machine, especially for what Apple charges, they could add more USB and FW ports.

As for drives... I was VERY pissed when I got my G4 and learned that the second external drive bay was only 3.5". I had an internal CDR drive ready to slap in there, and ended up having to get a new drive (it wasn't much more expensive than getting a case for the old drive). I haven't the slightest idea why Apple fixes this drive at 3.5". You could just include an adapter to turn the 5.25" slot into a 3.5" slot, but NOOOO, Apple had to restrict it. WHY? It just baffles me.

As for internal drives, I would think that 3 slots is plenty. If you need more than that, get bigger drives or an external drive.

Going fanless would be great, but an ultraquiet fan would be okay, or a fan that only comes on when needed.

I
love the idea of putting one FW and one USB port on the front! That makes so much sense! Look at all the consumer electronics that have inputs on the front now. My VCR, TV and receiver/amp all have front inputs. They're hidden by various mechanisms, so as not to detract from the smooth look. Apple could pull that off.

Stereo speakers would be a good thing to bundle with the pro machines.

I'd like to see a new case design. The present design is great, but it's old. Keep the easy-open hatch concept. I could do without the handles - I never move my machine. But I'm ready for a change in the look and feel. (And I think we'll get one in January.)

Apple has got to wake up and smell the napalm. A one-button mouse just doesn't cut it for a pro machine. They need to get that kick-ass design team to design a two-button scroll mouse worthy of the Apple logo. A one-button mouse is okay for the iMac, I guess, though the second button is so useful.

The pro keyboard needs a decent riser thingie. It doesn't tilt up nearly enough for me. I'd like to see some of those hot keys, too, like so many keyboards have nowadays.

I think Airport should be soldered into the motherboard. Save the cost of the packaging and sockets, and just nail that bastard in. I'll bet Apple could do that for $20. As I've said many times before in many other threads, there are tons of advantages to knowing that every Mac is WiFi-enabled, and I think Apple could make all sorts of cool apps and hardware thingies that use this. I would jump straight to 802.11g, though.

I think Apple needs to make and distribute a web cam with every Mac. I think they need a new app to go with it called iPhone that allows for elegant, easy, high-quality video conferencing and internet phone calls. How cool would that be? Every Mac has this ability built right in! The laptops would need a built-in camera, too, and I think that's possible (look at that damn X10 thing).

Okay, that's all. I've rambled quite enough.

[vsurfer]

Why be 'reasonable?' The only 'reasonable' I'm interested in is the price!

So my unreasonable demand, which i will enforce with my wallet as long as I can hold out is:

Speed, Speed, <font color = red>Speed </font>, At reasonable prices.

I want an OSX laptop that opens apps/everything immediately -(what a concept-immediately)- none of this waiting around, bouncing icons do-doo.


I don't care what bus, motherboard, or how you do it, as long as it's fast.

And I want it all for $1,799, and with enough storage that I can live with OSX, 9.1, Linux and Virtual PC and a smeg-load of apps all on the same HD.

I'd also like an OSX that wasn't quite so candy, felt a little smaller, with system/display fonts I can pick, a little less like a straitjacket. Cmon, Let's beat XP unequivocally in the Cnet Death OS match - especially in the "interface" department. Heck I can almost even live with the scroll wheel on my Kensington mouse not working (for a little while longer at least), if I can have all of that.

Widespread mac acceptance on corporate desktops would also be nice while we're at it.

And other than that, Scott theking seemed to sum up the rest.

Ta, Ta For now,

UnreasonableVsurfer

---
PS. My kids have a request - they don't want to hear me say, "sorry you can't have that game, it's only for Windows PC's." (of, course it's a very convenient excuse for me, ha ha, but it doesn't do a whole lot for the street cred with the nascent 'gromMacs'.)

[Scotttheking]

Originally posted by silverlode:
<STRONG>I thought you said *reasonable*?

Four USB ports? How many users have more than two USB devices (i.e., keyboard and mouse)?</STRONG>

My count: 1. Keyboard. 2. Mouse. 3. Palm docking cradle. 4. Printer. 5. Scanner. 6. Speakers. 7. Mic..

And I'm sure many people are the same

Four internal ATA100 slots w/o adding card? How many users will ever have more than one drive in their computer? Probably the ones that aren't reading these forums. My point is that there is a point of diminished returns for Apple. It makes more business sense to cater to some kind of midpoint.

I'd like 4 drives, in a raid 0+1 config. Plus DVD drive. I don't want a PCI card for that.

New enclosure would be great to help sales, but let's be honest, the B/W --&gt; Quicksilver case rocks. Easy to upgrade, still looks great, etc.

Uh, no. It is severely lacking in the drive bay department. I wouldn't mind a case with 2 5.25 and 1 3.5, minimum. I wouldn't complain about double that, either.

Fanless, cheaper, ports on front, drive bays...?!?

Dream on people!!

(just my thoughts)

That's what I want.
I just built 2 new PCs. Keep in mind these are custom boxes, but understand that they have what I want. They are twin boxes.
Case: 4 5.25, 2 3.5, 1 3.5 internal.
Mobo: 3 DDR 2100 slots, 2 ATA 100 plugs, 2 ATA 100 RAID plugs (4 drives), 4 USB2, 4 USB1.1, 3 firwire, digital video, analog video, and svideo. And it had all the normal stuff too.
Oh yeah, and it still has 4 free PCI slots.
I want the same thing in a Mac.

--Scott

[reader50]

Originally posted by G4ME:
<STRONG>What would be the point of faster Firewire, it currently is at 400mbs, and your hd can only do about 100mbs on a good day with a raid, so faster firewire would be usless. same with USB 2 (which was created by the devil).</STRONG>

Current FireWire does 400 Mega bits per second, or 50 MB per sec. ATA-66 however, really is 66 MB per second. Practical throughput on ATA 66 is actually around 50 MB per sec.

Even one ATA66 drive and interface could keep up with the current FireWire 400. A RAID should be far faster.

[Hornet]

Oo Oo me me! (/waves hand really high in the air)!

Second 5.25" is a must. Adapt the eject key with a "Special Functions" tab in the keyboard control panel. Eject = Primary bay (configurable, default superdrive), Apple-Eject = Secondary bay (configuragble)

Another PCI slot. Would be cool

Additional 3 2.5" bays for internal HDDs (3 beyond the 2 5.25"'s, not 3 beyond now). How many (inc standard HDD bay) bays do current G4's come with?

Modification of ADC. Add in sound out and firewire to the connector (obvious with the iPod and all...) so that the LCD screens can have 2x USB on one side, and headphones and 1x firewire (for ipod) on the other side. I'd love that

And what others have said

[vsurfer]

oops my earlier post shoulda been in Powerbook land not Powermac, but while we're at it...

For sure we need more USB ports than a second-hand dartboard once owned by Madonna:

Keyboard, Mouse, Printer, Scanner, Palm Docking Cradle, Superdrive, Interview Digitizer. (7 without trying too hard)

And gimme more drivebays.

(Scott-El-Rei - your creations are reminiscent of the Ultimate Linux Box described in a recent penguin-type magazine.)

[Scotttheking]

Originally posted by vsurfer:
<STRONG>(Scott-El-Rei - your creations are reminiscent of the Ultimate Linux Box described in a recent penguin-type magazine.)</STRONG>

Is that me or someone else?

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by EmAn:
<STRONG>

Why wouldn't the keyboard eject work with another drive? It works with my USB CD-RW drive so why wouldn't it work with another internal drive?</STRONG>

How does the machine decide which drive to eject? It doesn't. It'd eject both. Wonderful...

[neutrino23]

Originally posted by Cipher13:
<STRONG>

How does the machine decide which drive to eject? It doesn't. It'd eject both. Wonderful...</STRONG>

Have you actually tried this or is this just speculation? I think that it actually ejects the disk whose icon is selected.

[neutrino23]

DDR RAM
cool
ATA-100
cool
G5 Dual processors
BTO would be nice
case with at least 2 5.25 drive bays
cool - though you can manage this now with an external drive, just more awkward.
AGP
personally don't care
5 PCI slots
personally don't care. It seems that a small minority need more than one PCI slot
next rev of firewire
cool
usb2, at least 4 ports, usb 1.1, at least 4 ports
??? get a 4 port USB hub. And USB 2?? is that dead yet? Do people still talk about it?
I don't want it on my machine.
I would rather have four FW connectors - CD/RW, scanner, HD, iPod
Analog audio in and out
Amen. Don't know why Apple took this off.
2 button mouse with scroll wheel
Seems like you can buy these somewhere. I like the one button mouse. It works well.
video card with analog, NORMAL digital, svideo out, and they can leave adc if the want
Don't care. Simple is better. ADC works for me. I like the other idea of adding FW and a headphone jack to ADC.

We see so many posts about all that Apple "must" add to the next system or they will lose tons of business. The world is so much bigger than our own personal desires. That is why Apple, and others, have marketing departments.

[silverlode]

No. It ejects both. I have an external Que! Firewire CDRW, and I've witnessed it.

Scotttheking, I understand. I myself have 5 USB and 2 Firewire peripherals. But all I'm saying is that Apple isn't going to cater to the top 5% of its customers, it's going to go with what the middle 90% are looking for. It's incorrect of you to claim that the G4 enclosure is "severely lacking in the drive bay department" when in fact, it is not! It may be for your purposes, whatever they may be. But I'm sure Apple (and 90% of users) don't have a problem with the current configuration at all.

[Leonard]

Originally posted by silverlode:
<STRONG>I thought you said *reasonable*?

Four USB ports? How many users have more than two USB devices (i.e., keyboard and mouse)?

Four internal ATA100 slots w/o adding card? How many users will ever have more than one drive in their computer? Probably the ones that aren't reading these forums. My point is that there is a point of diminished returns for Apple. It makes more business sense to cater to some kind of midpoint.

New enclosure would be great to help sales, but let's be honest, the B/W --&gt; Quicksilver case rocks. Easy to upgrade, still looks great, etc.

Fanless, cheaper, ports on front, drive bays...?!?

Dream on people!!

(just my thoughts)</STRONG>

silverload, are you an iMac user or what.

My G4 dual-800 has the following USB devices: mouse, keyboard, 2nd 3-button mouse, digital camera, printer, and at some point I'd probably want to add a scanner.

My G4 dual-800 has 2 60GB drives - one for standard use and one for backups.

As for my list:

Faster Memory Architecture
Faster G4 or a G5
second 5.25 externally accesible drive bay
USB ports on the front would be nice as well as 4 total USB ports

[DavidsneaD]

I'd like to see

Better hard drives. The new WD 30GB+per platter drives are awesome.
DDR
multi channel memory controller (like X-Box and Nforce chipset)
I-EEE1384b (Firewire 2 or whatever it's called)
G5 with clock speeds near AMD's CPU clock speeds
Front interface ports (whoever mentioned this was onto something)
Better LCD screens with lower pixel response.

AppleWorks 6 Database should have a fill down in list view like MS Works 4 for Mac did back in the day.

Add-in built-in docking station for iPod. Basically it would be a firewire connection in a 5.25 or 3.5 slot that would fit a iPod. To sync your iPod just snap the pod into the computer and let iTunes do the rest. Talk about "digital hub"

Add-in Radeon 8500 for Dual monitor from AGP. A dual monitor GF3 would be better, but currently isn't developed.

[ 11-20-2001: Message edited by: DavidsneaD ]

[DavidsneaD]

Originally posted by silverlode:
<STRONG>But all I'm saying is that Apple isn't going to cater to the top 5% of its customers, it's going to go with what the middle 90% are looking for.</STRONG>

Your Quicksilver 866 wasn't built for the middle 90%. The iMac is marketed toward the mainstream system, costing under 1500 for the system + integrated monitor. Your 866 with monitor could push $3500, far above the cost of the average home computer in 2001. Apple should cater to the high end if they want people to spend high end bucks on a computer.

The G5 will cost at least as much as the G4 does now, and the average system retails for between $1000 - $1500 without monitor.

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
<STRONG>
My count: 1. Keyboard. 2. Mouse. 3. Palm docking cradle. 4. Printer. 5. Scanner. 6. Speakers. 7. Mic..

And I'm sure many people are the same
--Scott</STRONG>

Except, Keyboard = -1 +2 ports. If you buy an Apple monitor, you have a built in hub there also. I don't see what the big deal about having a hub is. They're inexpensive ($20 - $25). Also, when you have multiple machines, you can stack the hubs and swap devices very easily. Personally, I prefer plugging into a hub than reaching around the computer and finding the USB port, etc. In some cases, this could involve getting down under the desk, etc. depending upon the setup. I say two ports are just fine, as long as they are seperate channels for increased bandwidth.


While I'm here, I'll add my two cents.

Geforce3 should be standard on the pro machines. Geforce2 or ATI equivalent (7500?) should be standard on the consumer machines.

800mbs Firewire would be nice. USB2 is optional.

DDR, etc. would be nice, but not entirely necessary. Most people don't realize how little this actually adds to overall performance. A decent size L2 or L3 cache negates the bus advantage for the most part. Yes, there are a few exceptions of where this architecture helps significantly. However, this isn't a magic bullet and won't deliver more than 5-10% improvement on average.

Steve

[mitchell_pgh]

Here is my essential list of hardware:

- Robotic arms that would give me a back rub while I design
- HAL 2000 type voice control
- FireWire 3 at 900 TB/s (let's just skip 2)
- Neural Stimulator Hat (no more icky monitor keyboard or mouse)
- iMovieRip + Superdrive2 bundle to rip DVDs
- Anti-Time Vortex engine so I could live forever

ALL that or a headless iMac

[mitchell_pgh]

Here is my essential list of hardware:

- Robotic arms that would give me a back rub while I design
- HAL 2000 type voice control
- FireWire 3 at 900 TB/s (let's just skip 2)
- Neural Stimulator Hat (no more icky monitor keyboard or mouse)
- iMovieRip + Superdrive2 bundle to rip DVDs
- Anti-Time Vortex engine so I could live forever

ALL that or a headless iMac

[coteesh]

I'd like to see the following:

- Move-memory speeds (bandwidth) exceeding 1 gigabyte per second. The use of DDR ram might bee needed. Current G4's only get up to around 400 MB/s, and current pentium 4's get about 1.5 gigs/sec, current athlon - 1 gig/s.

- give the Be company the specs they need to make BeOS workable on mac.

- Runs PC software naitively, and able to boot in Win98SE etc, and boot Windows XP. That is all Apple needs to do, and they'll take the entire market by storm!!!

- cheaper hardware, and less crappy non-upgradible stuff. (i.e. iMac).

[KidRed]

Four USB ports? How many users have more than two USB devices (i.e., keyboard and mouse)?

keyboard
mouse
scanner
printer
visor cradle
san disk reader
digital usb camera
digital web cam

Um, yea, I for one use more than 2 USB devices

[austeros]

faster processors are a given though type and # are not. the ram and motherboard prolly depend on the processor. if they redo the mobo, i think thats our only chance to see the sound port inprovements

what i hope for
firewire 2 - i will be seriously annoyed if its availible on a pc first
usb2.0 - prolly only if we get firewire 2, hopefully atleast 4 ports
airport standart across the board - this should be a given

i too would want another 51/2" dirvebay, but i think apple is too stubborn to give it to us, but if they do, would love to bto a fast cdburner

and ofcourse, refresh the geforce3 cards, and give us an option to bto ati again

come on steve... give us a good reason to pay all that more $

[Graymalkin]

I got a real kick out of reading these wish lists. Here's some info so you don't wet yourselves.

1. Dual AGP ports - This is a silly concept. The definition of a port on a computer is a interface that attaches one device to another. Your AGP port connects directly to the Northbrige (that is the part of the memory controller that lets your CPU and RAM talk to one another). This means the AGP card you've got can directly interface your system's main memory. In theory you can set an AGP apature in your main memory effectively giving your video card a second of system RAM to use as a frame buffer or texture buffer. Two AGP ports (which is redundant because it translates to Accelerated Graphics Port port) would halve the bandwidth between the AGP device and the system. Not because the AGP devices are sharing bandwidth between the Northbridge and themselves but because they are both accessing rather slow memory (system RAM). Anyone who used to run multiple PCI video cards doing intense 3D stuff knows what happens when you push your bandwidth.

2. DDR Ram - DDR works well on the Athlon because of the fast front side bus (the EV6 derivitive) on the Athlon. The FSB of the Athlon runs at twice of the main system clock. This means more L2 LOADs and STOREs per second which nets you increased performance with certain programs (3D and 2D algorithms for instance). The DDR RAM alots for reads and writes on both clock edges which gives you the whole double data rate thing. A FSB running at 2x the system bus and RAM access twice per clock means the processor can talk to the RAM much more often so you can load more work to do and write work you've done. To effectively use DDR on G4s you'd need to have a double speed FSB on the processor or reengineer your pipeline to handle the faster ram. Both of these cost money to impliment, alot more money than the simpler core revisions like changing the trace width or something. It'd be nice to do but I don't think you'll see it until the G5 is in production, which leads to number three.

3. The G5 - It will not be out at MWSF coming up soon. We'll be extremely lucky if it is out by the fall of 2002. It will be an awesome processor but won't be out in the timeframe most people are wanting.

4. "I want X number of Y slots..." - Unless you know what you want stuff for don't say you want it because it has some fancy name.

5. ATA100 or better - Please please please remember the ATA66 thing means the speed of the IDE bus the drive connects to, not the speed at which the drive actually works. The bus speed of a hard drive is known as the external speed and is for the most part the speed at which data is transfered into and out of the drive's cache. The internal transfer speed is often times the more important aspect of a particular drive as well as the seek time. Drives with more platters and a higher RPM rate are going to have higher internal throughput speeds thans slower drives with fewer platters. Even 7200RPM drives with 5 platters will only get you a MAXIMUM STR (sustained transfer rate) or about 23MB/s. This is theoretical and only applies for long continuous files with very little file system overhead or hiccups. This doesn't come close to maxing out even an ATA33 bus. You could stick a 50x CD-ROM drive and a nice hard drive on an ATA33 bus and transfer one huge files from the CD to the HD and STILL not max out the ATA33 bus. A huge ATA100 bus would only REALLY become effective is you had an EIDE RAID system with 5 drives in a RAID 0 or 5 format.

I guess that's all I can think of. Stuff like multiple USB ports and more 5.25" drives shouldn't even have to be mentioned. It is pretty ridiculous for Apple to have stifled so many expansion options by limiting internal bays. I think part of it is economical, they got a bunch of companies to spit out FireWire and USB devices and if their boxes don't nudge people in the direction of purchasing those devices they will have upset third parties. FireWire has yet to be really pushed to its limit on consumer systems and even prosumers have a tough time populating the FW bus with enough stuff to really bog it down. I would love in Apple stuck FW and USB ports on the front of the dang boxes like everyone else figured out how to do a year ago. I'd also like to see better video card support and more sound card support. If I'm spending 2600$ on some Mac Super Duper system I'd like to get it with something like a GeForce3 Ti 500. I'd also like to output four channel sound from my machine with buying a 300$ audio workstation card.

[neutrino23]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
<STRONG>Here is my essential list of hardware:

- Robotic arms that would give me a back rub while I design
- HAL 2000 type voice control
- FireWire 3 at 900 TB/s (let's just skip 2)
- Neural Stimulator Hat (no more icky monitor keyboard or mouse)
- iMovieRip + Superdrive2 bundle to rip DVDs
- Anti-Time Vortex engine so I could live forever

ALL that or a headless iMac</STRONG>

Love this list. I'll add one necessary application. An intelligent "To-Do" list that actually does the things I add to the list instead of peskily piling them up waiting for me to take care of them myself.

[nana2]

Originally posted by Graymalkin:
<STRONG>Even 7200RPM drives with 5 platters will only get you a MAXIMUM STR (sustained transfer rate) or about 23MB/s. This is theoretical and only applies for long continuous files with very little file system overhead or hiccups. This doesn't come close to maxing out even an ATA33 bus. You could stick a 50x CD-ROM drive and a nice hard drive on an ATA33 bus and transfer one huge files from the CD to the HD and STILL not max out the ATA33 bus. A huge ATA100 bus would only REALLY become effective is you had an EIDE RAID system with 5 drives in a RAID 0 or 5 format.
</STRONG>

Sure you aren't talking about a 2.5" hard drive there? Newer 3.5" IDE hard drives can reach around 44MB/sec at the start of the disk, reducing to 28MB/sec at the end of the disk. Obviously this is best case scenario with sustained transfers (i.e. large images, audio etc. So you could say that an ATA66 controller would be sufficient for any current IDE drive. ATA100 gives a bit of breathing space. But you need to move to ATA133 or SerialATA to move beyond the 137GB addressing limit of ATA100 and below.

Two of my old g4 had a dvd and cdrw in them. One was a 450mhz which I took out and put in a ATX case. and the other I just sold on ebay (auction closed yesterday) was a dual 450Mhz that I screwed around with the case and got another 5.25 in there. And I do have the problem of both drive opening at the same time.
I really like the idea of pushing the cd eject and a menu comes up and displays all the drives connected.
Also the bezel still fits and the computer looks just as nice.

jonathan