[olePigeon]

http://forum.parallels.com/thread5997.html
Screenshots in action.

For anyone who has Parallels, they released a beta that has a new option called "Coherency" mode. It makes Parallels just like the Classic environment for OS X, except for Windows apps.

Still quite a few bugs, but really cool none-the-less.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

http://forum.parallels.com/thread5997.html
Screenshots in action.

For anyone who has Parallels, they released a beta that has a new option called "Coherency" mode. It makes Parallels just like the Classic environment for OS X, except for Windows apps.

Still quite a few bugs, but really cool none-the-less.

Not exactly. All it does is make the Windows desktop transparent. You still have a task bar, and Windows applications act as one application.

Crossover is the true coming of the Redbox.

[Salty]

The question is, does this allow viruses to run under OS X or not?

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Salty 

The question is, does this allow viruses to run under OS X or not?

No. It's just like Parallels always has been, except with a transparent desktop wallpaper in Windows.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Not exactly. All it does is make the Windows desktop transparent. You still have a task bar, and Windows applications act as one application.

Which is pretty much how Classic works, no?

[Mrjinglesusa]

It's more than a "transparent desktop wallpaper". Notice there are no drives, folders, shortcuts, etc. on the "desktop"? All you have is the Windows task bar right above OS X dock. Even better than coherency is the auto-resolution to fit the window. Now, I can have XP running in its own window (at "full screen") in OS X but easily be able to access OS X without having to hit "ctrl+alt".

[goMac]

Originally Posted by CharlesS 

Which is pretty much how Classic works, no?

In Classic you can Option Tab transparently between OS X and OS 9 apps and such and they're integrated on a deeper level.

I'm still a fan of Crossover which has true transparency.

[Art Vandelay]

Originally Posted by CharlesS 

Which is pretty much how Classic works, no?

Nope. Classic suppresses the Classic Finder from even running so there is no Classic desktop to hide or make transparent. With Coherence, Parallels is still running within a window but the window borders are removed and the Windows desktop is masked out with a transparent layer. You can still easily view the desktop if you click the Show Desktop shortcut in the Quick Launch tray. Also, you can see visual artifacts of the Windows desktop if you quickly move any windows around.

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Crossover is the true coming of the Redbox.

No, it's not.

Crossover is an emulation of the Windows API, and as such may never truly achieve 100% compatibility with Windows software. (Yes I know "WINE is not emulation," but it is still emulating the Windows API).

The "blue box" was the classic operating system running within its own protected environment. It was not an emulation of the Classic API. Thus, the Coherence feature is probably as close as we will get to a "Red Box," without emulating the Windows API.

Apple could get away with what they did because there was already a Finder in OS X, and in both Classic and OS X, the Desktop is a function of the Finder. So they could disable the desktop entirely.

Classic required the whole OS 9 operating system to do its work. Parellels with Coherence is the same. It requires the whole Windows operating system.

It may be harder to disable Windows Explorer entirely, so they are currently hiding the desktop. Maybe future versions will disable Explorer and nearly function like the Blue Box.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Person Man 

No, it's not.

Crossover is an emulation of the Windows API, and as such may never truly achieve 100% compatibility with Windows software. (Yes I know "WINE is not emulation," but it is still emulating the Windows API).

Parallels does not have %100 compatibility either. Crossover can do 3D acceleration. Parallels can not.

In addition, Crossover integrates cleanly with OS X. Again, Parallels does not.

[vmarks]

Originally Posted by Art Vandelay 

Nope. Classic suppresses the Classic Finder from even running so there is no Classic desktop to hide or make transparent. With Coherence, Parallels is still running within a window but the window borders are removed and the Windows desktop is masked out with a transparent layer. You can still easily view the desktop if you click the Show Desktop shortcut in the Quick Launch tray. Also, you can see visual artifacts of the Windows desktop if you quickly move any windows around.

Untrue.


Run Classic and you'll see that the Classic Finder is running, giving the colored Apple in the left corner, the old application switcher on the right.

When an application in Classic gives you an open document dialog where you can choose a file, it's a classic dialog, not an OS X one.

Sure, and this or Crossover get called Red Box.

I keep waiting to see if we'll ever see Yellow Box again.

[Art Vandelay]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Untrue.


Run Classic and you'll see that the Classic Finder is running, giving the colored Apple in the left corner, the old application switcher on the right.

When an application in Classic gives you an open document dialog where you can choose a file, it's a classic dialog, not an OS X one.

No, it is true. That isn't the Classic Finder. That's Classic Support running. Also, Open/Save dialogs aren't handled by Classic Finder but by Navigation Services, a Classic API. If you look at the processes running in Classic, Finder is nowhere to be found.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Run Classic and you'll see that the Classic Finder is running, giving the colored Apple in the left corner, the old application switcher on the right.

No, it's not. The Finder isn't responsible for the Apple menu or the app switcher. In OS 9, you can quit the Finder, and all the menu bar things will still work. Furthermore, the app switcher in Classic shows OS X apps as well as OS 9 ones, and you only see one Finder in there - the OS X Finder.

You can run the OS 9 FInder if you want, though, if you make a copy of it, change the file type to APPL, and launch it as an app.

When an application in Classic gives you an open document dialog where you can choose a file, it's a classic dialog, not an OS X one.

That has nothing to do with the Finder at all. And I expect that Parallels would show you a Windows open dialog when you do the same thing.

edit: Art Vandelay beat me...

[vmarks]

Fine, I give.

I admit it's been years since I used Classic or OS 9. March 24 2001, formatted over the Public Beta and OS 9.1 partition and went OS X only.

Yes, it was perhaps a little premature, but I liked it.

[the_glassman]

Redsox?

[goMac]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Run Classic and you'll see that the Classic Finder is running, giving the colored Apple in the left corner, the old application switcher on the right.

I think that's actually just the OS X Finder. Classic just gives it the old OS 9 icon.

[Salty]

I don't know how much I want to be able to run Windows apps... basically the only thing I might wanna run is battle for middle earth 2. Though I guess it'd also be fun to be able to run IE if I were doing web design work or something. But when it's all said and done, I don't know if this sort of thing is good or bad for the platform. Oh well at least Apple's not picking it up which will mean devs still have good reason to stick with Cocoa and Carbon.

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Parallels does not have %100 compatibility either. Crossover can do 3D acceleration. Parallels can not.

In addition, Crossover integrates cleanly with OS X. Again, Parallels does not.

Classic does not have 100% compatibility either. Classic also had the advantage of coming from Apple, like OS X. I doubt that Crossover will achieve the same level of integration that Classic had.

Parallels will eventually be able to do 3D acceleration. It's still evolving, like Crossover is.

I still think Parallels will be more compatible with Windows software than Crossover.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Person Man 

I doubt that Crossover will achieve the same level of integration that Classic had.

Crossover can minimize to the dock, have it's windows in Expose, and create an OS X friendly start menu, in addition to supporting launching programs from the Finder.

Crossover already nearly has the same amount of integration as Classic, if not more already.

This is because every Windows program is wrapped in standard Aqua. Every Windows window is really an Aqua window.

[vmarks]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Crossover can minimize to the dock, have it's windows in Expose, and create an OS X friendly start menu, in addition to supporting launching programs from the Finder.

Crossover already nearly has the same amount of integration as Classic, if not more already.

This is because every Windows program is wrapped in standard Aqua. Every Windows window is really an Aqua window.

Aren't Crossover windows X11.app windows?

[goMac]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Aren't Crossover windows X11.app windows?

Right, they're using the Aqua X11 driver so they're X11 windows hosted under Aqua.

There is a full Aqua driver underway that makes Windows apps completely Aqua using native Aqua buttons and scrollbars and such. It's not done yet but you can compile the source for it in if you want.

Edit: actually the weird thing is they are running independent of X11.app, although X11 does need to be installed.

[kick52]

Originally Posted by goMac 

No. It's just like Parallels always has been, except with a transparent desktop wallpaper in Windows.

ahh.. i see now.

i thought that they couldnt have actually "seperated" the windows from the virtual machine.

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Crossover can minimize to the dock, have it's windows in Expose, and create an OS X friendly start menu, in addition to supporting launching programs from the Finder.

Crossover already nearly has the same amount of integration as Classic, if not more already.

This is because every Windows program is wrapped in standard Aqua. Every Windows window is really an Aqua window.

You're still sacrificing compatibility for integration, since the Windows APIs are being emulated. If that's fine for the software you need, then good. Crossover will be perfect for you.

But not everyone will be able to benefit from it. Especially for some of the more complex software. Office 2003, for example is still at the "bronze level."

From an integration standpoint, Crossover may be "red box like."

From a compatibility standpoint, Parallels Coherence may be "red box like."

Neither is perfect, and neither will be perfect. People will need to choose the best tool based on their needs.

[DeathMan]

I tried Crossover and the fonts were bunged. Parallels worked fine. Until Crossover 'just works' its not going to get very far within the community.

However, with "the community" being split more and more between "users" and "geeks" I'm sure Crossover will find its audience. It just won't be as large as it could be if they get their stuff all the way pulled together.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by DeathMan 

I tried Crossover and the fonts were bunged. Parallels worked fine. Until Crossover 'just works' its not going to get very far within the community.

I don't have font issues on Beta 3.

[Gossamer]

Office 2003 under Crossover crashed for me way to often...I just couldn't use it. I just installed the newest version of parallels and I'm playing with Vista and XP in Coherence mode...it's pretty cool.