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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Would you have switched to Windows if OS X was never created?

View Poll Results: What you have switched?
Poll Options:
I would have stayed with the Mac OS. 51 votes (56.04%)
I would have switched my only my business over to a flavor of Windows by now. 1 votes (1.10%)
I would have switched over my personal or my business over to a flavor of Windows by now. 23 votes (25.27%)
I would have switched over to Linux for my personal or business by now. 14 votes (15.38%)
I would have switched over to a different operating system not listed in this poll by now. 2 votes (2.20%)
Voters: 91. You may not vote on this poll
Would you have switched to Windows if OS X was never created?
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iDriveX
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Mar 6, 2006, 05:26 PM
 
As the post title says, instead of OS X being made, what if Apple just kept building on the OS 8/9 core and created OS 10 with more features? Would you have switched to Windows XP Pro? Switched to Linux? Or would you have continued on with your Mac?

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Chuckit
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Mar 6, 2006, 05:29 PM
 
That depends on how much they "built on" OS 9, I suppose.
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iDriveX  (op)
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Mar 6, 2006, 05:32 PM
 
OK, I'll clarify.

The system would be relatively unchanged at it's core, with the limitations that it had, BUT the developers had worked in some nice eye candy, like transparencies. Also all of the software independent of the OS like iLife, iWork, FCP Studio, etc. do exist for the platform.

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turtle777
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Mar 6, 2006, 05:38 PM
 
Hard to tell. I dunno...

-t
     
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Mar 6, 2006, 06:00 PM
 
It's hard to say... and thank goodness that they did come out with it... but I would have gone windows. There were just too many cool things you could do with Windows NT 4 that made OS 9 look very 1970's.

I still love the OS 9 look and feel, but without the rock solid nature of OS X, I would have switched... extensions were a nightmare unless you were an extensions nazi.
     
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Mar 6, 2006, 06:02 PM
 
I would have stayed with Mac OS. I'm a loyal Apple customer.

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production_coordinator
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Mar 6, 2006, 06:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by wdlove
I would have stayed with Mac OS. I'm a loyal Apple customer.
Side Question: If Apple switched to Windows NT for the kernel, would you still buy their hardware?
     
sek929
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Mar 6, 2006, 06:06 PM
 
Even with all OS9s problems I still would have stuck with the Mac.

Even Classic can't hold a candle to the BS I put up with M$ over the years.....so lesser of two evils I guess.

(side note: Thank GOD for OSX, that is all )
     
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:19 PM
 
The ONLY reason I still dont use OS 9 now is because of the lack of modern software to run on it. OS 9 was SIMPLE and FAST and stable enough if you knew how to deal with extenstions. I miss the old days
     
itai195
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:24 PM
 
Interesting. I switched to the Mac from Windows for OS X (and an original TiBook). I had to endure OS 9 for a couple months before OS X was released
     
olePigeon
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:29 PM
 
If they had stuck with OS 8/9, I would assume they would've finished the Copland project.

I don't know how Copland would've been like. It's be Classic, sure, but with real multitasking and protected memory. That would've been interesting.

Since we're dreaming, I'm going to pretend that Be became super successful and bought Apple for $14 billion, plus Amiga for $100. They'd combine the two on UltraSparc computers.
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:30 PM
 
Macs are really starting to suck again.
     
turtle777
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by JohnnyAppleseed
Macs are really starting to suck again.
Why ?

-t
     
bradoesch
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Mar 6, 2006, 07:48 PM
 
Definitely Classic Mac OS for my main machine. I would probably have a Linux/Windows box as well, for the occasional stuff I needed to do.
     
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Mar 6, 2006, 09:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by bboisvert
The ONLY reason I still dont use OS 9 now is because of the lack of modern software to run on it. OS 9 was SIMPLE and FAST and stable enough if you knew how to deal with extenstions. I miss the old days
You're kidding, right?
     
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Mar 6, 2006, 10:00 PM
 
This is such a stupid question, as it basically assumes the death of the Mac software platform. If OS X was not released there would have been something else from Apple, not just an update to 9 (maybe Copland). There's no way to judge what that would have been or if it would have been better than Windows.
     
iDriveX  (op)
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Mar 7, 2006, 12:11 AM
 
It's not a stupid question. I was just wondering if Mac OS X made the difference for anyone that was maybe "on the fence".

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mikemako
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Mar 7, 2006, 12:25 AM
 
I learned to use a computer with Windows 95 and 98, and switched to Mac in early 2001, right before OS X came out. I saw OS 9 as a giant step backwards coming from Windows and was really disappointed with my new Dual G4 Powermac 550MHz.

If OS X would not have been released a couple months later, I would have definitely switched back to Windows. OS X is brilliant and superior and fun. It kept me a Mac user.
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ReggieX
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Mar 7, 2006, 12:34 AM
 
Stay with the Mac. I don't see why I'd switch to something I hate using (Windows).
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Gamoe
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Mar 7, 2006, 01:50 AM
 
I would never switch to Windoze just because of what Microsoft represents and is, regardless of all the other practical reasons. I was fine with Classic Mac OS, and I would have definitely stayed with the Mac. In any case, I would have gotten a Linux box for some things, but I've done that anyway.

In case the Mac platform would have died I would have stayed as long as possible and switch full-time to Linux, unless another worthwhile alternative, like the BeOS or maybe the AmigaOS were around.
     
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Mar 7, 2006, 05:27 AM
 
I did switch. Went OS 9.x to Windows 2000. Couldn't stand the reliability (or lack thereof).
Used Windows for about a year. Came back to the Mac when OS X was released.
     
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Mar 7, 2006, 05:49 AM
 
If there was nice NeXT hardware, that would have been my first choice, since it is basically OS X. Otherwise maybe Linux. Possibly BeOS. I probably would have done the Linux thing on a Mac though.
     
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Mar 7, 2006, 08:34 AM
 
9.x seemed to be too buggy for me to trust it for business, but I haven't had any problems with X.
     
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Mar 7, 2006, 09:32 AM
 
I didn't even WANT a computer if I had to do stuff in DOS. The innovation of the Graphical User Interface by Xerox, which became the Macintosh made dealing with the small computer less of a bother. I had played with the Kaypro, Osborne, and the POS Radio Schlock machines. Yeeeccchh!
In the early days of Windows, the Mac was somewhere between OS 5.3 and 6. It was pretty stable, and had the Office Suite of apps, or you could use MacWrite, MacDraw, MacCalc or whatever, and Photoshop. You also had a Postscript printing system, while Microsoft was still unaware of proportional fonts. The Windows system just looked like a crappy copy/imitation of the Mac. MS thought that more bells and whistles made it better with little thought on usage.
     
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Mar 7, 2006, 11:36 AM
 
OS 9 wasn't all that bad... in fact, the Copland Finder (or parts of it, at least) was incorporated into OS 9, which made it capable of multi-threading. It was very usable for me at the time, and Windows didn't hold a candle it, stability problems or not.
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Mar 7, 2006, 12:04 PM
 
I bought a Mac for the first time when Mac OS X 10.1 came out.

OS 9 sucked @ss.
     
ryaxnb
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Mar 7, 2006, 01:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by mikemako
I learned to use a computer with Windows 95 and 98, and switched to Mac in early 2001, right before OS X came out. I saw OS 9 as a giant step backwards coming from Windows and was really disappointed with my new Dual G4 Powermac 550MHz.

If OS X would not have been released a couple months later, I would have definitely switched back to Windows. OS X is brilliant and superior and fun. It kept me a Mac user.
I have a personal vendetta against 98. I would have switched to Linux, but probably still kept an iMac around.
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Mar 7, 2006, 01:07 PM
 
The very idea of “switching” despite being outdated marketing dept. hype, is so 1998. Most tech-savvy people have long since figured out that it’s no more a big deal to use multiple computers/OSs than it is to have more than 1 set of clothes. Only those still stuck on the hopeless consumer cash-cow treadmill haven’t figured this out yet.

There’s no need to ‘switch’. Use every tool available.
     
sek929
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Mar 7, 2006, 01:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug Wanker
I bought a Mac for the first time when Mac OS X 10.1 came out.

OS 9 sucked @ss.
Compared to what?

ME? 98SE? Blech.

9 was super stable on my G4 (the iMac, now that was another situation) and I was able to get everything done that I needed to (and it was snappy™) OSX was useless for me until after 10.1 came out and my new machine didn't feel like a Celeron Dell.

I remember OS9 crashing often while trying to play games (hey, who uses Macs for games anyways?) but besides that it was sweet.
     
olePigeon
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Mar 7, 2006, 02:03 PM
 
I had fond memories of Mac OS 8.5. People claim that it crashed too much, but the only time it crashed for me was when I was using Netscape or fiddling with ResEdit.

I really got into the theming and stuff in 8.5. Downloaded the Apple themes plus other stuff.
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Mar 7, 2006, 02:04 PM
 
Windows 2000 beat OS 9 with an ugly stick.
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mania
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Mar 7, 2006, 10:11 PM
 
yeah - os 9 and below just cant cut it. when i first chose a mac it was because win 3.1 was the only other choice. had it been 95 or 98 i might have gone win. now os x blows away any win and any linux but i would still choose linux over win and of course over os 9.

one word.

stability.
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mania
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Mar 7, 2006, 10:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by mikemako
If OS X would not have been released a couple months later, I would have definitely switched back to Windows. OS X is brilliant and superior and fun. It kept me a Mac user.
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Eug Wanker
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Mar 7, 2006, 10:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929
Compared to what?

ME? 98SE? Blech.

9 was super stable on my G4 (the iMac, now that was another situation) and I was able to get everything done that I needed to (and it was snappy™) OSX was useless for me until after 10.1 came out and my new machine didn't feel like a Celeron Dell.

I remember OS9 crashing often while trying to play games (hey, who uses Macs for games anyways?) but besides that it was sweet.
You can't be serious. Compared to Windows 2000 of course. Both OS 9 and 2000 came out in 1999.

Even 98 was more stable than OS 9, but of course 98 sucked too.

P.S. I love the "OS 8/9 only crashed for me when..." statements.
     
Targon
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Mar 18, 2006, 07:38 AM
 
pretty stupid question IMO . Are you asking this as if Mac OS was to be frozen ie no further advancement?? If so does this apply to windows? Meaning windows 98 was the OS at the time so if XP was never created either ???

In either case id have stayed with the Mac without question. Mac OS 9x just needed protected memory and that was all i wished for and needed at the time. If Apple solved the problem with applications and the OS freezing id be content. Besides that Mac OS 9x performed far better for audio due to lower latencies than multitasking OS's.

But, im not complaining, OS X is very lovable. BeOS would have been better than NeXTSTEP for media centric ppl i still believe, there is just no need for all this unix stuff in this environment.
     
Targon
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Mar 18, 2006, 07:47 AM
 
"Even 98 was more stable than OS 9, but of course 98 sucked too"

NO FRELLING WAY !!! what a crock this is!!! If 98 screwed up and it did so very easily and often, you could not boot the machine and there was no way to fix it other than reformat and re-install. Critical system files tended to corrupt them selves frequently on that POS...in fact id go as far as saying it was the Worst OS the world have ever seen. A complete abomination and a shameful product!!!

In Mac OS, if u knew how to set up a system which only took about 1 hour tweeking, freezing and system lockups were not that frequent, and if the system did lockup, command->control->power and the machine would ALWAYS bootup again. Digidesigns Pro Tools was probably the most stable Mac OS 9x app id eva used. Im talkin 3-5 lockups in a 5 year period without exaggeration.
     
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Mar 18, 2006, 01:01 PM
 
My magic 8-ball says "Ask again later".

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Mar 18, 2006, 01:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by bboisvert
The ONLY reason I still dont use OS 9 now is because of the lack of modern software to run on it. OS 9 was SIMPLE and FAST and stable enough if you knew how to deal with extenstions. I miss the old days
And crashed when doing lots of Quark work.

Of course that could be Quark's fault... but an application being able to bring down the whole os.. ick. ..

I couldn't take that much longer.
     
Kevin
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Mar 18, 2006, 01:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
But, im not complaining, OS X is very lovable. BeOS would have been better than NeXTSTEP for media centric ppl i still believe, there is just no need for all this unix stuff in this environment.
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Mar 18, 2006, 05:37 PM
 
I would have stuck with OS 9. I actually stuck with 9 until Jaguar on my iBook. Then again I had a 333Mhz iMac at the time so OS X felt unusable. Anyway, I still have good memories of doing work on OS 9. Sure there were quirks, but if you learned the system well, you were fine! I was far more productive on OS 9 than I was on Windows at the time simply because the interface was better, and it was far more stable than Win 98!
     
Chuckit
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Mar 18, 2006, 06:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
But, im not complaining, OS X is very lovable. BeOS would have been better than NeXTSTEP for media centric ppl i still believe, there is just no need for all this unix stuff in this environment.
What "Unix stuff" are you talking about?
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Mar 18, 2006, 08:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit
What "Unix stuff" are you talking about?
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Targon
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Mar 18, 2006, 09:08 PM
 
Yes, how utterly stupid was Amelio. I still cannot believe how he was 'conned' by Jobs so easily. Amelio didn't want to pay any more than 50 mill for BeOS so he went and payed 427 mill for NeXT and it still Apple took 4 years to bring it to market and another 4 to get it usable. The Job's stabbed him in the back had him ousted. Biggest fsck up in Apple history IMO.

So what do we really have at the end of the day? A lethargic UI with 10 different inconsistent themes, broken networking, a POS Finder with no "Shelf' and right handed scroll bars, and a POS kernel which chokes during network and I/O calls. GREAAAAAAAT!!
     
turtle777
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
So what do we really have at the end of the day? A lethargic UI with 10 different inconsistent themes, broken networking, a POS Finder with no "Shelf' and right handed scroll bars, and a POS kernel which chokes during network and I/O calls. GREAAAAAAAT!!
Huh ? What are you talking about ?

-t
     
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:14 AM
 
No I would not have switched to windows, I'd still be on OS 9. By now it would have been OS 9.9.1 or something like that.
     
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:30 AM
 
I would have stuck with the Mac. I actually loved OS 9. Aside from the occasional lockup, 9.1 and up were really very solid, fast releases.

I find any claims that Windows 98 was more stable than any variant of 8.x or 9.x to be nothing more than the ramblings of people whose only experiences with the Classic Mac OS were on botched up and mistreated iMac G3s on display at places like Circuit City.
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:44 AM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
"Even 98 was more stable than OS 9, but of course 98 sucked too"

NO FRELLING WAY !!! what a crock this is!!! If 98 screwed up and it did so very easily and often, you could not boot the machine and there was no way to fix it other than reformat and re-install. Critical system files tended to corrupt them selves frequently on that POS...in fact id go as far as saying it was the Worst OS the world have ever seen. A complete abomination and a shameful product!!!

In Mac OS, if u knew how to set up a system which only took about 1 hour tweeking, freezing and system lockups were not that frequent, and if the system did lockup, command->control->power and the machine would ALWAYS bootup again. Digidesigns Pro Tools was probably the most stable Mac OS 9x app id eva used. Im talkin 3-5 lockups in a 5 year period without exaggeration.
Windows 98 was bad but not even the worst version of windows, anything before 3.1(other than Dos but that doesn't really count as windows)
Originally Posted by Targon
Yes, how utterly stupid was Amelio. I still cannot believe how he was 'conned' by Jobs so easily. Amelio didn't want to pay any more than 50 mill for BeOS so he went and payed 427 mill for NeXT and it still Apple took 4 years to bring it to market and another 4 to get it usable. The Job's stabbed him in the back had him ousted. Biggest fsck up in Apple history IMO.

So what do we really have at the end of the day? A lethargic UI with 10 different inconsistent themes, broken networking, a POS Finder with no "Shelf' and right handed scroll bars, and a POS kernel which chokes during network and I/O calls. GREAAAAAAAT!!
If you think that was the biggest mistake apple has ever made you have obviously never heard about apple accidentally giving microsoft rights to use a gui even though it was patented.
     
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
Yes, how utterly stupid was Amelio. I still cannot believe how he was 'conned' by Jobs so easily. Amelio didn't want to pay any more than 50 mill for BeOS so he went and payed 427 mill for NeXT and it still Apple took 4 years to bring it to market and another 4 to get it usable. The Job's stabbed him in the back had him ousted. Biggest fsck up in Apple history IMO.

So what do we really have at the end of the day? A lethargic UI with 10 different inconsistent themes, broken networking, a POS Finder with no "Shelf' and right handed scroll bars, and a POS kernel which chokes during network and I/O calls. GREAAAAAAAT!!

It would have taken 8 years to bring it to the market if Apple had to develop:

- A server OS based around an OS that was not designed for the enterprise

- A way to get standard Unix services to compile and function on the OS, included Apache, BIND, a MTA, Perl, PHP, OpenSSL, OpenSSH, etc. It is far from a given that these OSS developers would have hopped on board in helping Apple out

- Robust networking tools, an established developer environment and system comprised of several tools that interoperate with each other


Consolidating stuff with the Unix world was one of the smartest things Apple has ever done. Positioning the battle as Unix vs. Microsoft was much smarter than BeOS/Apple and Unix vs. Microsoft.
     
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Mar 19, 2006, 01:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
So what do we really have at the end of the day? A lethargic UI with 10 different inconsistent themes, broken networking, a POS Finder with no "Shelf' and right handed scroll bars, and a POS kernel which chokes during network and I/O calls. GREAAAAAAAT!!
As I recall from what I've heard (even from the people who created it), BeOS actually had shitty networking code. Just nobody noticed because it was before the days of the Intarwebnet. BSD, on the other hand, was a pioneer in computer networking. Whodathunkit?

And…all your other complaints really have nothing to do with the merits of BeOS vs. NeXTStep.
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Mar 19, 2006, 02:03 AM
 
Unix and Linux needs more props from many Mac users
     
 
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