Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Bose...car suspension?

Bose...car suspension?
Thread Tools
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 7, 2006, 02:24 PM
 
Bose
Scroll down and check out the videos on the bottom right, pretty cool stuff.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 7, 2006, 02:40 PM
 
Wow, cool.

I bet it's quite expensive.

-t
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 7, 2006, 02:44 PM
 
Knowing Bose, it would have to be.
     
GSixZero
Mac Elite
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 7, 2006, 02:51 PM
 
Heh. They basically built speakers for your car to ride on.

ImpulseResponse
     
CMYKid
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Dayton, OH
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 11:12 AM
 
its one of the few things that they make which does not suck and actually worth the associated price. These are VERY cool.
     
Y3a
Mac Elite
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Northern VA - Just outside DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 11:20 AM
 
They probably do lousy at THAT too!
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 11:41 AM
 
I have Bose speakers, and I'm still disturbed by how rich they sound compared to my modern system.
     
vmarks
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Up In The Air
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 11:41 AM
 
actually, it looks good. the real factor in whether it works or not is the computer controlling the power amplifiers.

Now that the concept is known, I wonder if something like the bowling and grippo open source fuel injection couldn't be done to control these: open source suspension computer, anyone?
     
Y3a
Mac Elite
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Northern VA - Just outside DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 11:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
I have Bose speakers, and I'm still disturbed by how rich they sound compared to my modern system.
The 12 foot long flute, and the pipe organ bass notes doubling are good too?
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 12:05 PM
 
I'd be interested to know what I listen to that contains those elements.
     
Eriamjh
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: BFE
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 12:12 PM
 

Looks crazy-expensive!

I'm a bird. I am the 1% (of pets).
     
olePigeon
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 1999
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 12:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by vmarks View Post
Now that the concept is known, I wonder if something like the bowling and grippo open source fuel injection couldn't be done to control these: open source suspension computer, anyone?
I'd hope so, after seeing what Windows does to cars. Scary.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
G4ME
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Maine
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 01:11 PM
 
I wonder what this does to the altinator, seeing that you are constantly changing the B field to keep things all nice you gotta be drawing power.

Also how much does this thing draw under normal highway driving, its still gotta be a bit more then not having it. making it rather pointless, waste of energy just for a good rider, i will take the extra MPG.

I GOT WASTED WITH PHIL SHERRY!!!
     
macfantn
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Nashville, TN
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 01:13 PM
 
all highs no lows, must be bose.
"I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later"
     
Y3a
Mac Elite
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Northern VA - Just outside DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 02:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by macfantn View Post
all highs no lows, must be bose.

Actually, the old saying was:

"No highs, no lows, it MUST BE Bose" referring to the Bose 901 series speakers.

The same speakers were referred to as "Blows 901's"
     
Eug
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Caught in a web of deceit.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 04:01 PM
 
Apostrophe alert!!!
     
OldManMac
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: I don't know anymore!
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 04:22 PM
 
Basic
Overpriced
Sound
Equipment
Why is there always money for war, but none for education?
     
smacintush
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Across from the wallpaper store.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 8, 2006, 04:51 PM
 
Glad to know I'm not the only one who thinks Bose is overpriced crap.
Being in debt and celebrating a lower deficit is like being on a diet and celebrating the fact you gained two pounds this week instead of five.
     
tooki
Admin Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 12:49 PM
 
It's not total crap, it's just way overpriced for what it is. For the same price as Bose, you can get a lot better, and conversely, you can get Bose quality for less money. That doesn't actually make the Bose bad -- it's still way better than the junk speakers most people have. Just not $1200 better. (I happen to like B&W.)

Anyhow, the Bose suspension looks vaguely related to the technology of maglev trains. Neato.

tooki
     
hayesk
Guest
Status:
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 01:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
I have Bose speakers, and I'm still disturbed by how rich they sound compared to my modern system.
What's a "modern" system?

Bose is overpriced and can't reproduce low-midrange very well.
     
tooki
Admin Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 07:07 PM
 
Indeed, just because something's modern doesn't mean it's good. Speaker design has changed little in 50 years -- and that's fine, because they were making great stuff back then, too. Quality is quality.

tooki
     
mitchell_pgh
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Washington, DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 07:14 PM
 
Please God, don't let this be the top secret stuff Apple will show us in January!
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 07:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk View Post
What's a "modern" system?
A surround sound system.
     
tooki
Admin Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 07:33 PM
 
Umm, surround is nothing new. Multichannel audio has been available since at least the 60s. And the number of speakers has nothing to do with their quality.

tooki
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 9, 2006, 07:35 PM
 
Has it been commonplace in houses very long?
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 01:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
Has it been commonplace in houses very long?
The whole 'home theater' idea didn't really catch on until the past 10 years or so. I'd be willing to bet the market for home theater amplifiers and such has really increased.
     
chabig
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Las Vegas, NV, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 02:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by G4ME View Post
I wonder what this does to the altinator, seeing that you are constantly changing the B field to keep things all nice you gotta be drawing power.
Altinator?
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
The whole 'home theater' idea didn't really catch on until the past 10 years or so. I'd be willing to bet the market for home theater amplifiers and such has really increased.
And as such, they are the more 'modern' system.
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
And as such, they are the more 'modern' system.
Agreed. My friend's dad has one of their higher end systems, I wasn't incredibly impressed. Definitely not bad, but I know there's better stuff out there.
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:43 AM
 
Well, I think my system is good for 5.1 (indeed DVD-Audio sounds great, let alone movies), but for listening to regular stereo cds it sounds like ****.
     
sek929
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Cape Cod, MA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 01:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by G4ME View Post
I wonder what this does to the altinator, seeing that you are constantly changing the B field to keep things all nice you gotta be drawing power.

Also how much does this thing draw under normal highway driving, its still gotta be a bit more then not having it. making it rather pointless, waste of energy just for a good rider, i will take the extra MPG.
I've read an article in MT about this new suspension system and 'they' say that the shocks regain 99% of the power used to absorb the road.

I dunno exactly how this is done, but apparently it uses tons of power, but gets most of it back.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 02:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
Well, I think my system is good for 5.1 (indeed DVD-Audio sounds great, let alone movies), but for listening to regular stereo cds it sounds like ****.
Well, you are comparing apples to oranges.

Listening to DVD sourround sound first, and then to a stereo CD source will inevitably leave you with the impression that he CD sounds like crap.
It's like watching a black & white silent movie on a big plasma TV, and declare that it looks like crap.

Duh, it's the source, stupid !

-t
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by what_the_heck View Post
Listening to DVD sourround sound first, and then to a stereo CD source will inevitably leave you with the impression that he CD sounds like crap.
It's like watching a black & white silent movie on a big plasma TV, and declare that it looks like crap.
No, no, CD in my surround sound system = sh�t.
Same CD in my old Technics system = warm and full

Edit: With the exception of my techno/electronica collection, but that's only because the sub-woofer does 90% of the work there.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
No, no, CD in my surround sound system = sh?t.
Same CD in my old Technics system = warm and full
Cheap sourround sound system then.

-t
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 03:39 PM
 
Well, I'm thinking it's the receiver's fault (When I had the Bose on it I noticed the low mid-ranges were decidedly absent). And yes, it nothing particularly special. Consumer level, obviously (though it's not an out-of-the-box surround system).

Edit: I also love how you think my modern system must be a piece of **** - rather than admit the Bose might actually sound good.
     
tooki
Admin Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 04:11 PM
 
As we've said, Bose isn't bad, it's just not the best, and certainly not the best you can get for the money.

What people were questioning you on was your implication that a system must be good because it's "modern". That is plain and simply not true. A good system is a good system, and a bad one is a bad one. You could buy great gear in the past, and you could buy junk in the past -- and you can buy great gear now, and you can buy junk. Something being "modern" doesn't mean it's good.

In any case, if your modern system doesn't sound good, then that means it's not good.

As for receivers... for the most part, they're interchangeable (features notwithstanding). Speakers make a vastly, vastly bigger difference in sound quality.

tooki
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 09:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by tooki View Post
What people were questioning you on was your implication that a system must be good because it's "modern". That is plain and simply not true. A good system is a good system, and a bad one is a bad one. You could buy great gear in the past, and you could buy junk in the past -- and you can buy great gear now, and you can buy junk. Something being "modern" doesn't mean it's good.
You have a point here.

Originally Posted by tooki View Post
In any case, if your modern system doesn't sound good, then that means it's not good.

As for receivers... for the most part, they're interchangeable (features notwithstanding). Speakers make a vastly, vastly bigger difference in sound quality.

tooki
As I've said, I feel that my 5.1 performance is more than satisfactory (Until I hear something that makes me think otherwise).
     
vmarks
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Up In The Air
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 09:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
I've read an article in MT about this new suspension system and 'they' say that the shocks regain 99% of the power used to absorb the road.

I dunno exactly how this is done, but apparently it uses tons of power, but gets most of it back.
Simple: A generator is an electromagnetic motor which takes the spinning shaft and puts power back in the battery rather than using a battery to drive the motor.

So if they use these electromagnet coils to suspend the car, when the car is bouncing on them instead of them pushing up on the car, the power is regenerated back into the battery. Think about those flashlights that you shake to generate the power to run the light.

Same principle as regenerative braking on a hybrid/electric car. The brakes go on, the spinning axles generate energy back into the battery.
     
hayesk
Guest
Status:
Reply With Quote
Dec 10, 2006, 10:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
As I've said, I feel that my 5.1 performance is more than satisfactory (Until I hear something that makes me think otherwise).
Sure, that makes sense. But the implication has been made here that somehow 5.1 surround is modern, and thus, good quality, or of better quality than CD stereo. This doesn't make any sense.

Quality is not number of channels. A good quality surround receiver can produce good two channel sound, just as a good quality two channel receiver from the 1970s can produce good two channel sound, or a modern two channel amplifier.

And a bad "modern" system can also sound bad, such as those all-in-one home theatre "kits."

Modern does not equal quality, surround does not equal quality, and Bose equals mediocre quality, for the price.
     
tooki
Admin Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 02:06 AM
 
Beautifully summarized!

tooki
     
G4ME
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Maine
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 11:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by vmarks View Post
So if they use these electromagnet coils to suspend the car, when the car is bouncing on them instead of them pushing up on the car, the power is regenerated back into the battery. Think about those flashlights that you shake to generate the power to run the light.
yes but there is still copper loss, if anyone knows anything about speaker design, heat is a big big issue, even if its not moving its still burning power, try hooking up a 9v battery to your speaker, its pretty much shorting out the battery.

I know they probably have found a work around to this, but still it is hard for me to get my head around it.

I GOT WASTED WITH PHIL SHERRY!!!
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 12:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by G4ME View Post
yes but there is still copper loss, if anyone knows anything about speaker design, heat is a big big issue, even if its not moving its still burning power, try hooking up a 9v battery to your speaker, its pretty much shorting out the battery.

I know they probably have found a work around to this, but still it is hard for me to get my head around it.
That's because a speaker is basically an inductive coil designed to be excited by a current. If you're hooking up a 9 volt battery to a speaker, you're providing a current. I think that the shocks won't regenerate enough power to make the net loss zero, but I do think that it will minimize the extra strain on the alternator. Heck, you could combine this with a battery or capacitor and the regenerative braking capabilities of that hybrid Mini that was posted here a while back and it'd be great.
     
G4ME
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Maine
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 01:11 PM
 
i under stand how it regenerates loss on bumpy roads,
but what about the power on smooth surfaces. Does it eat up a few watts on flat highway when the suspension isn't really moving?

I GOT WASTED WITH PHIL SHERRY!!!
     
Y3a
Mac Elite
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Northern VA - Just outside DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 02:04 PM
 
You'll NEVER get a studio (ideal listening environment) like area in a car so accurate loudspeakers are a joke anyway. Another gimic for the stupid.
     
G4ME
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Maine
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 02:10 PM
 
what are you referring to?

I GOT WASTED WITH PHIL SHERRY!!!
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 02:20 PM
 
Yeah, no one has said a thing about car audio.

But I would imagine that permanent magnets hold the car steady, while electromagnets only adjust for height. I could be entirely wrong as I haven't really read anything from the site but that's my guess.
     
G4ME
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Maine
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 02:50 PM
 
yeah, if thats ture, those are some nasty nasty magnets

I GOT WASTED WITH PHIL SHERRY!!!
     
Y3a
Mac Elite
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Northern VA - Just outside DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 04:23 PM
 
I looked at the system as described. If a magnet has a problem, You're hosed. If the power goes out, towing might ruin your vehicle. It uses feedback to assist in power available to the coils. I think that the driver will be lulled into overconfidence as to driving skills, and when the driver crosses over the limits of the equipment, like when the tires loose traction completly or something, then they may not have the skills to avoid an accident. Looks like some big expensive thing to break when you need it most.
     
macboy
Dedicated MacNNer
Join Date: Jan 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 04:27 PM
 
I love Bose. My girlfriend just got me the Companion II as a gift. They sound like nothing I've heard in my life. Probably cuz I've always just used my built-in laptop speakers, but still. They might not be worth $350 but they're certainly not "basic junk". The sound is absolutely chilling!
     
Gossamer  (op)
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 11, 2006, 04:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Y3a View Post
I looked at the system as described. If a magnet has a problem, You're hosed. If the power goes out, towing might ruin your vehicle. It uses feedback to assist in power available to the coils. I think that the driver will be lulled into overconfidence as to driving skills, and when the driver crosses over the limits of the equipment, like when the tires loose traction completly or something, then they may not have the skills to avoid an accident. Looks like some big expensive thing to break when you need it most.
Yeah, the car would have to be suspended by permanent magnets, otherwise when you shut off the car or cut power, it would just drop to the ground.

For example, when the Bose suspension encounters a pothole, power is used to extend the motor and isolate the vehicle's occupants from the disturbance. On the far side of the pothole, the motor operates as a generator and returns power back through the amplifier. In so doing, the Bose suspension requires less than a third of the power of a typical vehicle's air conditioner system.
So it sounds like gas mileage would take a (very small) hit, not to mentioned this all most likely weighs more than a simple spring and strut combination. But this is definitely a great innovation and I'm excited to see what new developments are made.
     
 
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:15 AM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,