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wowway1 · Jun 27, 2006, 01:27 PM

Hi all,

Really REALLY eyeballing a new Macbook, after playing with one for the first time the other day. I do travel quite a bit so the size is appealing. Because I do travel I like to catch a little WoW when my connectivity will allow for it, and was wondering what real-life experiences have been. I do a lot of BG, and during the week we do raid ZG and AQ20.

Playable or no? I mean if I have to go the Pro route I guess I will but was curious what you've experienced.

Thanks.

Chuckit · Jun 27, 2006, 04:29 PM

From what I've heard, the framerate is a bit better than the old iBook, but not as good as the PowerBook. So somewhere around 15 fps on average. You'll want to get a RAM upgrade if you buy one, though, because I've found WOW sucks on anything with less than a gig of RAM — you'll go from 40 fps to 4 fps whenever an object has to load.

wowway1 · Jun 27, 2006, 04:47 PM

We'll I've *heard* that WoW runs better on the Macbook than the old last-gen G4 powerbooks with dedicated video. Thanks for the feedback, but I'm looking for real-world experiences.

Thanks.

Colonel Panic · Jun 27, 2006, 08:55 PM

maybe a little better than the prior gen ibook 1.33.

ok for soloing, guess.

crowded areas or grouping where you need to keep an eye on multiple characters, not so OK.

this is using 10.4.7 on a core duo 2.0 macbook with 1GB. YMMV.

wowway1 · Jun 27, 2006, 09:06 PM

thank you

videian28 · Jun 29, 2006, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by Colonel Panic

maybe a little better than the prior gen ibook 1.33.

ok for soloing, guess.

crowded areas or grouping where you need to keep an eye on multiple characters, not so OK.

this is using 10.4.7 on a core duo 2.0 macbook with 1GB. YMMV.

have you tried it in bootcamp? any difference?

Beepcake · Jul 6, 2006, 05:48 PM

2.0 2gig here. Haven't played it heavily, but with 30mins or so of play the framerate tops out about 40fps, dipping to 12-14 fps in Lagforge.

Haven't tried it in Bootcamp.

Heebs · Jul 18, 2006, 10:21 AM

Just as a comparisson...

I have a Alienware desktop with dual GForce 6800's in SLI mode with an AMD 64 3800+ with 2 gigs of DDR2 ram and I was only topping out at ~40fps in IF during peak hours.

I used to have a powerbook G4 with 756 RAM and it ran everything fine so I imagine that the new Macbook should be better. IF was laggy though, but with the new additions, SW is a great alternative.

lamewing · Jul 26, 2006, 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by Heebs

Just as a comparisson...

I have a Alienware desktop with dual GForce 6800's in SLI mode with an AMD 64 3800+ with 2 gigs of DDR2 ram and I was only topping out at ~40fps in IF during peak hours.

I used to have a powerbook G4 with 756 RAM and it ran everything fine so I imagine that the new Macbook should be better. IF was laggy though, but with the new additions, SW is a great alternative.

That is WEIRD. I have a handbuilt system with a single BFG GForce 6600GT, AMD 64 3700 (San Diego), 1GB of DDR 2 (Crucial Budget RAM) and I get 50+ in Ironforge during peak hours with all eye-candy turned on...oh, minus full-screen glow....1280x1024. What is your resolution?

I am selling this system since I bought a 360 (and soon a Wii) to buy a Macbook Pro. The new rev with the Merom chips should be cooler and faster. Once those are out, I'll be all over it.

Chuckit · Jul 26, 2006, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by Heebs

I used to have a powerbook G4 with 756 RAM and it ran everything fine so I imagine that the new Macbook should be better. IF was laggy though, but with the new additions, SW is a great alternative.

By most accounts, the MacBook is slightly worse than the last-generation PowerBook. Keep in mind that the MacBook is basically a successor to the iBook, not the PowerBook.

MartiNZ · Aug 1, 2006, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by Beepcake

2.0 2gig here. Haven't played it heavily, but with 30mins or so of play the framerate tops out about 40fps, dipping to 12-14 fps in Lagforge.

Haven't tried it in Bootcamp.

Wow that's impressive - that's with graphics settings down low? I don't get nearly that good FPS on my 12" PowerBook 1.5GHz with maxed out RAM.

Chuckit · Aug 1, 2006, 12:49 AM

Really? That's about what I get on a 1.5 GHz 15" with 1 GB RAM.

wadesworld · Aug 1, 2006, 02:48 AM

I believe Blizzard has said that performance is not where it should be and they're continuing to work with Apple and the graphics card companies to improve it.

cSurfr · Aug 22, 2006, 03:01 AM

Originally Posted by wadesworld

I believe Blizzard has said that performance is not where it should be and they're continuing to work with Apple and the graphics card companies to improve it.

Unfortunately that is something that they have been telling us since closed beta over what. . . almost 2 years ago?

rbarris · Sep 7, 2006, 12:54 AM

I believe that for machines that have dual core Intel processors and discrete GPU's (MacBook Pro, iMac, MacPro Xeon) you will basically see frame rate parity between WoW/OS X and WoW/Windows on the same hardware, by the end of 2006, if not a little bit sooner. There was a lot of work that had to get done.

In point of fact Apple has now released several key improvements to OpenGL including a multithreaded driver which offloads a lot of GL processing to the second core, and some more subtle streamlining improvements to data handling which shipped in the 10.4.7 software update. Systems that have all of these features on the OS out of the box include the Mac Pro and the newest iMac.

Obviously we would be pleased if all these features became available for the existing installed base of Intel systems as well as the still sizable PowerPC systems, but it is not yet clear or public which systems will get that support and when in OSX 10.4.x or 10.5.x.

The next major patch to WoW after 1.12.1, will activate the newest multi threading extension on hardware which supports it. This will be a big deal. Using it I can get nearly 200% solid CPU utilization on a MacBook Pro while cruising around Ironforge crowds at 60-70FPS... these new Intel systems are really fast and the dual cores are a perfect fit for the new MT GL.

I've also prepared some new tricks for the existing PowerPC OpenGL code which we will ship in an optional form for 1.12.1. Optional only because the change was made very late in order to make the 1.12.1 deadline, so it will be a "thrill seekers only" switch - good for maybe 5-15% more FPS depending on scene and hardware.

On the topic of machines with integrated GPU (MacBook and Intel Mini), we have made a lot of feedback available to Apple on their performance under current drivers, and we hope to see some motion in Leopard that makes a difference there.

Chuckit · Sep 7, 2006, 05:04 AM

Neat, rbarris. Is the optional optimization going to be in the options dialog, or do we need to know the secret handshake?

Big Mac · Sep 7, 2006, 09:24 AM

It's great to know that the PPC code base isn't being ignored. Blizzard's the best.

Chuckit · Sep 7, 2006, 05:43 PM

Yeah. Blizzard's Mac support has always really amazed me, especially considering how other companies generally ignore us.

rbarris · Sep 7, 2006, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

Neat, rbarris. Is the optional optimization going to be in the options dialog, or do we need to know the secret handshake?

secret handshake, little text file you drop in preferences, nothing fancy.

variant · 01:35 PM

Since I've had trouble finding info on this, and I have a Macbook 2.0 duo with 2gb ram, I thought I'd register here and post for the other searchers

Performance on the Macbook (not Pro) of WoW running OSX, compared to Windows under bootcamp, is simply abysmal.

Under Boot camp XP, I can run at native res (1280x800) in ironforge with most settings turned down, but with a little bit of view distance, and achieve COMPLETELY playable framerates (maybe, maybe dipping to 20-25 in Ironforge during peak times). 40-60 outside soloing.

Under Mac OSX? Forget it... try 2-3 FPS in LOWER res (1024x600) in the same conditions. The Apple driver for the Intel integrated graphics simply sucks.. it sucks balls. I play in a window of 1024x600 and stare at the ground in order to move around in Ironforge and not fall into the pit... its a good thing I know the place.

So.. the hardware itself is just fine for playing WoW at native res (1280x800) ... under WINDOWS... with boot camp. However, don't do anything under OSX with it unless you only look at your mailbox and the AH. Its sad.. I hope Apple can get their driver for this thing fixed.

You can get sort of decent performance in OSX if you make sure you turn off "Vertex shaders" in the video options, even though it says they speed performance - they slow it down like crazy under OSX. I went from roughly 6 FPS to about 18 FPS in Stormwind at 1024x600 after turning those off. Slightly better, but still horrible compared to Windows in Bootcamp. I just hate rebooting just to play WoW

variant · Sep 13, 2006, 01:47 PM

Hmm.. after turning off that Vertex Shaders option (again, I had left it on because it says in the tooltip that it improves performance), playability on the Macbook under OSX is much better. It is still a good 30% less than Windows under Bootcamp, but its playable at least. YMMV...

Chuckit · Sep 13, 2006, 02:09 PM

You don't have full screen glow on, do you?

variant · 03:01 PM

Nope, all shaders off.

The bottom line is that the performance of WoW with the exact same settings is FAR worse than it is under boot camp with Windows XP with the exact same settings.. my guess would be at least 50% worse in most cases, and sometimes more.

rbarris · Sep 13, 2006, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by variant

Nope, all shaders off.

The bottom line is that the performance of WoW with the exact same settings is FAR worse than it is under boot camp with Windows XP with the exact same settings.. my guess would be at least 50% worse in most cases, and sometimes more.

We're aware of the performance deficit under OS X and have some new work in store that should help.

On the current version of WoW, best settings on a machine like that are to have the one checkbox "enable all shaders" on, and the rest below it turned off.

Enable-all-shaders engages our pixel shader based terrain renderer. The Intel chip does have a pixel shader so this accelerates drawing of the world. It does not have a vertex shader which is why you should leave everything else 'off'.

Also, the current version of OpenGL on OS X on the MacBook, does not play the same multithreading tricks that DirectX does, and we hope that this feature becomes more widely available (it is shipping in OpenGL on MacPro and the newest iMac models).

So, it's a situation we're all too aware of, and we're working on it.

Randman · Sep 14, 2006, 03:59 AM

Well, it's a Pro model (17, 2GB of ram) that I just got but the improvement in performance over my 1.5 ghz PB 17 is amazing. Tried the BP last night and was getting around 5 fps in Lagforge. Switched to the new MacBook Pro and was getting 55+ doing same thing.

BWL didn't drop below 35 tonight, even in suppression room and Nef encounter.