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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > I hate this AluBook

I hate this AluBook
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christ
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Jan 4, 2006, 04:42 PM
 
[rant]I now have a 1.67 GHz, 15" 120 Gb, AluBook with 1 Gb of RAM.

I had a 15" 667 TiPB.

The new one sucks.

Pros:
It is a bit quicker (not as much as I would have expected, replacing a 3 year old machine)
The screen has a better resolution.
It is quieter
More eye-candy works

Cons:

It won't sleep properly (may or may not sleep, and if it does, it may or may not awake) When it won't awaken, it requires a hard reboot, with frequent PMU resets)

The edge of the base (where the wrists sit) is sharp, making typing without an external keyboard dashed uncomfortable (smooth on the TiPB)

The back of the machine, below the hinge lid (where you carry it, if you don't have a bag) is sharp (Knobbly on the TiPB - uncomfortable but not painful)

It is slippery, and a constant drop risk (Matt, giving a firm grip, on the TiPB)

It is bigger. (feels and looks a lot bigger, although it is only a few mm here and there)

10.4.3 is unstable on it (rock solid on the TiPB) Average uptime less than a day (exacerbated, of course, by the sleep problem) as opposed to uptimes of 30-40 days on the TiPB

You can't get a docking station for it (Bookendz worked fine on the TiPB)

Additional Ethernet Card in PC Card Slot only has partial capability (worked solidly in TiPB)

Locations don't change smoothly, often require reboot, would you believe.

(and this is the second one that I have had in a month,the first one had a non-functional lid catch on arrival, and when all of the above happened on that one, I thought that it was a one-off bad machine. Wrong.)

AND this is without any of the traditional errors (white patches, stripes etc.) How can Apple justify this huge step backwards?

For those of you thinking of a new 'book, my advice is "WAIT".[/end rant]
( Last edited by christ; Jan 7, 2006 at 10:37 AM. )
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
Love Calm Quiet
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Jan 4, 2006, 04:53 PM
 
I made virtually the same move as you (667 TiBook to 1.5 ALBook/80GB). The flaking paint on my Ti is NOT missed at all. Love the solid feel of the hings on this (TiBook's finally broke).
10.4.3 completely stable (touch wood).
I *was*, however, surprised that it does NOT feel twice as fast. Only marginally faster.
Sleep/wake work perfectly - just faster.
TOMBSTONE: "He's trashed his last preferences"
     
ibook_steve
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Jan 4, 2006, 07:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by christ
I now have a 1.67 GHz, 15" 120 Gb, AluBook with 1 Gb of RAM.

Cons:

It won't sleep properly (may or may not sleep, and if it does, it may or may not awake) When it won't awaken, it requires a hard reboot, with frequent PMU resets)

The edge of the base (where the wrists sit) is sharp, making typing without an external keyboard dashed uncomfortable (smooth on the TiPB)

The back of the machine, below the hinge lid (where you carry it, if you don't have a bag) is sharp (Knobbly on the TiPB - uncomfortable but not painful)

It is slippery, and a constant drop risk (Matt, giving a firm grip, on the TiPB)

It is bigger. (feels and looks a lot bigger, although it is only a few mm here and there)

10.4.3 is unstable on it (rock solid on the TiPB) Average uptime less than a day (exacerbated, of course, by the sleep problem) as opposed to uptimes of 30-40 days on the TiPB

You can't get a docking station for it (Bookendz worked fine on the TiPB)

Additional Ethernet Card in PC Card Slot only has partial capability (worked solidly in TiPB)

Locations don't change smoothly, often require reboot, would you believe.

(and this is the second one that I have had in a month,the first one had a non-functional lid catch on arrival, and when all of the above happened on that one, I thought that it was a one-off bad machine. Wrong.)

AND this is without any of the traditional errors (white patches, stripes etc.) How can Apple justify this huge step backwards?

For those of you thinking of a new 'book, my advice is "WAIT".
Wow. Where should I start?

1) sleep problems and instability: You could try a number of things instead of complaining about it: run Disk Utility to fix any errors or repair permissions. If you are still having problems, simply do a clean install of the OS. It's not that hard. It's unfortunate that your machine arrived with problems, but it's very easy to fix. If that doesn't work, you could have problems with your RAM. Try swapping slots or try another memory stick.

2) sharp edges: You must have really big hands if they are resting on the front edge of the machine. Besides that, my wrists go over the edge and never push down on the edge with any force unless the Powerbook is raised up. Other than that, the darker gray bumper is is softer than aluminum. As for complaining about the edge below the hinge lid in the back, you've got to be kidding. Put it in a bag if it's so bad.

3) slippery, bigger: There are matted stickers available to help with the slipperiness, though again, you could use a bag. As for it being bigger, it's really not much bigger as you've mentioned, and why is that so bad anyway?

4) Bookendz dock: Sure looks like they have one to me:

http://www.fortune3.com/BookEndz/Doc...erBook_G4.html

5) ethernet card: not sure what you need an extra ethernet port for since the built-in one works fine. And what is partial about it's operation? Something like that I would imagine either works or it doesn't.

6) Locations: see #1.

I can only guess that this is an initial bitch list. Calm down. Read my suggestions and others in the forum, and everything will be all right.

Steve
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
1) sleep problems and instability: You could try a number of things instead of complaining about it: run Disk Utility to fix any errors or repair permissions. If you are still having problems, simply do a clean install of the OS. It's not that hard. It's unfortunate that your machine arrived with problems, but it's very easy to fix. If that doesn't work, you could have problems with your RAM. Try swapping slots or try another memory stick.

Thanks for the input.

I have been using Macs for decades, and support them professionally for a living.

I have tried everything on your list, and dozens of things besides. These problems were with a brand new, fresh out of the box, factory configured machine from Apple, and the problems have been exactly replicated on a replacement machine, also factory configured.

None of the stuff that I had to do was "that hard", after all it's still a mac, but it is time consuming, and - worst of all - ineffective.

No logs indicate any issue with the machine, and after a hard reboot, after the machine refuses to wake from sleep, there is no indication anywhere that anything out of the ordinary has just happened. Dusk Utility and Applejack (and fsck) don't find anything wrong. Maybe all of my RAM, from Apple, has been bad. That would merit a gripe of its own.

Stick to your iBook, Steve.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:44 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
2) sharp edges: You must have really big hands if they are resting on the front edge of the machine. Besides that, my wrists go over the edge and never push down on the edge with any force unless the Powerbook is raised up. Other than that, the darker gray bumper is is softer than aluminum. As for complaining about the edge below the hinge lid in the back, you've got to be kidding. Put it in a bag if it's so bad.
Thanks again for your input.

I rest my wrists on my desk when I type, and when I am typing on the PB, my wrists rest on the front edge of the machine. On the TiPB, the front edge of the machine was (1) not as tall, and (2) more rounded. The combination of the height and sharp edge of the "soft bumper" cuts into my wrists.

I'm certainly not kidding about the edge belo the hinge - I often carry my 'book about "naked", and the sharp edge below the hinge cuts my hand - This was a perfectly comfortable thing to do with the TiPB, (and most other laptops on the market, by the way) so why should I "put it in a bag" to carry it around the campus?

(Although I do agree that the hinge appears sturdier than the TiPB's, I never had any structural problems with that of the TiPB in 3+ years of abuse)
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
Even more input - I am the lucky boy

3) slippery, bigger: There are matted stickers available to help with the slipperiness, though again, you could use a bag. As for it being bigger, it's really not much bigger as you've mentioned, and why is that so bad anyway?
Why should I buy after market cr@p to stick on a brand new machine. It's as if Apple didn't intend for this portable to be carried.

As for it being bigger, it is bigger. That is a bad thing in portable equipment, and a retrograde step. One of the things that made the TiPB so sweet was its size. If size doesn't bother you, I know a man that can sell you a DELL.

- although you are a little right, it is still a better form factor than the iBook.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:52 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
4) Bookendz dock: Sure looks like they have one to me:

http://www.fortune3.com/BookEndz/Doc...erBook_G4.html
Woah! Potentially useful input!

But of course, I have read the reviews of the new Bookendz, and it is apparently a bugger to use, and doesn't affix easily to the 'book. Not Bookendz fault, but Apple's. This is the one area of my bitch that could be applied across Apple's whole range rather than just to my machine - why not provide a docking station port? It's good enough for the iPod ...
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
5) ethernet card: not sure what you need an extra ethernet port for since the built-in one works fine. And what is partial about it's operation? Something like that I would imagine either works or it doesn't.
I'm not sure why I should have to explain to you, but I need two ethernet ports on my machine, for two different networks. (plus the airport for a third).

When I use the internal NIC preferentially, I cannot resolve addresses through the additional NIC.

When I use the additional NIC preferentially, I cannot resolve addresses through the internal NIC.

This worked flawlessly with the TiPB, with address resolution on both NICs working all of the time.

So your imagination has run away with you. Thanks again for your input.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
I can only guess that this is an initial bitch list. Calm down. Read my suggestions and others in the forum, and everything will be all right.

Steve
Where would I be without you.

My advice remains - Don't buy one of these turkeys.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
Dr.Michael
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:59 AM
 
I agree with christ that the Aluminium powerbooks are not as nice as the TiPb. The Ti always felt astonishingly small and graceful.

But I had the typing problem also on the Ti. I never mistyped as much as on the Ti keyboard. I solved this problem with a 12 inch powerbook. The wrists have a perfect location on that machine.

And for the speed: try to go back to your 667 Ti after a couple of days or weeks and compare then. I also had the impression that my 1GHz machine was not that much faster compared to my 500 MHz Ti (and the 500 MHz Pismo). But going back to a 867Mhz Ti a year ago (after 1 year with the Aluminium book) showed the differences very clearly.
     
siflippant
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Jan 5, 2006, 06:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by christ
Where would I be without you.

My advice remains - Don't buy one of these turkeys.
Sorry for the problems you've had man... but why all the individual replies with quotes when you can do all of that in one reply? It's a good way to get your post count up...

Hey, I was only asking...

Yup, you're right about waiting too... I'm hoping to pick up a rev b. Intel based laptop in the 3rd quarter this year? (Or whenever it will be released for that matter)

     
analogika
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Jan 5, 2006, 07:57 AM
 
Odd. My 1.5 GHz Alubook is rock-solid, including 10.4.3.

Unless I've misread, you haven't actually removed the additional RAM from the machine to see if that helps?

Try it. The Hardware Test CD coming up nought doesn't indicate all is well. It's more of a "if it sees a problem then something is definitely broken" program.

IME, OS X only becomes instable when hardware is defective, and 99% of the time, it's RAM.

I had one customer where random programs would crash unpredictably, and his iPod wasn't recognized on the machine. New RAM, and the application crashes stopped, but the iPod still wasn't seen. Turns out he'd re-installed Mac OS X while the defective RAM was in the machine, resulting in a corrupted install.
Re-installed without the defective RAM, and his iPod worked normally.

Defective RAM does very weird voodoo (and it's not something you can blame Apple for).
     
BENJMNS
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Jan 5, 2006, 10:11 AM
 
the alu powerbook is a classic design that'll look modern for at least a couple of more years. unless the next pB design is truly radical with much improved screens and some different/better/innovative way of inputting info, this G4 has got enough kick to last quite a while.

time will tell.

btw, i just relented and spent $300 for a 1 gig mem stick at the apple store. had them install it on my new 17" hi-res. if stuff happens, they can't say crapola.
     
JKT
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Jan 5, 2006, 10:23 AM
 
Out of interest, did you use Migration Assistant to transfer your account to the new PB? If so, you may have carried over something incompatible with the new PB that is causing your OS woes wrt to sleeping the system, etc.

It might be worthwhile testing out a new user account to see if it suffers similar problems and if it doesn't, trying to track down the reason for your problem in your usual account (e.g. temp remove preferences to desktop etc).
     
ibook_steve
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Jan 5, 2006, 02:36 PM
 
OK, I don't really need crappy smartass replies like this when I'm trying to help. This is still just a bitch list, plain and simple. For your information, I haven't used an iBook in years since I started working on Powerbooks at Apple. But iBook_steve stuck since that's what I registered in the forums. I worked at Apple until last February for over 4 years on iBook and Powerbook hardware design. I did not work specifically on the 15", but the guys who did worked down the hall from me and we worked together all the time. I'm not sure what you were trying to get out of this post: help and suggestions, annoyances, what? Most of these issues you could have figured out you didn't like by using the machine in an Apple store before you bought it. So the question remains: why did you even buy this and then decide to come here and complain incessantly about it? And who doesn't have a bag they carry their machine around in? You certainly don't live up to your forum name. I'm sorry that you're having problems, but the attitude you bring with those problems just annoys me. There are much more civil ways to complain about the problems with your machine that most people here don't have or would not even think were problems in the first place. Good luck with your machine or any replacement you may get. I'm sure there must be some way Apple can make you happy again.

Steve
     
Al G
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Jan 5, 2006, 02:42 PM
 
Just a wild guess--and you may have already done the necessary troubleshooting but you didn't say--but I'll bet your sleep and instability problems are due to the ethernet PC card (and its drivers if it has any). You need to eliminate it as the source of the problem first. Again, maybe you already did, but you didn't say. Then you can move on to suspecting RAM, etc. Were you also running 10.4.3 on the Tibook?

As for the sharp edges when you carry the book, simply flip it around and carry it with the front down.

The sharp-edge-on-the-wrist-while-typing problem can be solved by any number of physical methods. A Coolpad which places the book at an angle is the first that comes to mind.
Your Mac could help understand and cure disease
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 04:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by ibook_steve
OK, I don't really need crappy smartass replies like this when I'm trying to help. This is still just a bitch list, plain and simple. For your information, I haven't used an iBook in years since I started working on Powerbooks at Apple. But iBook_steve stuck since that's what I registered in the forums. I worked at Apple until last February for over 4 years on iBook and Powerbook hardware design. I did not work specifically on the 15", but the guys who did worked down the hall from me and we worked together all the time. I'm not sure what you were trying to get out of this post: help and suggestions, annoyances, what? Most of these issues you could have figured out you didn't like by using the machine in an Apple store before you bought it. So the question remains: why did you even buy this and then decide to come here and complain incessantly about it? And who doesn't have a bag they carry their machine around in? You certainly don't live up to your forum name. I'm sorry that you're having problems, but the attitude you bring with those problems just annoys me. There are much more civil ways to complain about the problems with your machine that most people here don't have or would not even think were problems in the first place. Good luck with your machine or any replacement you may get. I'm sure there must be some way Apple can make you happy again.

Steve

I'm glad that you work in hardware design, not customer support, Steve. The best answer to someone's question is not "do something else instead". I am amused that your answer to a hardware design problem (slippy case) is 'use some third part add on'.

Why did I buy it? Because I am the lone Apple user in a PC using office, and as I get to choose the IT, I wanted to stick with Apple's latest and greatest, but the 17" was too big - so I chose the 15". If I don't like it, I have no choice, as Apple don't give me any. I assume that you, an Apple employee, are not telling me to buy a competitor because your design sucks?

I have a bag that I carry the machine in - I just don't use it to paddle a few hundred yards around the place (and Al -you can't realistically carry it the other way up without inadvertently hitting the latch and opening the case.)

Dead right it is a bitch list, and that is why it is posted at MacNN - my posts at Apple discussions are a lot less peevish, but here I was letting off steam and advising the rest of the potential mac-buying public to beware.

I am sorry that my attitude to cr@ppy hardware annoys you - I just paid good money for something that is an appreciable step backwards in usability and ergonomics from its predecessor from the same company.

(The tip about the bookendz was, as I noted, potentially useful, and for that I forgot to thank you. Sorry.)
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 04:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by siflippant
Sorry for the problems you've had man... but why all the individual replies with quotes when you can do all of that in one reply? It's a good way to get your post count up...
One post per point, easier and more readable than "slicing and dicing" the quoted post.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 5, 2006, 04:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by JKT
Out of interest, did you use Migration Assistant to transfer your account to the new PB? If so, you may have carried over something incompatible with the new PB that is causing your OS woes wrt to sleeping the system, etc.
This may well be the case. I had 30 Gb of accumulated stuff on the TiPB, and I used the Migration Assistant on both new 'books. It seemed to me that Apple's tool wouldn't copy across stuff that would break the new machine, but this looks like the next sensible step. Unfortunately this is going to mean a week-long migration instead of a half-day. That'll teach me to take the short-cuts, even when they are Apple supplied and encouraged.

(PS - to all the helpful chaps above, I have changed out the RAM, and the sleep issues occur without the add-on Ethernet PC Card)
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
JKT
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Jan 5, 2006, 04:57 PM
 
Well, given the age of your last Mac, it is likely to have picked up a degree of cruft along the way (unless you clean formatted relatively recently). It might be worth your while doing an archive and install of the OS and avoid copying over preferences to see if you get a more stable system for a few days. Then re-install software and drivers.

For future reference, IIRC Migration Assistant does offer a reasonable degree of flexibility as to what gets copied over, so it may be wiser to avoid things that may cause issues.
     
tooki
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:33 PM
 
Originally Posted by christ
Dead right it is a bitch list, and that is why it is posted at MacNN - my posts at Apple discussions are a lot less peevish, but here I was letting off steam and advising the rest of the potential mac-buying public to beware.
Pure rants are no more welcome here, in one of the technical forums, than they are at Apple. Post if you want help, and if people offer it, accept it graciously. Lashing out at those who are trying to help is not helpful, and unwelcome here.

Regardless, the problems you describe are not universal for the product. Either you have a lemon, or something in your hardware or software configuration is wonky.

The sole exception is the front edge of the machine: I have the same problem with that sharp edge.

tooki
     
siflippant
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Jan 5, 2006, 05:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by christ
One post per point, easier and more readable than "slicing and dicing" the quoted post.
Sweet

     
mrmister
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Jan 5, 2006, 11:59 PM
 
"Pure rants are no more welcome here, in one of the technical forums, than they are at Apple. Post if you want help, and if people offer it, accept it graciously. Lashing out at those who are trying to help is not helpful, and unwelcome here."

You're the boss--but christ is well within bounds here. He addressed every piece of "advice" ibook_steve gave clearly and completely, even thanking him for the solitary piece that was actually partially useful.
     
analogika
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Jan 6, 2006, 04:17 AM
 
FWIW, I also have no problems carrying about my Powerbook without the latch opening or badly injuring myself on sharp, cutty edges.


But that's probably because I have big hands...
     
brokenjago
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Jan 6, 2006, 06:50 AM
 
You know what they say about guys with big hands, right?





They wear big gloves.
Linkinus is king.
     
Matt
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Jan 6, 2006, 10:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by christ
Why should I buy after market cr@p to stick on a brand new machine. It's as if Apple didn't intend for this portable to be carried.

As for it being bigger, it is bigger. That is a bad thing in portable equipment, and a retrograde step. One of the things that made the TiPB so sweet was its size. If size doesn't bother you, I know a man that can sell you a DELL.

- although you are a little right, it is still a better form factor than the iBook.

Well the Powerbook is make for pros. Most pros like to take care of their $1000+ laptops, and therefore it is expected that you would get a case.
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jmgriff
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Jan 6, 2006, 10:49 AM
 
FWIW I also had mixed feelings moving from a Titanium Powerbook (550MHz) to a 12" Aluminium (1.33GHz). I appreciate the extra performance, though it isn't as noticable in everyday use as you'd expect, and the keyboard is wonderful. I agree though about the smooth aluminium surface ... not great on a laptop that you carry around. The Tibooks certainly had issues (flaking paint and weak/overstiff hinges being two, though I suffered from neither personally) but I've always thought it a more comfortable and elegant design. I was surprised at how much larger the current powerbooks look. The 12"s hinge side is indeed sharp, and while the keyboard is excellent I also feel the front digging in to my wrists after long periods. I don't think it unreasonable to expect that ergonomic issues like this would be addressed in the Powerbook design.

But I certainly don't hate the 12", it has proved itself a workhorse, and aside from the above I don't think christs experiences are typical. I would imagine you've just been very unlucky in receiving two lemons, although I've heard several people recently who have had to return multiple new powerbooks before getting one without issues ... perhaps Apple's quality control is slipping.
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 6, 2006, 12:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by Matt
Well the Powerbook is make for pros. Most pros like to take care of their $1000+ laptops, and therefore it is expected that you would get a case.
Sorry, maybe my posts were too long for you to read

"I have a bag that I carry the machine in - I just don't use it to paddle a few hundred yards around the place"

... or were you trying to imply that pros don't whine, therefore I must be an amateur with money to burn? Neither of those is the case here.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
warfarer
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Jan 6, 2006, 04:02 PM
 
I have been a member of the board for about 2 or 3 months and you, Christ, have a ton of posts. But you sound like a dick.

I agree with Steve here, everyone who has offered help to any of your issues, you have attacked. So I too, am not sure what the point to this post was. I would say that the majority of us here, use some type of bag to carry it in almost all the time. Have you simply tried a hard sleeve? They aren't bags, but they offer some scratch and drop protection while giving you either a handle or a non-slip grip. As for your software issues, there are better people to help you with that. But, if you actually want help, I would suggest accepting the help instead of arguing with everyone about it.

I am on my first powerbook 15", but I am no new to computers at all, my 4th laptop and several desktops. I have been nothing but very happy with mine. My Powerbook doesn't have any software issues at all, I am 100% happy with all the hardware design on it, and really love the complete Mac experience.
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siflippant
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Jan 6, 2006, 04:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by warfarer
I have been a member of the board for about 2 or 3 months and you, Christ, have a ton of posts. But you sound like a dick.

I agree with Steve here, everyone who has offered help to any of your issues, you have attacked. So I too, am not sure what the point to this post was. I would say that the majority of us here, use some type of bag to carry it in almost all the time. Have you simply tried a hard sleeve? They aren't bags, but they offer some scratch and drop protection while giving you either a handle or a non-slip grip. As for your software issues, there are better people to help you with that. But, if you actually want help, I would suggest accepting the help instead of arguing with everyone about it.

I am on my first powerbook 15", but I am no new to computers at all, my 4th laptop and several desktops. I have been nothing but very happy with mine. My Powerbook doesn't have any software issues at all, I am 100% happy with all the hardware design on it, and really love the complete Mac experience.
     
Jawbone54
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Jan 6, 2006, 05:03 PM
 
Just for the record, love my 4 week old 15" PBook.

No sleep problems.
Love Tiger.
No problems with the design at all.
Very pretty screen (no dead pixels and I have yet to notice horizontal lines that are visible from beyond 2 inches away).

Just another "HATE MY POWERBOOK" thread that I felt compelled to spread some PBook love in.
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 6, 2006, 07:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by warfarer
I have been a member of the board for about 2 or 3 months and you, Christ, have a ton of posts. But you sound like a dick.

I agree with Steve here, everyone who has offered help to any of your issues, you have attacked. So I too, am not sure what the point to this post was. I would say that the majority of us here, use some type of bag to carry it in almost all the time. Have you simply tried a hard sleeve? They aren't bags, but they offer some scratch and drop protection while giving you either a handle or a non-slip grip. As for your software issues, there are better people to help you with that. But, if you actually want help, I would suggest accepting the help instead of arguing with everyone about it.

I am on my first powerbook 15", but I am no new to computers at all, my 4th laptop and several desktops. I have been nothing but very happy with mine. My Powerbook doesn't have any software issues at all, I am 100% happy with all the hardware design on it, and really love the complete Mac experience.
"Everyone"? I didn't attack anyone, I attacked some of the posts that have been made. By my count, I attacked the ibook bloke, giving fairly detailed reasons, and the clever chap that pointed out that I obviously wasn't a pro, because pros treat their kit with kid gloves.

I agreed with JKT, and ignored the people (other than you) that decided to address me rather than my issues.

I don't remember calling anyone a dick.

I am not on my first 15" Powerbook, I am on my fourth. I really enjoyed the first two (TiPBs), hated the third (but I only had it for two weeks), and don't much like the fourth. Of course, YMMV.

I propose to abandon Migration Assistant, and after yet another clean install I will manually copy/ install everything that I need. This may (just may) solve my sleep problem, but it is a significant amount of effort - hardly as easy as it should be (i.e as Apple advertise it). When I have got rid of the sleep problem, I may look more kindly on the ergonomic issues (which I note some agreement on above), but until I get rid of the damned sleep problem, my opinion remains - this machine sucks, and I would advise against buying one, even though I haven't bought anything but an Apple machine for 20 years.

Everyone else, of course, can buy a bag, and use it for even the smallest carry, stick non-stick stickers on, and put rubber bumpers on the front of their machines, but I choose not to, and I stress again, I didn't need to with the last generation of Apple machines.

The point of my (first) post, as you appear to have missed it, was:

"For those of you thinking of a new 'book, my advice is "WAIT"." The rest of the post was justification for that advice.

Thank-you all for your attention.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
PeterKG
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Jan 6, 2006, 07:34 PM
 
Mods, please KILL this totally useless thread. Who cares if this person hates their PB? I don't give a rats ass.
MacBook Air, Mac OS X (10.7), 1.6 GHz, Core i5, 4GB 1333 MHz DDR3, 128 GB SSD, 24" LED ACD, 1TB Time Capsule (late 2009), IOS4 ATV, 16GB iPhone 4
     
rem
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Jan 6, 2006, 08:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by PeterKG
Mods, please KILL this totally useless thread. Who cares if this person hates their PB? I don't give a rats ass.
Me neither!

I have a tibook and an albook. The tibook is a great machine, but the albook is a significant improvement (much quieter, zippier, higher res, runs cooler, feels more solid, hinge stress issue resolved, better/faster wifi, faster firewire, better location for adapters, backlit keyboard is cool, etc., etc.). I'm not complaining about n edgy edge in the back.

I'd agree though that the Tibook is still a great machine, its the thinnest ever PB with a classic design.
     
madmacgames
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Jan 6, 2006, 08:13 PM
 
Hey if you really hate your powerbook that much, I'll take it off your hands... I'll even do it free of charge.
The only thing necessary for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing
- Edmund Burke
     
brettcamp
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Jan 7, 2006, 12:12 AM
 
I'm sorry that you got a lemon, and I hope Apple will remedy the situation to your satisfaction. It's always tough being the exception that proves the rule, so it's not much comfort to say that your experience is unusual, and urging everyone else to not buy this generation of Powerbooks isn't statistically sound advice. According to a survey released by Macintouch this week, the most reliable Powerbooks of the last few years appear to be the first 2005 batch of 15"ers.

You can quarrel with the research method or the validity of the numbers of respondents, and also with the fact that last year's batch hasn't had as much time to fail as its predecessors. But as you'll see if you consult the study, their first year reliability appears to surpass that of previous generations. I hope I'm not jinxing my early 2005 15" when I say that I've had no problems so far.

Good luck -- hope your situation is resolved soon.
     
christ  (op)
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Jan 7, 2006, 10:35 AM
 
OK - I got a lemon - based upon this fact I recommend that you all go out and buy one.

NOW.

Don't wait, run, don'twalk, to your nearest Apple outlet store and buy one,

Just don't complain that no-one warned you.
Chris. T.

"... in 6 months if WMD are found, I hope all clear-thinking people who opposed the war will say "You're right, we were wrong -- good job". Similarly, if after 6 months no WMD are found, people who supported the war should say the same thing -- and move to impeach Mr. Bush." - moki, 04/16/03
     
rem
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Jan 7, 2006, 02:43 PM
 
I can agree with...your signature about impeaching Bush: Come on people, its time already!!!!!

When I had problems with my Tibook, at first I was cursing mad. Eventually Apple went beyond their obligations and provided a very fair solution. I think my persistence and coolness paid off and I learned AppleCare (or whatever extended warranty) is an absolute necessity, as is our country's need for at least reasonably law abiding leadership.
     
doolally
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Jan 7, 2006, 04:41 PM
 
OK - I got a lemon - based upon this fact I recommend that you all go out and buy one.

NOW.

Don't wait, run, don'twalk, to your nearest Apple outlet store and buy one,

Just don't complain that no-one warned you.
Nope. Not a dick.
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"What is it you see, in the horizon's bruised smear, that cannot be blotted out by your raised hand?"
www.thecrookedcrow.com
     
analogika
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Jan 7, 2006, 11:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by christ
OK - I got a lemon - based upon this fact I recommend that you all go out and buy one.

NOW.

Don't wait, run, don'twalk, to your nearest Apple outlet store and buy one,

Just don't complain that no-one warned you.
Dude, just drop it.

You've had your rant.

Relating an experience/inability to handle metal surfaces that is - judging from the responses in this thread - NOT the norm, by far, is not "warning" people.

And then being a smart-ass about it doesn't come off to well, either.
     
mduell
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Jan 8, 2006, 12:57 AM
 
Return PowerBook as defective; if they won't give you a refund contact your credit card company for a chargeback. Then you can choose between trying your luck with another one, buying a different brand of laptop, or buying a used TiBook.

I'm not sure why some people are getting so bent out of shape because you're complaining about a broken product and pointing out their advice is not useful.
     
Dewaine
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Jan 8, 2006, 02:25 AM
 
You hate your AluBook and I hate this thread. Please let it end! I love my AluBook, but I came from Wintel so my expectations may be different than yours.
     
analogika
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Jan 8, 2006, 08:31 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell
I'm not sure why some people are getting so bent out of shape because you're complaining about a broken product and pointing out their advice is not useful.
Because he wasn't actually soliciting advice, meaning there is absolutely nothing "helpful" anybody could post except to chime in with "poor you, yeah, Powerbooks suck total ass and lookie here, I've already got a class-action suit running and have demanded personal apologies from Jobs, Ive, and Tevanian."

You don't "help" a rant; you can only one-up it or sympathise or - disagree.

People get bent out of shape at having pointed this out or just genuinely trying to be helpful (seeing as that was actually once the point of these forums) and earning stupid, smart-arse replies for it.
     
chu-ka-pi
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Jan 8, 2006, 10:09 AM
 
Isn't the Mac community great and helpful? And above all, extremely open minded! Every opinions here are indeed warmly welcome as far as they are only praises. I just want to throw my two euros-cents here:

- First, christ's post is clearly a rant. Indeed, that's why he used the [rant] tags. I guess he's extremely dissapointed with this machine and want people to know. That's human nature. And for potential buyers, this may be an interesting post to read, in case they were wondering weither to upgrade or not.

- Second, I do think some of christ's replies are a bit arrogant though. But try to picture yourself being extremely dissapointed after an upgrade, wanting to let people know and getting answers in essence like: "You don't appreciate what a great product it is! It is absolutely perfect and if you have any problems with it, it's your fault, so don't say anything bad about apple"

Now, maybe it's just me, but I developped a really bitter feelling these past months over an apparently growing trend in the Mac community that consists to systematically dismiss any negative opinion about apple. Remember all the kind words we had for Intel before the switch was announced? See all the kind words IBM gets now? Well, you get the picture...

Just my two euro-cents

CKP
     
JKT
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Jan 8, 2006, 12:54 PM
 
Growing trend? This has been the case for decades. It's the siege mentality - Apple and the Mac have been under threat of extinction for so long now (and regardless of their current "successes" they still only have ~3% market share), it is just a knee-jerk reaction by devotees to snap at people who don't follow the party line. There isn't anything growing about it... its always been there (well, in the near 10 years I have been using Macs). I wish it wasn't (and I also wish that I hadn't been guilty of doing similar myself) but it is just a fact of mac-life. It's as endemic to being a Mac devotee as the feelings of bitter disappointment mixed with joy after every Keynote... (yah, boo this will never sell... why didn't they have this instead... it's good, but it would have been better if they had added x, y, z... etc).

The problems occur If you bite back, it just makes things worse...
     
Mister Elf
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Jan 8, 2006, 02:21 PM
 
I have to agree...if you don't like your PowerBook, put it up on eBay and stop whining about people's advice. I'm sure someone else would be happy with a top-of-the-line 15" PowerBook.
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SunHawk
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Jan 8, 2006, 04:20 PM
 
Hello. I just registered on the forum, but have been reading it for a few months because I want to switch to Macs and have been seeking education about PowerBooks specifically and Apple service and reliability in general.

I recently bought a 15" PowerBook from the Apple Store; it had to be returned due to numerous problems with it. Although I am very disappointed that the PowerBook was such a poor example of Apple hardware, I hope the replacement unit lives up to Apple's reputation and meets expectations.

With that said, as a 20+ year PC user who is still on the fence about switching, I also want to say that I *do* appreciate other users expressing both the good AND the bad re Apple and Macs. Such dialog leads to informed decisions. While it may be the original poster did sound a bit arrogant, I tend to think it was just his/her frustrations coming through. Regardless, I appreciate his/her honest opinion of the Al PowerBook he/she received, as well as the rational suggestions he/she received. FWIW, the negative replies back and forth are of no help and evoke the thought of "You're either with me or against me." Is someone who expresses problems and frustrations with their Mac really an adversary of other posters in the forum??
     
JKT
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Jan 8, 2006, 04:49 PM
 
It largely depends on how you express yourself... if you are antagonistic from the start you will receive it back (as this thread demonstrates). It helps to post something along the lines of "Blah, blah, problems, blah, blah, p*ssed off, blah, blah, anyone have any ideas what I can do about them?" with that last part being the most important. Then respond sensibly to the good and bad suggestions (whether they worked or not) you will undoubtedly get as the majority of the posts.
     
jocker
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Jan 8, 2006, 05:36 PM
 
christ - (modest username)

You state that you have used macs for two decades and it didn't dawn on you that Migration Assistant was the reason for your woes?!?!? Unbelievable.

As a 'power' mac user, I wouldn't use the migration assistant to carry my software across. Why? I'm pretty sure i've installed many hacks etc which wouldn't be compatible with a new powerbook - e.g. to enable two finger scrolling on my trackpad, even though its not officially supported. Things like that. If you're as mac savvy as I am, perhaps you've done the same through the years?

Migration Assistant is designed to make the transition as painless as possible for the majority of users. Its not going to work in 100% of cases, and I am disappointed that a so-called mac expert believed that to be the case.

And your rant stated that it was a 'factory fresh' install - what utter BS. Do you know what factory fresh means? You'd used the Migration Assistant - thats a LONG WAY from factory fresh.

Grow up and spend some time installing your applications manually instead of wasting all your time posting rant after rant after rant here.

Some people.
AlBook G4 15", iMac 20"
     
rparke1
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Jan 8, 2006, 05:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by jocker
christ - (modest username)

You state that you have used macs for two decades and it didn't dawn on you that Migration Assistant was the reason for your woes?!?!? Unbelievable.

As a 'power' mac user, I wouldn't use the migration assistant to carry my software across. Why? I'm pretty sure i've installed many hacks etc which wouldn't be compatible with a new powerbook - e.g. to enable two finger scrolling on my trackpad, even though its not officially supported. Things like that. If you're as mac savvy as I am, perhaps you've done the same through the years?

Migration Assistant is designed to make the transition as painless as possible for the majority of users. Its not going to work in 100% of cases, and I am disappointed that a so-called mac expert believed that to be the case.

And your rant stated that it was a 'factory fresh' install - what utter BS. Do you know what factory fresh means? You'd used the Migration Assistant - thats a LONG WAY from factory fresh.

Grow up and spend some time installing your applications manually instead of wasting all your time posting rant after rant after rant here.

Some people.

i've been reading this thread for a bit and the above post, i dont know if the person is having a bad day or something, but that was a totally uncalled for post IMHO. sure "Christ" might of been a little, out there on his replies. i think the one who really needs to grow up is the above poster. sorry to say, but like i said before, no need to post the above, even if it was venting.
( Last edited by rparke1; Jan 8, 2006 at 06:45 PM. )
     
 
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