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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Applications > The OmniWeb 5 Public Beta thread.

The OmniWeb 5 Public Beta thread. (Page 15)
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Failed Engineer
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May 30, 2004, 10:52 AM
 
I'm really liking this version of Omniweb. I'm a recent switcher so I don't know about previous versions. I'm ready to plunk down for it now after using it solely for 10 days to see what it's about. I was initially very reluctant to try it because of the tabs, and the fact that I'm not a 12 in iBook, and my anger for horizontal scrolling. But I've managed to overcome that anger for the most part, mainly because per site preferences is probably the best browser innovation I've ever seen, and workspaces and page marking are tools that are not found in any other browser and I've started to like them and miss them in other browsers now.

Here are my requests for the browser though:

There appears to be a bug for me in which the tab drawer always opens on the right every time I launch Omniweb. I have to go into preferences each time to set it to open on the left.

In Safari and Camino, I've preferred the CSS method of adblocking. Is there any way to do this with Omniweb? I like the Omniweb adblocking, but having no option to collapse all blocked content is annoying. I understand the reasoning behind the decision, but would it be difficult to add it as an option (collapsing content)? Until then, it would be cool if the CSS method could be used.

Tabs. There seems to be no way to force the tab drawer to stay closed when a new tab is requested. One of the ways I've gotten around the space issue on tabs is to browse with tabs open but with the drawer closed. This is annoying because the tab drawer forces itself open whenever I launch a bookmark from Launchbar, which is how I open about 80% of bookmarks. I would love it if I could open these bookmarks without opening the tab drawer. Maybe this option is already there and I'm just too stupid to see it.

The other annoyance with tabs is that I come from Opera on Windows (can't use on Mac because mouse gestures are too difficult to use on the iBook. Cocoa Gestures are much nicer because you can use a modifier only) and I love the way it handled tabs, or pages as they like to call them. It would be nice if I can make certain that all my browser pages are in tabs, in one window. I've managed to come close by changing per site preferences, but new windows opened by javascript seem to always pop open in a new window. Having them open in the current window would be perfect.

I know everyone has their own ideas of the perfect browser, but these are just my minor suggestions. I'll probably be buying Omniweb anyways, because it is an amazing browser that is the best browser available regardless of platform today.

I'd also like to say in my first post that I likely wouldn't have switched had it not been for these forums. I'd been considering it for a long time and then a friend of mine told me to check out these forums, and search them for any questions and concerns I had about the switch. The information here convinced me to try. And I'm not looking back anymore. Thanks, MacNN.
     
TheIceMan
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May 30, 2004, 11:43 AM
 
Neo.cmg: Thanks for the tip.
     
nebben123
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May 31, 2004, 09:15 AM
 
well... i've officially given up on omniweb... for now. i love all the features that it has above what safari offers, but it's just too slow and unstable. i've got an 800mhz g4 ibook and omniweb just kills it when i want to load a few (2 or 3) tabs... my cpu is always peaking at 100% whenever omniweb needs to load a page, making my ibook practically unusable during that time. safari is always quick to display pages and doesn't usually bog down (at least until i try to load 10+ tabs at a time).

plus ow just crashes or becomes unstable far too often (giving me weird cocoa errors about "cannot load object address" or something, which requires me to quit and relaunch ow to get it working again).

so essentially, any time or convenience i would have saved by the site preferences, ad-blocking, workspaces, etc that omniweb offers have been pretty much negated by the fact that it is too slow and crash-prone. this is a shame

ben
     
proton
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May 31, 2004, 10:34 AM
 
Let me get this straight, you're complaining about the stability of a beta product?



FWIW, OmniWeb 5b6.1 has been running for the last 3 days on my machine with more than 50 tabs open, not even a sniff of a crash.

- proton
     
cpac
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May 31, 2004, 04:18 PM
 
Agreed. - OW5 is still in beta, though I too find it be very stable in its current version.

Ben - something is definitely messed up if you're experiencing such horrid performance. I'd try trashing/moving your:

OW cache file
OW history
OW preferences
OW bookmarks

And relaunching to see if you get a better experience.
cpac
     
JKT  (op)
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Jun 1, 2004, 06:19 AM
 
A quick how-to wrt to Workspaces:

1. By default the Default workspace does not "save windows" between sessions - this means that browsing in the default workspace is just like using any other browser where quitting the app doesn't lead to any of the pages you had open at the time of your last session being reloaded when you next launch OW5, just your chosen home page.

2. If you open the Workspaces pane (from the Workspace menu>Show Workspaces), you will see a window with all your workspaces in view. When you highlight a workspace's name by clicking it, it will show you what windows you have open in that workspace and what tabs/thumbs you have open within each window. Note, double clicking any of the window/tabs/thumb titles will cause the workspace to open with that window/tab/thumb in front.

At the bottom of the workspace pane are four buttons and one checkbox:

+/- do what you would expect by either creating a new WS (which you can then title yourself) or deleting the currently selected one.

The camera icon when pressed replaces the previously saved thumbnail/tab/window set-up with that of your browser state as it stands at the time you push the button - this is called a snapshot. This means that any thumbs/tabs/windows and the state of both the window(s) containing them and the drawers (e.g. maximised, minimised to the Dock, drawer on the left or right) is saved as a snapshot for that workspace. (Note, if you want to revert e.g. the Default workspace to just a single window showing your homepage with the drawer on the left and the window maximised, then close all other windows/tabs/thumbs and set up the window state as you want, then press the camera icon... alternatively just create an new workspace and name it Default, then delete the old Default workspace).

The rollback button (the spot with an arrow encircling it) will cause your Workspace to revert back to the last snapshot you took of it. This enables you to open e.g. several threads at a forum and then revert back to just the index page if that was your snapshot content, after you had finished reading them all.

The "Save windows" checkbox when ticked will cause the Workspace state (in terms of thumbs/tabs open) to be preserved between launches of OW5. That is, if your browser quits unexpectedly, if this option is checked for your Workspace, it will launch and open all the same sites once again. If this checkbox is not ticked, then it will launch and revert to the last snapshot taken for that workspace.



3. If you have problems launching, you can open in a "Safe Workspace" by holding down shift as you launch OW5 - this opens OW5 in an empty workspace called Untitled. This helps if you are stuck in a launch/crash/relaunch cycle (which is generally solved by deleting the cache folder - but if that doesn't work, it would allow you to delete the troublesome workspace).

4. You can move windows (and, obviously, their contents) between different workspaces by drag and dropping the window icon from the currently selected Workspace (when viewing the Workspace pane) to the target Workspace. At present, unfortunately, you can't move individual thumbs/tabs this way (but you can get around this by using command-X, command-V anyway).

I hope that makes sense and that it helps clarify any questions... just ask if it doesn't.

Edit - added previously posted image of the workspace pane to help with the explanation.
     
cpac
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Jun 1, 2004, 11:02 PM
 
Hey - aren't we almost at the expiration of the demo for those kids that don't have a 5.0 license, but launch OW every day? (30 days if I remember correctly, and we're at 28 or 29 for those that started when b6.1 came out - on 5/4.

basically, aren't we due for b7 within a day or two? (or maybe even a rc1?)
cpac
     
Wickedkitten
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Jun 2, 2004, 02:52 AM
 
Originally posted by cpac:
Hey - aren't we almost at the expiration of the demo for those kids that don't have a 5.0 license, but launch OW every day? (30 days if I remember correctly, and we're at 28 or 29 for those that started when b6.1 came out - on 5/4.

basically, aren't we due for b7 within a day or two? (or maybe even a rc1?)
I hope so
     
workerbee
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Jun 2, 2004, 10:15 AM
 
OW 5 Beta 6.1 won't load perlfect.com here. It just sits there and does absolutely nothing, even after manually deleting the cache and history files and unchecking the inflate plugin.

Anyone have a bright idea what could be triggering this behaviour?
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larkost
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Jun 2, 2004, 12:10 PM
 
workerbee: That site is giving a http header of:
Code:
Content-Encoding: text/html
The problem is, there is no such encoding. Encoding is for things like "x-gzip" or "deflate", if you are not compressing the information, it should be blank. This is definitely a web developer error.

If you look at the error log, OmniWeb will tell you this (but it is not obvious unless you have done things with http headers).
     
workerbee
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Jun 2, 2004, 12:55 PM
 
Originally posted by larkost:
workerbee: That site is giving a http header of:
Code:
Content-Encoding: text/html
The problem is, there is no such encoding. Encoding is for things like "x-gzip" or "deflate", if you are not compressing the information, it should be blank. This is definitely a web developer error.

If you look at the error log, OmniWeb will tell you this (but it is not obvious unless you have done things with http headers).
Thanks larkost!
I hadn't even thought of any error logs (and, to be honest, can't seem to find OW's log anyway) -- maybe a good thing, as a quick peek into the Console makes me shudder. Somehow I don't like the sound of things like
"[HCIController][setupHardware] AFH Not Supported (0x1d2c7c0)",
"[HCIController][RequestPowerStateChange] sleep is not available",
"/usr/libexec/fix_prebinding: /Applications/OmniWeb.app/Contents/MacOS/OmniWeb couldn't be prebound in the past, and probably can't be prebound now.",
"Mail[8036] failed to append message <POPMessage: 0x4eeb330> (_rangeOfBytes: Out of bounds)" etc. etc.

... and that's not even looking into the various crash reports

(Sorry for straying OT)
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larkost
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Jun 2, 2004, 02:20 PM
 
workerbee:

OmniWeb keeps its own error logs: Window->Error Log
     
juanvaldes
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Jun 4, 2004, 04:18 PM
 
so when is the new beta/final omnidudes?

If it was not for the fact I keep OW running until it crashes I would not be able to use it now. Got 15 launches left, but I would not be shocked if some are out already.
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superfula
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Jun 6, 2004, 02:45 AM
 
Beta 7 is out. Go get it!!
     
iNeusch
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Jun 6, 2004, 05:13 AM
 
Originally posted by superfula:
Beta 7 is out. Go get it!!
wow ! lot's of worrected stuff
even seems snappier
     
Krypton
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Jun 6, 2004, 06:46 AM
 
Beta 7 is nice and zippy.

Can't wait for the new Webcore, even with the old on it renders some sites faster than Safari on my old comp.
     
phillryu
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Jun 6, 2004, 09:04 AM
 
I can't get it to launch.

I've tried trashing application support for OW, deleting preferences, redownloading, logging out/in, turning off APE, and it just refuses to launch without crashing. Anyone have this problem?

MacThemes.net Editor in Chief
     
Tim2 at Omni
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Jun 6, 2004, 02:23 PM
 
Originally posted by phillryu:
I can't get it to launch.

I've tried trashing application support for OW, deleting preferences, redownloading, logging out/in, turning off APE, and it just refuses to launch without crashing. Anyone have this problem?
Open up Console.app, and then launch OmniWeb. Do you see anything logged when OmniWeb crashes?

It sounds like an APE module or plugin which is linking against WebKit (which in turn links against WebCore, and since we link against WebCore as well, that can cause problems).

Does CrashCatcher come up, or does it crash too early in the launch process for that?
Tim Omernick
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sghms
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Jun 6, 2004, 02:35 PM
 
Originally posted by Tim2 at Omni:

There isn't a way to turn them off, but you can make them prettier and less annoying:

Code:
defaults write com.omnigroup.OmniWeb5 SensibleToolTipBehavior -bool true
This will make it so the tab tooltips only show up when you hover the mouse over the title of a tab. It also positions them differently and makes them look more like the system tooltips. I suggest you try it, and send feedback so that we can change it to the default behavior (I hate the black and white things).
I had it on the yellow tags in beta 6.1 and now it has reverted back to black tags for beta 7. I entered the command above in the terminal and nothing happened

Has the yellow tag option been taken out ?

PS Glad the macuser problem has been fixed
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juanvaldes
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Jun 6, 2004, 04:44 PM
 
Omnidudes does an incoming url from services not count as a "Open links from other applications" event?

I have that set to open in a new tab but I always get a new window.
The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it always to be kept alive.
- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
     
Amorya
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Jun 6, 2004, 06:14 PM
 
Just testing out the "textarea goes partially blank" bug. Yup, it appears to be fixed!

Although you still have the crazy artifacts around the text area hilighting halo - it emboldens the hilight more and more for each character you type, but only in the top half of the field. This time it seems to refresh after a few seconds and go back to normal, but it's still there

Amorya
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Neo.cmg
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Jun 6, 2004, 06:51 PM
 
Well, I finally was able to see all my tabs load within my workspace upon launching OmniWeb and not one got hung up with beta 7. That's quite an achievement in itself I would say. I did notice in the release notes something about the addition of a workspace compression feature which is supposed to help with launching times, but was turned off by default. I was wondering if anyone there at OmniGroup, or anyone else for that matter, might be able to elaborate a bit about what this feature does and how we turn it on? It did say that there was some compatibility issues with workspaces created in older versions. Once you startup b7, is the workspace file automatically updated to allow you to utilize this feature, or does the workspace need to be recreated?

Thanks,

Neo.cmg
     
phillryu
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Jun 6, 2004, 06:53 PM
 
Originally posted by Tim2 at Omni:
Open up Console.app, and then launch OmniWeb. Do you see anything logged when OmniWeb crashes?

It sounds like an APE module or plugin which is linking against WebKit (which in turn links against WebCore, and since we link against WebCore as well, that can cause problems).

Does CrashCatcher come up, or does it crash too early in the launch process for that?
exception = 0x00000001, code = 0x00000000;0x00000001;0xbc300b16;
Starting '/Applications/OmniWeb.app/Contents/Resources/OmniGroupCrashCatcher.app/Contents/MacOS/OmniGroupCrashCatcher' for pid 37

CrashCatcher does come up. It didn't work after I had turned off all my APE things from the APE pane either.

MacThemes.net Editor in Chief
     
sghms
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Jun 6, 2004, 08:32 PM
 
Originally posted by sghms:
There are a few issues which I think are 'bugs' of sorts though I am not certain.

1) When I try to read the review of themes over at Macthemes.net , two links should appear below each theme which allow you to either continue reading the review or to download the theme. When using Omniweb 5 b6, the links don't and in fact the two links appear at the top of page and they are for the NEOS theme alone.

This problem does not occur in Safari 1.2.1 nor opera 7.5. I have changed the site preferences to IE 6/Safari/IE 5.2. (Mac) with no luck . I have flushed the cache and deleted history within the browser, as well the omniweb 5 cache folder and history.ox file within my home folder.

Anybody else have this issue ?
This unfortunately is still not fixed Does anybody else have this issue ?
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Rickster
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Jun 7, 2004, 05:51 AM
 
The feature is still there, it's just changed name: "SensibleToolTipBehavior" has changed to "AlternateThumbnailMouseTips". Gotta be impartial, I guess.
Rick Roe
icons.cx | weblog
     
sghms
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Jun 7, 2004, 10:54 AM
 
Originally posted by Rickster:
The feature is still there, it's just changed name: "SensibleToolTipBehavior" has changed to "AlternateThumbnailMouseTips". Gotta be impartial, I guess.
Cheers for the help


Any luck in addressing the macthemes theme review problem ?
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iNeusch
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Jun 7, 2004, 01:01 PM
 
Is it just me or the "check for changes" setting is not used and bookmarks are checked at startup ?
     
BZ
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Jun 8, 2004, 07:54 AM
 
5.0b7

Still not getting all favicons to show.

http://gizmodo.com/
http://forums.macnn.com/
http://www.macrumors.com/

BZ
     
JKT  (op)
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Jun 8, 2004, 08:20 AM
 
This doesn't help any, but I've never had favicon issues with the forums here or MacRumors.com. The gizmodo site doesn't show a favicon, though.
     
cpac
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Jun 8, 2004, 08:28 AM
 
Originally posted by BZ:
5.0b7

Still not getting all favicons to show.

http://gizmodo.com/
http://forums.macnn.com/
http://www.macrumors.com/

BZ
I'm also not getting all the favicons to show (having deleted my cache before using b7 etc.), but I *am* getting the favicons for those sites - I just don't get the ones for:

http://www.mozilla.org/projects/camino/
http://www.sciforums.com/f73/s812294...48439457bf9cd/
cpac
     
Spirit_VW
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Jun 10, 2004, 12:15 AM
 
edit
( Last edited by Spirit_VW; Jun 10, 2004 at 12:28 AM. )
Kevin Buchanan
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BZ
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Jun 10, 2004, 07:09 AM
 
It is pretty official. I am 100% back on OmniWeb 5.0 (b7).

All of the major show stopper have been nailed and now it is all about OmniTabs, site preferences, rss feeds, bookmark updates and the rest.

Speed is close enough so I don't see any real difference and all of the features are just way too powerful to ignore.

Now, where is that link to buy my upgrade license?

BZ
     
ambush
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Jun 10, 2004, 07:26 AM
 
b7 is great!

I'm using it as my main browser... eventually got tired of Camino... and Safari.... and Shiira.

good speed at last! there's always room for improvement tho
     
ratlater
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Jun 10, 2004, 01:53 PM
 
I'll chime in here as well. B7 is amazing. I'm not seeing any of the old slowdowns or crashing problems I was was having. I don't know how you fixed the 'insert nil value' crasher, but I want to head down to your office and kiss your feet!

I've really started using workspaces with B7 and I'm loving them, keep up the great work. When will you let us pay your for this sweet browser? I feel bad just buying an upgrade for only $10, this thing is worth much more than that to me.

-matt
     
Macanoid
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Jun 10, 2004, 02:49 PM
 
I stopped using Omniweb after version 4 beta something. These reviews here made me curious though and I must say - I'm very impressed. After having used it intensively last week I can honestly say I like this a lot. I even prefer the drawer over tabs now. One thing I don't understand though.

On my Cube G4/1.2 GHz Omniweb seems to open, say, 6 tabs faster than the latest safari. On my powerbook G4/867 Omniweb is unbearably slow compared to safari when opening multiple tabs. Any explanation for this?
     
ratlater
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Jun 10, 2004, 02:53 PM
 
Originally posted by Macanoid:
I stopped using Omniweb after version 4 beta something. These reviews here made me curious though and I must say - I'm very impressed. After having used it intensively last week I can honestly say I like this a lot. I even prefer the drawer over tabs now. One thing I don't understand though.

On my Cube G4/1.2 GHz Omniweb seems to open, say, 6 tabs faster than the latest safari. On my powerbook G4/867 Omniweb is unbearably slow compared to safari when opening multiple tabs. Any explanation for this?
How much RAM does each system have?

-matt
     
Macanoid
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Jun 10, 2004, 02:56 PM
 
Cube 1 GB, Powerbook 640!
     
ratlater
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Jun 10, 2004, 03:03 PM
 
Originally posted by Macanoid:
Cube 1 GB, Powerbook 640!
Hmm...640 should be enough. I can't think of any physical reason it would be so much slower on the powerbook. Have you tried flushing the cache?

-matt
     
Macanoid
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Jun 10, 2004, 03:08 PM
 
Have done - even used cocktail to clean up other cache stuff. I'm behind a firewall at work (where I use my powerbook) - could that be a problem??

Also, is it true that Omniweb uses dual processors more efficiently?? (I just ordered a dual G5 that's why I asked)
     
ratlater
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Jun 10, 2004, 03:17 PM
 
Originally posted by Macanoid:
Have done - even used cocktail to clean up other cache stuff. I'm behind a firewall at work (where I use my powerbook) - could that be a problem??

Also, is it true that Omniweb uses dual processors more efficiently?? (I just ordered a dual G5 that's why I asked)
It does use dual processors more efficiently. OW is very threaded, so it splits off the work much better than other browsers like Safari.

What kind of network connection do you have at work? It might be that your connection is saturated, or slower than at home. That would a huge effect on OW speed.

-matt
     
Macanoid
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Jun 10, 2004, 03:24 PM
 
first, thanks for the help and quick answers!!

I have an 8 mbit connection at home and a 2 mbit at work. Weird thing is I try OW first and after wat seems a long time and not finishing all tabs I quit it, switch to safari and it loads the same tabs just fine. Network saturation is always more or less the same.

The dual news is very nice to hear. Thanks! Can't wait to try it on the new G5!
     
juanvaldes
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Jun 10, 2004, 08:45 PM
 
with the latest beta OW decides to just chew up my CPU's for 5-10 second random intervals. Usually this happens when I goto a new page but seems to take alot more CPU then the last beta's. I have also seen this happen when I am not loading any pages, and it's not a ad/image because once it's done CPU use goes back to nil and none of the open pages have changed.

So massive CPU usage, if your not aware of the problem I can try to get you a sample.
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Spirit_VW
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Jun 10, 2004, 11:12 PM
 
B7 really is amazing. Pretty much all the big issues are gone for me, too. I still have trouble switching full-time though because the cache still seems hit-or-miss on my systems.

Probably am going to buy a license even if the cache remains broken and I can't use it - the amount of other work in this thing is just staggering and I feel I should compensate these guys.
Kevin Buchanan
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juanvaldes
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
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Jun 11, 2004, 02:54 AM
 
so is anyone else seeing this massive CPU blocking issue? It's like OW is a race car and it's just sitting at the start line spinning it's wheels for seconds THEN goes off and is done in a second. As soon as it's done spinning it's wheels OW goes out and starts to pull the site so it's not a complex render that is eating up the CPU it is occurring before the page is pulled.

Only issue I have with OWb7.
The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it always to be kept alive.
- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
     
Catfish_Man
Mac Elite
Join Date: Aug 2001
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Jun 11, 2004, 03:57 AM
 
Originally posted by juanvaldes:
so is anyone else seeing this massive CPU blocking issue? It's like OW is a race car and it's just sitting at the start line spinning it's wheels for seconds THEN goes off and is done in a second. As soon as it's done spinning it's wheels OW goes out and starts to pull the site so it's not a complex render that is eating up the CPU it is occurring before the page is pulled.

Only issue I have with OWb7.
I might have seen something like this. I'll see if I can reproduce it (and, if I can, I'll sample it).
     
Macanoid
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Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: macsterdam
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Jun 11, 2004, 04:05 AM
 
I find I really miss two things compared to safari:

1) select a word on a page, righ-click and search google

2) when opening a folder in tabs I really want to replace the current open tabs and not add the new ones to the open ones.

Is this currently possible?
     
Tim2 at Omni
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
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Jun 11, 2004, 05:03 AM
 
Originally posted by Macanoid:
1) select a word on a page, righ-click and search google
You will see this in a future release.

2) when opening a folder in tabs I really want to replace the current open tabs and not add the new ones to the open ones.
Command-Option click on the folder to replace your current tabs.

Hope that helps!
Tim Omernick
Engineer, The Omni Group
     
Macanoid
Senior User
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: macsterdam
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Jun 11, 2004, 05:55 AM
 
that's great news - thanks! Just bought myself a license because of this - thanks.
     
flysky
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Jun 12, 2004, 04:34 PM
 
I just noticed that b7 allows ICeCoffEE to access the contextual menu. Finally, Services in the CM. Thanks, guys!
     
TheIceMan
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Trapped in the depths of my mind
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Jun 16, 2004, 05:44 AM
 
Is anyone else having trouble using Gmail on OmniWeb 5? It seems to be stuck at the loading part. Works fine in Safari.
     
 
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