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Skypat · Jan 10, 2005, 09:18 AM

I bought a cinema 20" display. It is gorgeous and the quality of the screen, and the comfort of using this beauty is amazing.

BUT I have 1 dead pixel

I know it is ridiculously tiny, it is grey and on the side of the screen. But I have waited for so long to get that display that now I feel disappointed. I tested the screen at the store but did not see the dead pixel. Of course my vendor said Apple would refuse to exchange the pannel.

So am the only one ?

Goldfinger · Jan 10, 2005, 09:21 AM

I think dead pixels are unacceptable

. *cue people that say that they are*

Luckily I have none. Where did you buy it Skypat ?

Skypat · Jan 10, 2005, 09:26 AM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
Luckily I have none. Where did you buy it Skypat ?

At CAMI Apple center Brussels. The people were very nice because they let me tried the screen before buying it. It is just that the store was closing, I had to rush and I missed the bad pixel

They said I could check it at home ... but of course the morning after it was a whole different story. No exchange possible (Apple policy).

So my advice is : take your time to check your display never take it home otherwize : you won't be able to exchange it afterwards (for less than 7 dead pixels).

Randman · Jan 10, 2005, 09:28 AM

I've been fortunate that I've never owned a Mac with a dead pixel and that includes clamshells, iceBooks and PowerBooks. Closest I came was when the iMac G5s came out, I had a test model for an extended review what had several dead pixels.

Rev-O · Jan 10, 2005, 10:00 AM

I've had good luck so far. My old 23" ADC cinema display had zero and my current 30" display has zero.

When I bought my 30" display a few months back, I had the people at the Apple store unpack it and hook it up in store so I could inspect the screen for stuck pixels. It had none (took a while to check out a 30" display!), so it got packed up and went home with me. The people at the Apple store were very cool and helpful with this too. This is the whole reason I waited and purchased on from a physical store instead of buying online. I wanted to check it out before it went home with me.

Randman · Jan 10, 2005, 10:04 AM

I took PiXel Check on a USB keychain with me when I got my PB17. Booted it up right there at the shop and checked.

dav · Jan 10, 2005, 10:41 AM

i bought a 20" apple cinema display refurbished, which came with one dead or stuck pixel. on a solid black screen it appears light, otherwise it is unnoticeable. slightly bummed, but i'm fine with it after the savings i got from buying refurbished.

i'm more annoyed that i can't start the mac up from shut-down by pressing the side power button on the display. i usually wake from sleep by clicking the mouse.

Wiskedjak · Jan 10, 2005, 10:57 AM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
I think dead pixels are unacceptable . *cue people that say that they are*

Dead pixels are unacceptable ... on displays over $5000

Skypat · Jan 10, 2005, 12:25 PM

Dav I agree with you. I regret not to be able to boot my mac by touching the power button of the side of the screen. It was a nice feature on my older 17" studio display.

My dead pixel is gray and located on the side of the screen. It is extremely tiny, I am just upset I missed it at the store. I guess I won't even notice it in a few days

Goldfinger · Jan 10, 2005, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by Skypat:
At CAMI Apple center Brussels. The people were very nice because they let me tried the screen before buying it. It is just that the store was closing, I had to rush and I missed the bad pixel They said I could check it at home ... but of course the morning after it was a whole different story. No exchange possible (Apple policy).

So my advice is : take your time to check your display never take it home otherwize : you won't be able to exchange it afterwards (for less than 7 dead pixels).

If they said you could check it at home then go back and whine untill they give in. Call the person who said that. Steve Karwan is the store manager IIRC. Suzanne Grauer is the CEO, send her an email just to piss them off.

Goldfinger · Jan 10, 2005, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
Dead pixels are unacceptable ... on displays over $5000

They are unacceptable even on the cheapest of displays IMO.

Skypat · Jan 10, 2005, 05:26 PM

Hi Goldfinger

That's what I did actually. I called that person and they told me it wouldn't be fair to pack my screen with a stuck pixel and give it to another customer. I can understand that. They said they "would ask apple". But the chance I get a new one are almost equal to zero.

So I'll wait and see, I might write to one of the people you mention indeed. I would be very motivated if the pixel actually was in the middle of my screen, hopefully it is not.

thanks for your support anyway

Wiskedjak · Jan 10, 2005, 05:32 PM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
They are unacceptable even on the cheapest of displays IMO.

Sure, but with the quality control measures necessary to eliminate dead pixels, a $5000 display would be the cheapest of displays.

Goldfinger · Jan 10, 2005, 06:55 PM

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
Sure, but with the quality control measures necessary to eliminate dead pixels, a $5000 display would be the cheapest of displays.

Well, point taken. But they don't need to implement such a quality control. They should just take back screens with dead/stuck pixels, simple as that.

TETENAL · Jan 10, 2005, 09:15 PM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
Well, point taken. But they don't need to implement such a quality control. They should just take back screens with dead/stuck pixels, simple as that.

Those displays you take back need to be paid for. So the perfect ones are going to be more expensive.

Cadaver · Jan 10, 2005, 09:48 PM

While I agree displays with "pixel anomalies" are teh sux0r, I do understand the economics behind it. I expect within a few years, dead pixels will be far, far less common than they are today.

BTW, my iBook/600 has one dead pixel, and my Dell 20" has one stuck (red) subpixel which at least is hidden by the dock. My previous 22" Apple Cinema and 17" Studio were perfect, as are the screens on my 1GHz TiBook and 1.33GHz 12" PB.

mdc · Jan 11, 2005, 12:03 AM

12" ibook had a white pixel near the top middle of the screen. 12" powerbook was perfect.
current 15" powerbook is strange. once in a while (once a month or less) a ~turquoise pixel gets stuck, tapping the pixel or next to it fixes it. very strange.

Skypat · Jan 11, 2005, 06:22 AM

Well, this is my first "dead pixel" experience. I've had a perfect 17" Studio Display and my PB 12 is ok too. Same for the rest of my family (PB 15 and cinema 23", no problem).

I think they should be more flexible anyway with their good clients. There are some people for who the pixel issue is less important : business customers for example. I wouldn't care to have a stuck pixel at the office.

Anyway I would never accept a dead pixel in the middle of my screen. That must be *really* ennoying.

Goldfinger · Jan 11, 2005, 06:39 AM

Originally posted by TETENAL:
Those displays you take back need to be paid for. So the perfect ones are going to be more expensive.

I don't care, it's a malfunctioning product. When you order a new car en you go to collect it and you see that there is a scratch on the paintwork or piece of paint that isn't well done. Do you accept the car ? I don't. I demand another one.

WJMoore · Jan 11, 2005, 07:07 AM

My iMac has 1, was like it from day one. It only shows up on black and is bright magenta. You'll get over it, it's a known limitation of LCD screens.

Buck_Naked · Jan 11, 2005, 08:27 AM

Two ViewSonic LCD's and zero dead/stuck pixels.
Knocks on wood now.

TETENAL · 01:01 AM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
I don't care, it's a malfunctioning product.

No, you don't understand. It's a "malfunctioning" product in your opinion, but it is produced nevertheless and producing it costs money. So someone has to pay for it. If none of the displays with pixel errors could be sold, then the costs for producing these would be added to the perfect ones, so the prices for TFTs would be significantly higher. Since most people think TFTs are expensive enough already, they accept some pixel errors.

When you order a new car en you go to collect it and you see that there is a scratch on the paintwork or piece of paint that isn't well done. Do you accept the car ? I don't. I demand another one.

All of Apple's displays are of pixel error class 2. That means they may have up to 2 defective pixels or up to 5 defective subpixels per 1 million pixels. You knew beforehand that you are buying a class 2 display, so you have to accept that. These displays are not "malfunctioning", they are functioning according to specification.

If you want a perfect display, you need to buy a display of pixel error class 1. Formac does sell them for example.

turtle777 · Jan 15, 2005, 10:07 PM

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
They are unacceptable even on the cheapest of displays IMO.

I disagree.

I'm thinking of buying an el cheapo 17" DVI LCD on sale online for $ 190. I can't test it before buying.

If it had one or two dead pixels, I wouldn't be happy, but still tolerate it. To demand a display free of dead pixels for that price would be ridiculous.

-t

ixus_123 · Jan 16, 2005, 10:57 PM

There was a post on slashdot a couple of weeks ago. I think it was Samsung were giving exchanges / refunds for any display with even one faulty pixel - it was only on offer in China though.

There is now way dead pixels are acceptable - the display is the most important part of the computer - the thing you are looking at day in, day out hour after hour. Someone said 'someone has to pay' I hand over my hard esrned cash to pay for these products and I expect them to work.

Formac seem to do at least a better pixel deal than Apple - 3 I believe for an exchange

G4ME · Jan 18, 2005, 01:32 PM

none, i got CRTs

barang · Jan 18, 2005, 03:24 PM

I had one on my powerbook.

If I (very) gently massaged around it, it would go away for a couple weeks, only to reappear again.

KP* · Jan 20, 2005, 12:39 AM

I have a 23" ADC Cinema Display which has 1 pixel stuck on cyan, pretty much in the middle of the screen. I don't see it all the time, but when I do it drives me nuts.

jebjeb · Jan 20, 2005, 04:55 AM

I have none on my TiBook but I had one stuck on cyan on my old 15" Apple Studio display which I had about 3 years ago. I only noticed it when I was watching a letterbox DVD and it showed up in the black area of the screen.

Having the tolerances allows us to have much cheaper displays. This is fine. If you want to guarantee that the display you buy has no stuck/dead pixels then pay the premium for the pixel checking services that many retailers offer, buy from a line and manufacturer that guarantees it (plus paying the premium) or, as mentioned before, buy your display at a bricks and mortar store and check it out yourself. Any store that doesn't let you take the display out and test it (before you part with your money) shouldn't get your money.

Easy.