[MacsGalor]

Take a look at the MacNN main page and you will see the bit they put on this. I don't have a paid subscription so I can't read the whole thing but what do you guys think? I am thinking that it is BS because if you remember about a month back Apple became a debt free company. If they were really in such trouble I don't think that, that would be the case. Oh and hasn't Apple always been on the "edge"

[MindFad]

More doomsday predictions already? At such a good time for Apple?

[Dex13]

Ever Since Money said Flint was the worst city to live in I stopped reading it.....

[Vader�s Pinch of Death]

Originally posted by MindFad:
More doomsday predictions already? At such a good time for Apple?

How is this a good time for Apple?!!! iPod Mini's make less profit for Apple and the G5's that were supposed to revitalize the PowerMac lines aren't selling what they thought they would:

"Apple sold just over 3 million computers in its last fiscal year, which ended in September -- 900,000 less than it sold in fiscal 1996, the year before Jobs returned...Meanwhile, Apple's share of the worldwide personal-computer market has shrunk to 2 percent from 3.2 percent five years ago."

"While Apple's sales of $6.2 billion last fiscal year were nearly unchanged from 1999, profits plummeted 90 percent to $69 million, from $601 million four years ago...Jobs' mass-appeal strategy has crimped the company's historically high profit margins. Apple's net profit margin is just 1 percent. That's down from 10 percent four years ago."

"Out of the hundreds of people who were waiting outside Apple's SoHo store in the cold to buy an iPod, I could find only one whose positive experience with the music player led him to buy an Apple computer."

"Tom Santos, one of the plaintiffs, estimates that Apple's stores would have lost as much as $80 million in 2003 had they been paying the same prices for inventory as the resellers paid."

"And Apple's earnings would have been worse had it not been for $4.8 billion the company has in cash and short-term securities. In fact, the cash hoard made more money last year than Apple's operations -- which lost $1 million while the computer maker booked a $69 million gain on interest income."

"Even when you factor in Apple's $13 a share in cash and almost no debt, the company's stock, at a recent $23, trades at 20 times estimated 2004 earnings. Dell's shares, on the other hand, go for 26 times projected 2004 earnings -- but its business is three times as profitable as Apple's."

[olePigeon]

Bah. For now it'll be doomsday predictions. Apple's going out of business again. Run away! Apple sucks! BWAAA! Then a couple months later when the next big trend-setting, innovative product hits the market, Apple's suddenly the best company out there. Embrace them! Apple's cool! BWAAA!

[Vader�s Pinch of Death]

Originally posted by olePigeon:
Bah. For now it'll be doomsday predictions. Apple's going out of business again. Run away! Apple sucks! BWAAA! Then a couple months later when the next big trend-setting, innovative product hits the market, Apple's suddenly the best company out there. Embrace them! Apple's cool! BWAAA!

They are cool and they are one of the best companies but the marketshare is still slipping and they are selling less computers now then when Gil was in charge and they had ugly computers. Explain that.

[zachs]

Originally posted by MindFad:
More doomsday predictions already? At such a good time for Apple?

There'll always be somebody claiming it's the end of Apple.
I just ignore them.

[MacsGalor]

I think that there may be a lot more people out there waiting to buy a G5 as soon as the new ones come out. I bet most of us all thought that they would be out by now. Then again computers now-a-days are getting so good that there is really little need to keep upgrading, I think that unless there are major breakthoughs in the next few years everyones sales will fall short.

[MacGorilla]

"The fewer the men, the greater the share of the honour"

[olePigeon]

Originally posted by Vader�s Pinch of Death:
They are cool and they are one of the best companies but the marketshare is still slipping and they are selling less computers now then when Gil was in charge and they had ugly computers. Explain that.

Apple's marketshare is down, but they're selling more computers. It's because there're more PC vendors out there and the PC industry has grown in general. That results in a slightly smaller marketshare because there's more to contend with.

[wataru]

I still want to know if their marketshare is only shrinking because the market is growing faster than Apple is. If so, who cares?

[gorickey]

gorickey likes Apple...

[Nonsuch]

Originally posted by MacsGalor:
I think that there may be a lot more people out there waiting to buy a G5 as soon as the new ones come out. I bet most of us all thought that they would be out by now.

Ugh. People were making the same excuse before the G5s: once they come out, you'll see PowerMac sales rocket back up. Now they're stagnating because untold thousands of people refuse to settle for anything less than 2.4 Ghz?

No. I'm not saying "Apple is doomed," but the fact is, they're still having trouble persuading people to buy their computers, and that's not good. It may yet change, and I think Apple's leadership is making some pretty good decisions overall, but it's stupid to pretend that this is a healthy situation, or that one more incremental upgrade is going to finally unlock the floodgates.

[MindFad]

G5s in everything but the eMac and iBook, I say. Get on it, Apple.

[typoon]

Apple Computer, Going out of business for the past 30 years...


Here is the thing. How come only MONEY is the one predicting this? Is everyone else blind? No other magazine or analyst seems to be saying what MONEY is.

This just seems more like doom and gloom to me. Apple seems to be hated no matter what they do.

They release iMac- Won't sell, No floppy, Apple sells Boatloads

iPod- Too expensive, will never sell, Has become the next Walkman, changed the way we listen to music and has started a new revolution.

iPod Mini- Too Expensive- Highest PreSales for a non Mac. Selling number 1 at the Applestore, not even released in EU yet and they can't even keep them in.

G5- While not selling as well as they hoped, I think everyone is waiting for the 3GHz that Jobs has promised by summer. We should see G5 Sales pick up again.

Powerbook- Selling well for Apple

iBooks- Selling well for Apple.


Of course you NEVER hear them saying this about M$. OS rittled with holes too many viruses, Next version hasn't even been released yet and probably WON'T be for at LEAST the next 2 years.

OS X- Small marketshare, it's NOT windows, Nothing in the press EVER mentioned about NO KNOWN viruses for the OS X, It's too expensive of an upgrade. OS X is RARELY mentioned in the Press.

It sounds to me like SSDD. (Same Sh!t Different Day). I'm PROUD to be a Mac user and will ALWAYS push the Mac.

I think one of the other reasons they aren't selling many new machines is because Macs last so long.

[ambush]

I'd like someone to explain me why we went from an unrespectable 5% to a shameful 2% market share.

[gururafiki]

Originally posted by wataru:
I still want to know if their marketshare is only shrinking because the market is growing faster than Apple is. If so, who cares?

My thoughts exactly!

[Arkham_c]

Marketshare is a worthless statistic. They could have .1% of a $500 billion market and I'd be thrilled as an investor. Who cares what other people are selling.

As long as Apple is profitable, they will never go out of business. It's as simple as that. As long as revenues exceed expenses, the company can last literally forever.

Apple has $5 billion in the bank earning interest (5% on $5 billion is $250,000,000 a year). With that much change on hand, they can afford quite a few losing quarters before they have any problems at all. Couple that with the fact that Apple hasn't lost money in a long time, and you've got a solvent company.

Apple's not going anywhere.

[Vader�s Pinch of Death]

Originally posted by olePigeon:
Apple's marketshare is down, but they're selling more computers.

Doesn't it say above that they are selling LESS computer since Steve Jobs started?

[tommy]

Originally posted by wataru:
I still want to know if their marketshare is only shrinking because the market is growing faster than Apple is. If so, who cares?

Because if the market is growing faster, others are growing in scale allowing them to lower prices even further leading to further domination. Apple needs to grow marketshare, not keep the same installed base that they had in 1995. How to do this? IMHO, first listen to the consumer. Time after time it baffles me that Apple ignores the desires of its market segments. For example,

Pros want a system that competes with Intel. Apple drops the ball on speed and the G5 shows up a little too late to stop the flood of many from Mac to Intel.

Pros want a pro mouse. Get the hockey puck. Then get the tear drop.

Prosumers want a headless iMac, closest thing they get is the overpriced $1299 G4 and of course it doesn't sell.

Consumers are demanding low prices and instead they get a flat panel iMac that is more expensive than the iMac it replaces.

It seems Apple misses the mark time and again with the exception of the iPod. Sadly, the company has to be set-up to milk as much from its user base because there is no way to crack into the Windows base.

[typoon]

Originally posted by ambush:
I'd like someone to explain me why we went from an unrespectable 5% to a shameful 2% market share.

Well I for one think it is 2 fold.

1. PC's are CHEAP and people don't look at quality just Price. While Price is a GOOD thing to look at you get what you pay for.

2. The Press or lack thereof that Apple gets. You would think a MAJOR uni like Virginia Tech building the 3rd Fastest Supercomputer in the world with an off the shelf computer system would get HUGE press. They didn't only in the Mac World and the "geek" world did they gat a little. Apple gets almost NO press unless it's someone predicting doom and gloom. If you hear that everyday as a normal consumer wouldn't you be worried about where this company is going? I for one feel the Press hasn't shown much love for Apple.

As I state again, Apple Computer, going out of business for the last 30 years.

[fizzlemynizzle]

Originally posted by typoon:
Powerbook- Selling well for Apple

Selling extraordinarily well considering it's relatively slow for the price, but they are still the most coveted laptops. Apple's laptop marketshare increased last year because nobody makes one that can even come close to the powerbook in terms of aesthetics, thin/light design and features. all the fully featured x86 laptops are ugly as sin bricks.

[typoon]

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
Selling extraordinarily well considering it's relatively slow for the price, but they are still the most coveted laptops. Apple's laptop marketshare increased last year because nobody makes one that can even come close to the powerbook in terms of aesthetics, thin/light design and features. all the fully featured x86 laptops are ugly as sin bricks.

You've got that right. Feature for Feature in the Laptops Apple blows the doors off the competition. Where can you find a 12" laptop with a DVD burner for 1799. I might not be looking hard enough But I haven't found one yet. I have mine sitting up front with me and when customers walk in my Powerbook always gets complements.

[dampeoples]

Like has been said before, this is just another doom and gloom article, nothing new to see here. I still wonder why they have not made a low-end machine for the masses.

[vmpaul]

I saw that article headline and thought the same thing, Bah humbug, another Apple is doomed article. Then I read it.

I think there are two things in there that are worrisome. Not marketshare but the decline of profits and profit margins.

"While Apple's sales of $6.2 billion last fiscal year were nearly unchanged from 1999, profits plummeted 90 percent to $69 million, from $601 million four years ago...Jobs' mass-appeal strategy has crimped the company's historically high profit margins. Apple's net profit margin is just 1 percent. That's down from 10 percent four years ago."

When you think about the margins on the iTunes Music Store, and the fact that eventually they are going to have competitors that will force down the margins on the iPod, there isn't a lot to be positive about in regards to profits.

Also, I don't see a a huge growth for ITMS either. They hit the 50 million mark but do you really think it's going to grow exponentially higher? Maybe when Europe comes online but how much bigger can that business get? Plus, we all know the margins are low for that business. Online music sales will only be a complimentary channel as long as CD's rule.

Right now, iPods are gangbusters in marketshare, sales and margins but the profits will decrease as marketshare and sales slow and as the competition gets it's act together...and they will. Think Walkman's in the 80's and what they go for now.

I don't think Apple is doomed but they have their work cut out for them.

[Vader�s Pinch of Death]

Originally posted by dampeoples:
Like has been said before, this is just another doom and gloom article, nothing new to see here.

Really? Explain this:

Apple sold just over 3 million computers in its last fiscal year, which ended in September -- 900,000 less than it sold in fiscal 1996, the year before Jobs returned...Meanwhile, Apple's share of the worldwide personal-computer market has shrunk to 2 percent from 3.2 percent five years ago."

[laxthxdude]

Lets not forget 1 important item: people who buy Macs are not forced into a 2 year cycle of buying a new machine. Sure some of them do, but looking at the big picture, if you buy a Mac, it runs and runs without narry a hickup for most people.

The OS doesn't go down and lock up. The system doesn't slow down the more apps you install on it. It doesn't crash because of a virus or worm.

My mother went through 3 PCs in 4 years. When the iMac (flat screen) came out, I bought her one. Running perfectly, narry a problem. Speed is still fine (including making DVDs - won't win any races while editing a movie, but it works and continues along just fine). She isn't complaining about it locking up, crashing, lost files, can't get her email, ya da ya da ya da. And you know what? I don't plan on replacing the machine anytime soon.

That puts her at:
3 PC in 4 years = 1.33 years on a PC cycle to upgrade and buy
1 Mac in 2 years = 2 years.
1 Mac in 3 years (no plan to upgrade) = 3 year cycle.

How much is this fact playing into the Mac sales?
Personally, I believe the Mac market share is a bunch of BS. There are way more Mac users out there than ANY reports give justice to.

[Hawkeye_a]

1. Apple's market share will continue to dwindle. Why ? Because no matter how many computers they sell, it will alwys be less than the number of x86-type computers the collective competitors sell.

2. The user base for Macs (the actual number or ppl who use macs) will never go down in the long run. Why ? "cause when you go mac, youll never go back" ...cheesy but true.

3. What does that mean for Apple ? Their market share will always go down. for every mac sold...there are probably 100 PCs sold within any particular given time frame (figures not accurate, but used to illustrate my point)

4. How does Apple combat this (they will never defeat it, but how do they minimize the effect ?). The consumer lines of the iMac and iBooks are 'stale' and maybe a bit over priced. i think by having better education discounts would be great. also...faster refresh cycles of the hardware are absolutely necessary to maintain competitive advantage.

5. Apple's marketing is doing an awesome job, unfortunately the various engineering departments arent delivering as fast as they should in my opinion.

6. Apple needs to get into the European, Australian and Japaneeses online music markets ASAP. the competitors are going in and it could be a lost cuse after ppl have chosen their nusic suppliers.

Cheers

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by ambush:
I'd like someone to explain me why we went from an unrespectable 5% to a shameful 2% market share.

Bullsit! We are finally (after three years of slumping to 3%) up to 4%! The market share is on the rise people!

[mitchell_pgh]

I've come to accept that it's pure ignorance.

We don't get viruses,

We are more stable then ever,

We have more applications then ever,

The price of our machines are better then ever,

The speed of our top of the line systems are on par with Windows top of the line systems.

Our OS is multi dimensional (good for basic users, pro users, and even Unix gurus - unlike OS 9)

The iApps are finally to a mature state

We have all the DVD software we could ever want.

The company is "cooler" then ever.


And people still aren't buying

Well, they are going to be getting a little spike from me personally... I think I'm going to be buying a laptop and a desktop within the next year. Unfortunately, I can't get our IT people to even consider Mac hardware, yet we pay people 15X more just for virus problems.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Hawkeye_a:
5. Apple's marketing is doing an awesome job, unfortunately the various engineering departments arent delivering as fast as they should in my opinion.

6. Apple needs to get into the European, Australian and Japaneeses online music markets ASAP. the competitors are going in and it could be a lost cuse after ppl have chosen their nusic suppliers.

Cheers

I don't agree with these two statements.

I don't feel that Apple's marketing is doing an awesome job or even a good job. I see tons of iPod ads, but NOTHING for OS X or the G5/iMac/eMac/PB/iBook...

I have yet to see a compelling commercial that shows me why I should buy a Mac from the perspective of someone that doesn't even know what a Mac is. They never talk about the operating system and how rock solid it is (or any of the other amazing things it can do). They have all the power in the world and really don't use it. The switcher commercials were OK, but they were testimonials (and I usually take testimonial commercials as a grain of salt)

The iTMS isn't making money. I can see that it pushes iPod sales, but I honestly don't think the iTMS is what pushes the sales. The iPod is a status symbol for little rich kids or wanna be rick kids. They are cool, and they work very well for listening to music.

I feel that the music business is falling apart at the seams and it's can't help itself. In 6-12 months Microsoft will come out with something that every retarded Winblows person will start using.

IT MAKES ME WANT TO PUKE AT TIMES. PEOPLE ARE SO RETARDED.

[Jim Paradise]

From the people I know, it's not even about image anymore. Most people these days love Apple computers, their laptops, they love the iPod, they love Mac OS X, and they love the applications, but no one wants to spend close to $4000 Canadian for *just* the low-end G5, 17 inch monitor, and AppleCare. The sad truth is Apple needs to do much more with their iMacs to improve them as consumer machines or they won't expand nearly as much as they could. I'm not saying they even have to drop the price of iMacs substantially, but they need to make them a whole bloody lot better and competitive. It wouldn't even hurt if they made all their computers just a slight bit more configurable.

But it's no longer about image, the hardware (most of it), the operating system, or ignorance of what the company has to offer, though Apple should do a better job of advertising as their advertisments are pathetic in showing what their systems offer and are capable of doing.

(And I'm not advocating that they go after the low-end market.)

[Hawkeye_a]

Mitchell: i agree with you...when i think of marketing i think of what they are doign with education and pro markets.
As far as their advertizing campaigns are going.....i personally think they s-u-c-k. The last descent commercial ive seen from Apple was the 'Rip-Mix-Burn' commercial. im not a fan of the switch comemricals or the new iPod ones. And yes i agree there isnt a campaign for OSX or the G5s... heck ppl apart from mac users dont even know these things exist.

They need to step up their campaigns of OSX and i recommend taking a que from the original bondi-iMac commercials, which i think said a lot.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by Hawkeye_a:
They need to step up their campaigns of OSX and i recommend taking a que from the original bondi-iMac commercials, which i think said a lot.

Indeed, taking a cue from the Traffic-commercial:

You see a pc booting up, upon opening windows a small beetle crawls out of an air-duct. More follows and soon the PC is crawling with bugs. Pan to an iMac surfing happily with Safari.

[Mediaman_12]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I feel that the music business is falling apart at the seams and it's can't help itself. In 6-12 months Microsoft will come out with something that every retarded Winblows person will start using.

According to this article on todays MacNN front page MS is about to launch a 'system' THIS WEEK, In EUROPE. If Apple dosen't get a move on there will hardly any pont in launching the EU iTMS. The MP3 player market is Apples to loose, and in Europe at least that day is getting mighty close.

[Jan Van Boghout]

Originally posted by Mediaman_12:
According to this article on todays MacNN front page MS is about to launch a 'system' THIS WEEK, In EUROPE. If Apple dosen't get a move on there will hardly any pont in launching the EU iTMS. The MP3 player market is Apples to loose, and in Europe at least that day is getting mighty close.

Apple doesn't really have a presence at all around here. I think it's 3 factors:

- "Apple is so expensive, you snob"
- "What?! It can't do MSN? And I need Word!" (Office X doesn't count because they charge insane prices and the Windows Office is installed or pirated on every PC here)
- "A Mac won't play any cool games!"

When you say you're a Mac user here, you usually get either the "WTF is he talking about" look, or the "You're such a filthy snob" look

[Jan Van Boghout]

Also, "It doesn't have Kazaa!? Where will I get my music".

I even knew a girl who thought Kazaa is perfectly legal

[Altix]

Originally posted by typoon:
You've got that right. Feature for Feature in the Laptops Apple blows the doors off the competition. Where can you find a 12" laptop with a DVD burner for 1799. I might not be looking hard enough But I haven't found one yet. I have mine sitting up front with me and when customers walk in my Powerbook always gets complements.

Dell sell a 14.1" Inspiron, with a dvd/cd burner, and 2.4ghz cpu for $850.

[Zimphire]

MS is supposed to be coming out with a do everything craptastic iPod killer. It has a screen smaller than a gameboy, and they expect you to watch movies on it.

I am sure MS is paying people to spread Apple FUD.

[typoon]

Originally posted by Altix:
Dell sell a 14.1" Inspiron, with a dvd/cd burner, and 2.4ghz cpu for $850.

Yes, 14.1 inch screen. With the Portability of the 12 inch I don't think there are many that have a Superdrive in them.

[The Ginger Rat]

Originally posted by gururafiki:
My thoughts exactly!

Severe price cutting on the PC side. If you google for the most recent IDC release on PC sales, more units are being sold but revenue is flat.

[mitchell_pgh]

I consider myself a quasi-power user, but as I now enter in to my late 20's, I'm finding that I can't stand the iMac (which I though was very innovative in the beginning, but now I consider it too retro and feel that most new computer people look at it like a toy)

I keep joking about this, but as time goes on, I keep getting more serious about it...

Create this and add a monitor option (exact same monitor as iMac)



$800 - Combo drive - I would buy at least two of these.

[The Ginger Rat]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
MS is supposed to be coming out with a do everything craptastic iPod killer. It has a screen smaller than a gameboy, and they expect you to watch movies on it.

I am sure MS is paying people to spread Apple FUD.

It's an awkward looking thing, and not very elegant or professional looking. Large, too.

IMO the "iPod killer" moniker was used to generate hits- it doesn't really seem to serve the same market.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
I am sure MS is paying people to spread Apple FUD.

Why when there are 5+ years with no training IT people that will do it for free.

[AB^2=BCxAC]

The Money article is pure FUD.

First of all, they should quit comparing Apple 2003/2004 to Apple 1996. That was another computer world, practically pre-internet boom, pre-MS Office widespread adoption, pre-miniDV and DVD, etc.

By 1997, Apple had to reinvent itself or die, and it reinvented itself as a smaller, leaner company that could thrive on a small market share. Let me repeat that: it reinvented itself as a smaller, leaner company that could thrive on a small market share. And it succeeded and is getting better every year!

Compare Apple 1998 to Apple 2003 and then you see the better picture of Apple growth. Look at these stats from Apple's 2003 SCC filing:

- Net sales of peripherals and other hardware rose $384 million or 57% during 2003 compared 2002, which follows a $287 million or 74% increase in 2002 as compared to 2001. The current year increase was primarily driven by the $202 million, or 141%, year-over-year increase in iPod net sales to $345 million. All of the Company's operating segments experienced substantial increases in iPod net sales and unit sales during 2003. iPod sales during 2003 were favorably affected by the introduction of substantially redesigned new models, which are compatible with both Macintosh and Windows operating systems and by the Company's introduction of its iTunes Music Store for the Macintosh operating system in April 2003. The Company's iPod digital music player is sold by a variety of resellers, many of which do not currently market the Company's Macintosh systems. The Company has expanded this distribution network during 2003, which has contributed to the current year increase in iPod unit sales of 146%.

- In addition to the iPod, the increase in net sales of peripherals and other hardware during 2003 also reflects an overall increase in net sales of other computer accessories including AirPort cards and base stations, which facilitate wireless connectivity; third party digital cameras and printers; and a number of portable computer related accessories.

- Although total Macintosh unit sales were down 3% in 2003, unit sales of the Company's portable systems were relatively strong primarily due to the 69% or 247,000 unit increase in PowerBook unit sales, slightly offset by a 4% or 30,000 unit decrease in iBook unit sales. The increase in PowerBook net sales of $468 million or 56% is due primarily to the success of the Company's new 12-inch, 15-inch and 17-inch models that were introduced during 2003. The decline in iBook consumer portable sales during 2003 is primarily due to a lower average price per unit. Portable systems represented 42% of all Macintosh systems sold in 2003 versus 33% in 2002 and 31% in 2001, which reflects an overall industry trend towards portable systems.

- The Company's average net sales per Macintosh unit sold increased 2% to $1,491 in 2003 as a result of various changes in overall unit mix towards relatively higher-priced PowerBook systems and an increase in direct sales primarily from the Company's retail and online stores.

- iBook consumer portable systems. PowerBook and Power Macintosh systems accounted for 42% of total unit sales in 2003 versus 36% in 2002.

Now how is that for a reality check on this article? Now why is Apple losing market share... that's easy to answer. It's shut out of retail markets where it used to flourish or never has - education, small business, and corporate infrastructure.

[Altix]

Originally posted by typoon:
Yes, 14.1 inch screen. With the Portability of the 12 inch I don't think there are many that have a Superdrive in them.

It has a dvd-r, and for less money, you can get a smaller screen, or any screen size you need. Not bad though.

[Altix]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I consider myself a quasi-power user, but as I now enter in to my late 20's, I'm finding that I can't stand the iMac (which I though was very innovative in the beginning, but now I consider it too retro and feel that most new computer people look at it like a toy)

I keep joking about this, but as time goes on, I keep getting more serious about it...

Create this and add a monitor option (exact same monitor as iMac)



$800 - Combo drive - I would buy at least two of these.

That is nice

I like the lcd iMacs a lot, very nice design, and machines, great as a family computer. Saynig that though, I never liked the original iMacs.

[derbs]

Haha that article is complete ********. It's up there with that nob Dvorak back in 1998 saying 'folks, the Mac platform is through', and Michael Dell's numerous predictions of Apple's bankruptcy.

The Mac platform will never be through.

Why?

Because pretty much anyone who buys a Mac never goes back. It has a hardcore of customers who buy nothing but Apple. Take my family for instance, my folks have only ever bought Macs, since the late 80s. I've only ever bought Macs. We must have bought like 30 Macs in total. And 3 iPods. And there's many other families just like that. I'll buy Macs for my kids, and then they'll buy Macs.

Dell, or HP or anyone else would love to have the loyal customer base Apple have.

So how many PC users are loyal to their manufacturer, in the same way Apple users are? You see, I think Dell will go down before Apple ever does. All they can do is try and cut every single cost they can in an ever more competitive market. Apple is not even in that market. It's above that market.

Plus they innovate as well. They innovated with the iPod and are making a stack of money off it. Like a year later, Dell comes out with their own one, which is a piece of sh�t and sells f��k-all. It won't be long til Apple comes out with its next innovation.

[osiris]

Originally posted by typoon:
Apple Computer, Going out of business for the past 30 years...

That would make a great ad campaign (of course, in a tongue in cheeky kind of way).

[John F. Smith]

You'd think that Apple would be making better progress, considering that every single customer it has is helping run the business!