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mfbernstein · Mar 2, 2007, 11:26 AM

In an effort to speed up backups (which are catastrophically slow over USB 2.0, never more than 10MB/s in real terms), I bought an e-SATA express card from OWC (APIOTEK EC-0003D) for my MBP/OS X 10.4.8. Performance is much better, although oddly variable (anywhere between 15-30MB/s)

The problem is that the hot swap feature seems very finicky. Sometimes drives mount, sometimes they don't. Disconnecting the card usually improves things for a bit, but it's not very convenient.

I'm using the latest drivers I could find, and I even updated the firmware through Windows, but no dice.

My second problem is with an external drive that has a SATA connector (not an e-SATA one). I purchased two short cable adapters, but they don't seem to do the trick (neither OS X nor XP sees the drive). Anybody know what cables actually do work in this case?

Also, I'd be curious to know what the preferred interface for external drives is among MacBook/PowerBook owners. USB seems slow, FIrewire 400 not much better, Firewire 800 is hard to find/expensive and e-SATA is so far faky.

Thanks.

olePigeon · Mar 2, 2007, 02:08 PM

Even if it's a little pricey, I think your best option is FireWire 800.

G-DRIVE High Performance and Stylish FireWire and USB Storage Solutions

This seems pretty reasonable AND it looks cool.

ghporter · Mar 2, 2007, 04:56 PM

My USB 2.0 external drives are REALLY fast; WAY faster than 10MB/s. What USB drive/enclosure are you using?

I don't know that eSATA will help if there's some problem with the drive itself.

mfbernstein · Mar 2, 2007, 06:46 PM

The drives are:
2.5" 120GB 5400RPM Seagate Momentus in a Vantec NexStar3 enclosure
3.5" 500GB 7200RPM Maxtor Maxline Pro in an AMS Venus DS3 enclosure
(both SATA)

These are not slow drives (in particular the Maxtor). Indeed, the performance with USB for those two is identical, so I suspect USB being the bottleneck, not the drive or enclosure.

I measured the speed by copying a 1GB file to and from the internal to the external drive. Actually, performance is usually closer to 15MB/s with USB, vs. 20-40MB/s with e-SATA.

mduell · Mar 2, 2007, 07:12 PM

That performance is really bad... I have a Seagate 500G in an AZIO USB2/eSATA enclosure (with an eSATA PC Card) and I get 20MBps over USB and 60MBps over eSATA.

What app are you using to copy files? I noticed on my parents iMac that Dantz Retrospect is really slow compared to copying using the command line.

CaptainHaddock · Mar 3, 2007, 12:09 AM

Originally Posted by mfbernstein

In an effort to speed up backups (which are catastrophically slow over USB 2.0, never more than 10MB/s in real terms), I bought an e-SATA express card from OWC (APIOTEK EC-0003D) for my MBP/OS X 10.4.8. Performance is much better, although oddly variable (anywhere between 15-30MB/s)
[...]
Also, I'd be curious to know what the preferred interface for external drives is among MacBook/PowerBook owners. USB seems slow, FIrewire 400 not much better, Firewire 800 is hard to find/expensive and e-SATA is so far faky.

Have you given Firewire 400 a fair shake? I just timed a file transfer to my FW400 drive, and it was 30MB/s. My FW800 drive is faster yet, about 50 MB/s.

One thing I agree on: USB sucks for hard disks.

ghporter · Mar 3, 2007, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by CaptainHaddock

One thing I agree on: USB sucks for hard disks.

And this I disagree on. I have two different external devices, one is strictly a USB hard drive, and the other is also a network drive. With USB connections they both are VERY fast. I have yet to find a Firewire drive adapter that is as affordable as a USB adapter, and so far I see no reason to start saving for one. I should also add that almost all of my files are under 1GB, which plays to USB 2.0's strengths; Firewire 400 would probably be faster if I was transferring almost all huge files. But not by a whole lot.

Macpilot · Mar 3, 2007, 12:18 PM

Usb 2.0 sucks...has never been as fast, powerful, or reliable as firewire 400.

Go with 800.

Simon · Mar 3, 2007, 01:05 PM

Originally Posted by CaptainHaddock

Have you given Firewire 400 a fair shake? I just timed a file transfer to my FW400 drive, and it was 30MB/s. My FW800 drive is faster yet, about 50 MB/s.

One thing I agree on: USB sucks for hard disks.

I have to agree with every statement made here.

My external FW HD does about ~30MB/s over FW400 and I get almost 50MB/s over FW800. If anything else than FW, I'd take eSATA. USB2 for decent performing HDs just plain outright sucks.

ghporter · Mar 3, 2007, 08:44 PM

What are you using to measure transfer rates? I'd like to check my two USB external drives to see where I stack up. Since I have yet to find a Firewire enclosure that isn't seriously more expensive than USB enclosures, I don't have one to compare at home, but if i can use the same tool to measure my transfer rates, I can see if it would be worth it to me to get one of the pricey Firewire enclosures.

brokenjago · Mar 3, 2007, 09:33 PM

Define "seriously more expensive." I just bought (as in, 4 days ago) a combo USB2/Firewire 400 Drive for ~$23 off of Newegg.

Simon · Mar 4, 2007, 04:29 AM

Originally Posted by ghporter

What are you using to measure transfer rates?

scp works fine. Alternatively, ActivityMonitor shows disk access too.

ghporter · Mar 4, 2007, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by brokenjago

Define "seriously more expensive." I just bought (as in, 4 days ago) a combo USB2/Firewire 400 Drive for ~$23 off of Newegg.

I haven't been shopping for an enclosure for quite a while. When I did buy my last one, the ONLY firewire enclosure I found cost something like $75 compared to the $25 USB2 enclosure (I can't remember the vendor right now). I'll keep my eyes peeled; new devices with newly released hardware are coming out all the time and this may simply be an example of me not looking at the right time.

Simon, thanks for the info-I'll start looking for SCP.

Big Mac · Mar 4, 2007, 10:16 AM

USB is for input devices. It's not for network devices. It's not for mass storage devices. It's bad enough that new iPods rely on it.

Powerbook · Mar 4, 2007, 11:48 AM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

USB is for input devices. It's not for network devices. It's not for mass storage devices. It's bad enough that new iPods rely on it.

Seconded, thirded and fourded.

PB.

Simon · Mar 4, 2007, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by ghporter

Simon, thanks for the info-I'll start looking for SCP.

It's a part of every OS X install.

% man scp

Simon · Mar 4, 2007, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

USB is for input devices. It's not for network devices. It's not for mass storage devices. It's bad enough that new iPods rely on it.

Exactly.

SVass · Mar 4, 2007, 02:14 PM

250GB DiskGO 3.5" Portable Hard Drive w Quad Interface Edge Tech Corp. PE207328 at MacConnection
is what I just got and it seems similar to the Olepigeon drive. It came with four cables for each of the interfaces and I used it with Superduper to clone a laptop. sam

danviento · Mar 4, 2007, 08:24 PM

If you're planning on getting an external FireWire drive, keep in mind that the 400 and 800 are on the same bus. I have a FW400 audio interface and got a FW800 drive to do audio recordings on. Sadly, the bus can't handle both when I'm doing live recording/playback (unless you drop the recording bitrate, of course). I always end up recording to my internal and moving the files over to the external for later editting. It probably doesn't pertain completely to your situation, but it's something to keep in mind for future application. Good luck!

lepprd · Mar 5, 2007, 09:13 AM

I am very satisfied with both my CombrGB portable disk drive (800 FireWire) and SilverSATA I both from Wiebetech. My ExpressCard34 is also from WiebeTech. I do not have the speed specs available as I type this, but Iam very impressed with the SATA speed with no problems. The WiebeTech drives come with multiple cables.