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maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 12:55 PM

Right. So, I was working overtime last saturday and the guy tending the warehouse gave me venison sausage and a leg steak.
Now I know venison is lean. Super lean. How to cook it without going all tough? Not sure I want to marinate the hell out of it- I want to taste the sucker.
Anyone?

Montanan · Feb 18, 2003, 01:07 PM

Yum ... a good vension roast can be very tasty.

Anyhow, I haven't done this in a while (still trying to cut down on the red meat), but the trick is to add animal fat (like salt pork) to the roast prior to cooking. Here's something from freerecipe.org that illustrates what to do:

Old Fashioned Roast Leg of Vension

Leg of venison
Fat salt pork
Salt and pepper
1/4 cup butter or oil
Flour

Wipe carefully and draw off the dry skin. Lard the lean side of the leg with strips of the pork, then soften the butter, use oil and rub it over the meat, and dredge with salt, pepper and flour. Lay the leg on the rack in the baking pan, sprinkle the bottom of the pan with flour, place it in a very hot oven (450 degrees F.) And watch carefully until the flour in the pan is browned, which should be in five minutes. Add boiling water to cover the bottom of the pan. Baste the venison well every fifteen minutes, until the meat is done, renewing the water in the pan as often as necessary. If a double roasting pan is used, basting is not necessary. Should the meat be liked very rare, allow one and one-quarter hour of cooking for a ten pound roast; most tastes require at least twenty-five minutes longer than that. Serve with a gravy made from the juices in the bottom of the pan. Always serve a tart jelly like currant jelly or wild grape or plum jelly with venison.

Mastrap · Feb 18, 2003, 01:07 PM

My friend Delia's recipe:

Venison Sausages Braised in Red Wine

Bangers are bangers, but there are some bangers that are extremely special - and venison sausages are positively five-star, especially when you serve them braised slowly with herbs, shallots, mushrooms and red wine. Then all you need is a pile of light, creamy mashed potato to go with them.

1 lb (450 g) venison sausages

10 fl oz (275 ml) red wine

1 dessertspoon olive oil

8 oz (225 g) diced bacon or pancetta

1 large clove garlic, peeled

8 oz (225g) shallots, peeled

1 level dessertspoon juniper berries

1 level teaspoon chopped fresh thyme

2 bay leaves

6 oz (175 g) medium-sized, open-cap mushrooms

1 heaped teaspoon plain flour

1 rounded teaspoon mustard powder

1 oz (25 g) butter, softened

1 rounded tablespoon redcurrant jelly

salt and freshly milled black pepper

Heat the oil in a casserole then, with the heat at medium, brown the sausages evenly all over, taking care not to split the skins by turning them over too soon. Next, using a slotted spoon, transfer them to a plate while you brown the diced bacon along with the garlic and shallots. Now crush the juniper berries very slightly without breaking them, just enough to release their flavour. Return the sausages to the casserole, pour in the wine and add the berries, then thyme and bay leaves. Now season lightly, bring it all up to a gentle simmer, put a lid on the casserole, turn the heat as low as possible and let it all simmer gently for 30 minutes.

After that, add the mushrooms, stirring them in well, then leave everything to cook gently for a further 20 minutes, this time without the lid so the liquid reduces slightly. To finish off, remove the sausages and vegetables to a warm serving dish, mix the flour and the mustard powder with the softened butter until you have a smooth paste and whisk this, a little at a time, into the casserole. Let everything bubble for a few more minutes, then take the casserole off the heat, return the sausages to the casserole, whisk in the redcurrant jelly and it's ready to serve.

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 01:09 PM

STEAK! STEAK, people, STEAK!!! Leg Steak!

DBursey · Feb 18, 2003, 01:09 PM

Turn down the heat (venison/most game will dry out badly if cooked over high heat), keep a little water in the pan, and don't overcook. Don't salt the meat prior to cooking, as this will tend to dry it out even more. Use an oil-based marinade to help prevent the venison from sticking/burning to the pan.

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 01:15 PM

THANK, you D.
And Mas, I'll tickle the sausage recipe when I get round to it. THanks for that. And I'll be getting a roast today or tomorrow, so I'll try Monty's recipe for that!
Productive!

Mastrap · Feb 18, 2003, 01:16 PM

Originally posted by maxelson:
STEAK! STEAK, people, STEAK!!! Leg Steak!

Demands, demans, demands

I'd marinade it in red wine, bay leaves and juniper berries. Get your pan blazingly hot and treat it like a good steak. De-glaze the pan with the marinade, reduce to make a highly flavoured sauce, serve with new buttered potatoes and green beans.

Happy now?

boots · Feb 18, 2003, 01:16 PM

The key to any game is that it has more connective tissue than beef. So you need to cook it longer and at lower temps if you don't want it to be too tough. Pan frying is generally too fast, and doesn't break down the tissues enough. (Kind of like the difference between duck and chicken/turkey.)

One of my fav's growing up (and this is from memory) is to cut the steak into cubes, dredge them in a flour/pepper mix (I go heavy on the pepper, myself), and panfry each side for about 3-5 minutes. Add red wine (cheap stuff works well...I recommend a bourgundy), some sliced mushrooms, and some water till you get a slightly thin gravey. Then cover it and let it simmer until the pieces of venison are tender. The gravey will thicken as it concentrates...if it gets too thick, just add more water. Serve it with rice or egg-noodles. Mmmm Mmmm. My mouth is watering just thinking about that.

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 01:19 PM

CHOICES! Thass what I like to see! CHOICES!!!

philzilla · Feb 18, 2003, 01:21 PM

give it to your dog, and have a nice lentil casserole instead. you know you want to

Montanan · Feb 18, 2003, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by maxelson:
STEAK! STEAK, people, STEAK!!! Leg Steak!

D'oh!

:: clears throat, tries to get on-topic ::

Anyhow, depending on the caliber of the meat, I'd probably marinate the steak just a little bit prior to cooking ... if you don't get carried away there, you'll definitely still be able to taste the vension. Just use a little olive oil and lemon juice, maybe for an hour or so.

And definitely follow the "tart jelly" advice in the recipe I posted.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm off to raid the refrigerator ...

Mastrap · Feb 18, 2003, 01:24 PM

Sorry to be controversial

but good game steak is wonderful when pan-fried.

It does very much depend on the age of the animal and quality of the meat. A good steak from a young deer is perfect for quick pan frying whereas an older animal or a lesser cut needs long, slow cooking, I agree.

Mushrooms and game. Wonderful. Especially dried, Italian, porcini.

boots · Feb 18, 2003, 01:27 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Sorry to be controversial but good game steak is wonderful when pan-fried.

It does very much depend on the age of the animal and quality of the meat. A good steak from a young deer is perfect for quick pan frying whereas an older animal or a lesser cut needs long, slow cooking, I agree.

Mushrooms and game. Wonderful. Especially dried, Italian, porcini.

Very true. A button-buck is very good. It hasn't developed as much of the connective tissue as an "aged" buck. And pan-frying is fine, but the steak will be "tougher" than your typical Black-Angus pan-fried steak. I was just trying to establish a couple of principles for "wild game" cooking.

Mastrap · Feb 18, 2003, 01:30 PM

Originally posted by boots:
Very true. A button-buck is very good. It hasn't developed as much of the connective tissue as an "aged" buck. And pan-frying is fine, but the steak will be "tougher" than your typical Black-Angus pan-fried steak. I was just trying to establish a couple of principles for "wild game" cooking.

I always knew that game was tougher than beef or comparable meats but I never knew why. Interesting, this

boots · Feb 18, 2003, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
I always knew that game was tougher than beef or comparable meats but I never knew why. Interesting, this

I recommend a book called "How to Read a French Fry" by Parsons. Although a little off on some of the technical stuff, it is a very good read for the amateur gourmet. It gives a lot of insight into why thing cook in different ways and how to use that to your advantage.

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 01:46 PM

Originally posted by boots:
I recommend a book called "How to Read a French Fry" by Parsons. Although a little off on some of the technical stuff, it is a very good read for the amateur gourmet. It gives a lot of insight into why thing cook in different ways and how to use that to your advantage.

::scurries off to add to amazon wish list::

cdhostage · Feb 18, 2003, 03:49 PM

Kill the bunnies!

boots · Feb 18, 2003, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by cdhostage:
Kill the bunnies!

IMO, the best way to cook rabbit is to put it in a crock-pot with a can of cream-of-mushroom soup and 1/2 a beer. Cook it on medium for about 6 hours. Damn!

This is also the only way I know to make squirrel palatable.

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 04:20 PM

Squiril, huh? I got two living in my walls. Hmmmm...

boots · Feb 18, 2003, 04:30 PM

Originally posted by maxelson:
Squiril, huh? I got two living in my walls. Hmmmm...

hehe Not worth it, in my opinion. Too tough and stringy. Bear is also not really worth it except to cay "yeah, I've had bear!" at a cocktail party.

My cousin (through marriage...I don't know him very well) raises buffalo. Very tasty. Also very lean, so you have to cut it with beef so it has a little fat to keep it moise when cooked.

Buffalo burger rocks!

maxelson · Feb 18, 2003, 04:33 PM

LOVE bison. LOVE it.

My crock recipe:

BIson steak (flank, whatever)

chopped green chilis
cumin
salt
cilantro
tequila
LOTS of lime
onion
garlic

into the crock for 5 hours or so.

Shred. Use in fajitas with the usual fajita stuff. Mmmmmm.

Bison burgers ROCK. On the grill. We got us a bison farm 10 miles northeast of us. We used to live a mile or so from it. Upwind, thanks the gods...

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 10:24 AM

RIGHT. Update on my dinner... because this is important, you know.
RIGHTY now, a venison leg steak is marinading in the following:
Olive oil
Red wine (Shiraz/ Cab)
a little salt
a little pepper
a little sugar
Allspice- just a coupla pinches
Tyme- ditto
a coupla crushed garlic cloves
a handful of minced onion
a palmful of Coleman's Mustard.

Cooking will most like be done on the cast iron as I wish to reduce said marinade and make a little dripping sauce.

'Twil be served thusly with a side of mashed Yukons (rosemary, yogurt, salt, pepper, olive oil), roasted asparagus (olive oil, lemon, kosher salt) and perhaps some roasted maple glazed carrots. Maybe. If I'm feeling up to it. Carrots may not happen. Oooo. The tension.

Montanan · Feb 19, 2003, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by maxelson:
RIGHT. Update on my dinner... because this is important, you know.

What time would you like us all to come over? I'll bring the beer.

philzilla · Feb 19, 2003, 10:41 AM

Originally posted by maxelson:
RIGHT. Updete-a oon my deenner. Hurty flurty schnipp schnipp!.. becoose-a thees is impurtunt, yuoo knoo.
RIGHTY noo, a feneesun leg steek is mereeneding in zee fullooeeng:
Ooleefe-a ooeel
Red veene-a (Shurez/ Ceb)
a leettle-a selt
a leettle-a pepper
a leettle-a sooger
Ellspeece-a- joost a cuoopla peenches
Tyme-a- deettu
a cuoopla crooshed gerleec clufes
a hundffool ooff meenced ooneeun
a pelmffool ooff Culemun's Moosterd.

Bork bork bork!

Cuukeeng veell must leeke-a be-a dune-a oon zee cest irun es I veesh tu redooce-a seeed mereenede-a und meke-a a leettle-a dreepping sooce-a.

'Tveel be-a serfed thoosly veet a seede-a ooff meshed Yookuns (rusemery, yugoort, selt, pepper, ooleefe-a ooeel), ruested esperegoos (ooleefe-a ooeel, lemun, kusher selt) und perheps sume-a ruested meple-a glezed cerruts. Um gesh dee bork, bork! Meybe-a. Iff I'm feeleeng up tu it. Um de hur de hur de hur. Cerruts mey nut heppee. Oouuu. Zee tenseeun.

Bork bork bork!

sounds good (for you meat folk, that is), if you can understand a word the fruitcake says...

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 10:41 AM

Hectually, we are having wine. A nice shiraz, if'n ye pleases...

GoGoReggieXPowars · Feb 19, 2003, 11:41 AM

Damn, max, that's sounds mighty tasty! A bit of the ol' '74 Crim playing in the background would go nicely

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 12:25 PM

YES! YES IT WOULD!!! Unfortunately, my wife ain't no Crimnoggin. I'd get the single raised eyebrow and pursed lips until I turned it off.
Nope. Twill be accompanied by a nice Jazz playlist on the progPod:
Oscar Peterson
Thelonius Monk
The Quintet
Charlie Mingus
Early Miles Davis
Dave Brubeck
Chuck Mangione
Coltrane
Kenny G
Bill Evans
Charlie Parker
Serge Gainsbourg

kidding. I got no Chuck Mangione or Kenny G.

GoGoReggieXPowars · Feb 19, 2003, 12:37 PM

Hmm, I guess you're right. More of a relaxed evening, with some smoove jazz, what with the 8 feet of snow and all. I don't even know if I've met a woman who likes King Crimson, aside from some of the 80's stuff. She was a rare catch!

G4ME · Feb 19, 2003, 01:16 PM

when a buddy of mine hit a dear infront of his house, (5 point buck) his neighbor came over and feild dressed it right there, and then brought the carcase over to his house where he then butchered the thing right then and there. My buddy had about 100 lbs of venison in the frezzer and he happily offered some to me.

So i brought it into work one night and had the Sous Chef prepare it up, he used some fresh rosemary, with a balsamic vinergerete, i had two steaks about 1/2 -3/4 inch thick and we let one soak over night (had it the next day) while i had the other at the end of the night.

All i have to say is damn its not that bad, the vinergerte is a very nice addition. Needless to say that i was very happy and would try it again anytime

christ · Feb 19, 2003, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by maxelson:
...Serge Gainsbourg

What's this? "Je T'aime" to finish off - Max must be on a promise!

christ · Feb 19, 2003, 01:35 PM

Don't marinade your meat - just hang it for a week. Improves the flavour & saves it getting tough. The only penalty, it may have rotted a wee smidge, but us meat-eaters will put up with that in the search for good flavour!

christ · Feb 19, 2003, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by G4ME:
when a buddy of mine hit a dear infront of his house, ...

What, as in 'old dear'?

Are you allowed to claim pensioners as road kill in your state? This strikes me as an excellent way to save on medicaid, and feed the populace.

Soylent Green _is_ people!

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 01:38 PM

I'm afraid that, between the weather, dogs, wife and numerous critters who share my space, hanging is not an option.

boots · Feb 19, 2003, 01:39 PM

With regard to the sausage, I've never had a better breakfast taco than those I've had with venison sausage. Simply can't be beat.

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 01:48 PM

Yeah. I am looking forward to the sausage. I am in a total quandry about what to do with it, though. The guy who gave me the meat said it made a KILLER breakfast sausage, pretty much as is.
Or do I crumble it with peppers, onions and shrooms?
In a sauce?

Mastrap · Feb 19, 2003, 01:51 PM

Originally posted by maxelson:
Yeah. I am looking forward to the sausage. I am in a total quandry about what to do with it, though. The guy who gave me the meat said it made a KILLER breakfast sausage, pretty much as is.
Or do I crumble it with peppers, onions and shrooms?
In a sauce?

Why do I bother?

G4ME · Feb 19, 2003, 01:51 PM

Originally posted by christ:
What, as in 'old dear'?

Are you allowed to claim pensioners as road kill in your state? This strikes me as an excellent way to save on medicaid, and feed the populace.

Soylent Green _is_ people!

yeah yeah i know deer, what ever

but yeah maine among others has the law, that if you hit it and kill it, its yours, or the warden will take it.

So the saying is true, you kill it we grill it!

Gotta love Maine for that one

Mastrap · Feb 19, 2003, 01:52 PM

That reminds me, I've just ordered some sausage making equipment. I love good sausages and always wanted to make my own. I'll keep you informed.

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 02:07 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Why do I bother?

Or YES, utilizing Mastrap's sumptuous sounding recipe to prepare what would undoubtedly be a veritable orgasm of the taste buds- one which, quite frankly, may be so rapturously delightful... I may not survive the experience.
... oh, the divas that are my friends...

maxelson · Feb 19, 2003, 02:09 PM

I NEED a meat grinder.
My Grandfather had a kicking one. I THINK my sister has it. Hmmm. Something's not right, there.

maxelson · Feb 20, 2003, 08:49 AM

Last night's dinner...
SPECTACULAR. Seriously. I just don't remember venison being quite THAT good.

I did the recipe I mentioned for marinade.

Steak on a hot lightly oiled cast iron. 2 minuites each side. Heat WAY down. Cover for 2 minutes.
Pulled the steak, deglazed with the marinade. Reduced. Mmmmm.

What to try differently next time? Actual dijon mustard instead of mustard powder. The powder became a bit mealy in the sauce. Was not quite as velvety as I would have liked.

Today for lunch: Venison sammige!

christ · Feb 20, 2003, 09:12 AM

Yes, all of this food talk is OK, but did M Gainsbourg and Mme Birkin have the required effect?

maxelson · Feb 20, 2003, 09:22 AM

I do suppose that all depends on what you mean by "required".
Keep in mind I am married, have a two year old and hell, it was a school night.
Cut me slack. The venison was good.

boots · Feb 20, 2003, 09:36 AM

Originally posted by maxelson:
I do suppose that all depends on what you mean by "required".
Keep in mind I am married, have a two year old and hell, it was a school night.
Cut me slack. The venison was good.

Being married myself, and given that my wife is in graduate school and I'm doing a post-doc, the "required" effect of something like this is to relax the two of us and give us a few hours of lowered stress. I imagine your goals were similar. Hope it worked. Those few hours of low stress can be miraculous.

maxelson · Feb 20, 2003, 09:48 AM

Well, the stress would have been non existant had I not had to hunt for a clog somewhere in the plumbing. Sigh. What I go through to avoid being raped by a plumber.

christ · Feb 21, 2003, 05:58 AM

Sorry to take the conversation into areas best left unexplored, it was crude and unfeeling of me. Mea Culpa.

I am glad that you enjoyed your venison steak.