[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

This sounds vaguely familiar. Staind? I didn't read the story. I avoid a lot of articles passed sensationalist or disgusting headlines.

Lostprophets. Ian Watkins is the miscreant in question.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

It is also about what happens when you go off the reservation.

This is what I'm talking about. That is nutter conspiracy bullshit that he got buried because he wasn't towing the black line. I guess it took them 30 years to finally bring him down since he's been saying this stuff forever?

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by ort888 

What's extra creepy about the whole thing is that Bill Cosby's celebrity status pretty much guaranteed him an endless supply of willing and super attractive sex partners should he desire them. And yet, he does this crap. The dude obviously got off on the drugging and unwillingness part more than anything else.

Power trip and manipulation. Don't some people say rape isn't about sex?

[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

This is what I'm talking about. That is nutter conspiracy bullshit that he got buried because he wasn't towing the black line. I guess it took them 30 years to finally bring him down since he's been saying this stuff forever?

Yeah, I don't remember people keeping quiet about thinking he's a jackass.

[Jawbone54]

I definitely think that Bill Cosby has been out of favor with most in the left for years due to his comments, but I don't think it's related to the outrage that nearly everyone is expressing for him.

It's the fact that he was such an influential figure for so many decades, and now we all feel lied to. In a way, his victims weren't the only ones he raped.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

I definitely think that Bill Cosby has been out of favor with most in the left for years due to his comments, but I don't think it's related to the outrage that nearly everyone is expressing for him.

It's the fact that he was such an influential figure for so many decades, and now we all feel lied to. In a way, his victims weren't the only ones he raped.

Careful with that hyperbole…

You know, there are ways not like a performer if you didn't want to do it.

[mattyb]

Originally Posted by subego 

The Saville stuff is very bad, but I've been able to handle it.

The guy in the band is so bad no one wants to print it. You need to look at the police reports. That's a pass for me.

There are some stories that link a former Home Secretary (I guess like Attorney General in the US) to a missing dossier about paedophile politicians.

Really is incredible that this stuff takes so long to get widespread media attention.

[OAW]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

This is what I'm talking about. That is nutter conspiracy bullshit that he got buried because he wasn't towing the black line. I guess it took them 30 years to finally bring him down since he's been saying this stuff forever?

Exactly. All of that is pure unadulterated foolishness that's only espoused by those who are utterly clueless about "black culture" yet still see fit to proffer up their "expert" commentary.

The criticism leveled at Cosby was generally not rooted in the truthfulness of his commentary (which for the record I agree with) ... but how the delivery of his message left it wide-open to be co-opted by white conservatives (i.e. Limbaugh, Hannity, Ingraham, etc.) looking for political cover for their race-baiting behavior.

As for these allegations ... color me skeptical when a woman on the one hand claims that a high-profile celebrity "drugged and raped" her ... but on the other hand continues the relationship. And such allegations are made well after any physical testing could be done to detect the presence of any intoxicating agents at all ... let alone in a manner to determine whether or not they were taken willingly? But the rent is still paid. Acting lessons still provided. Etc. Fool me once shame on you. But fool me twice?

In such a situation just how does one determine if this was an actual sexual assault ... consensual sex later regretted ... or a "Sugar Daddy" relationship gone bad? 30+ years after the fact?

OAW

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Careful with that hyperbole…

Don't take it away from me. I thought it was a good line. I even nodded to myself a little bit as I typed it.

You know, there are ways not like a performer if you didn't want to do it.

Ba-dum-tish.

[osiris]

Originally Posted by subego 

There is that extra special irony of this in the face of the wholesomeness he seemed to embody.

Just thinking the same thing... C'est la vie

[The Final Dakar]

I don't see it as irony, I see it as the reason this is blowing up. Like finding out Mr. Rogers ate children.

[OAW]

The latest accuser Janice Dickinson had this to say in a recent interview ....

- She claimed in a new interview that she was drugged and raped by Bill Cosby.[/B]

- She said the incident happened in Lake Tahoe, California, in 1982, and that the actor gave her a pill with a glass of wine, causing her to blackout.

- She says she woke up the next morning 'with her pajamas off, in pain, and with semen between her legs'.

- Two other women have recently come forward to say they were raped and drugged by Cosby.

- Cosby has yet to respond to any of these allegations.

- But his attorney, Marty Singer, has branded the allegation a 'complete lie'.

But this is what she said in her 2002 autobiography "No Lifeguard on Duty: The Accidental Life of the World's First Supermodel" ...

Cosby answered the door in nothing but a white towel. He was fresh from the shower, too; his black skin was glistening. He hugged me, a little too enthusiastically; told me how much he'd missed me, and how nice it was to see me. I believed him. Liquor does that to a girl.

'God, you're beautiful.'

He kissed me, full on the lips, then went off to dress and we went downstairs, to dinner, where Cosby spent the next two hours talking about himself. It was An Evening with Bill Cosby. A Tribute to Bill Cosby.

And suddenly I remembered something Andy Warhol once told me. It was his definition of an actor. He said, 'An actor is a person whose eyes glaze over when the conversation is no longer about them.'

And I thought, Well, then, Bill Cosby is an actor's actor.

After dinner he asked me back to his room, and I went. But I stopped myself at the door. 'I'm exhausted,' I said, begging off. His eyebrows went a little funny.

'Exhausted?' he asked, and it was clear he was trying hard to keep his temper in check. 'After all I've done for you, that's what I get? I'm exhausted.'

'Well, gee, Bill,' I stammered. 'If I had known it was going to be like this—' He waved both hands in front of my face, silencing me. Then he gave me the dirtiest, meanest look in the world, stepped into his suite, and slammed the door in my face.

Janice Dickinson steps out after claiming Bill Cosby raped her | Daily Mail Online

What Ms. Dickinson had to say in her 2002 book and what she had to say in her recent interview are two completely different stories. So either she was lying then or she's lying now because you can't reconcile getting the door slammed in your face because you turned him down with waking up the next morning half-naked with dried up cum between your legs. Just saying.

But at this stage in the game it's a media frenzy. And the US media likes nothing better than taking a beloved figure down a notch or two. Justifiably so or otherwise.

OAW

[The Final Dakar]

My initial assumption was she was being an attention whore (because all I know her for is rehab and plastic surgery) and then you get the proof in that it was pulled from her bio. Unbelievable.

[ort888]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

I don't see it as irony, I see it as the reason this is blowing up. Like finding out Mr. Rogers ate children.

[sek929]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

My initial assumption was she was being an attention whore (because all I know her for is rehab and plastic surgery) and then you get the proof in that it was pulled from her bio. Unbelievable.

Would you say the proof...was in the pudding?

[ort888]

All I know is that I've seen enough of Janice Dickenson on her television show that I consider her to be just absolutely terrible in every way. Like, just a freaking shameful excuse for a human being. It's hard for me to even form the words to properly communicate the amount of utter disdain I have for that woman. Ugh.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Power trip and manipulation. Don't some people say rape isn't about sex?

There are still people who think that rape and abuse are about sex?

Holy shit. Get out of the fifties, people.

[OAW]

So CNN anchor Don Lemon is taking heat in some quarters for questioning why alleged Cosby victim Joan Tarshis didn't bite his penis if she wasn't willing to perform oral sex on him. Especially since there were no allegations of weapons or threats of physical violence involved. "Victim blaming" and all that jazz. IMO it's quite notable how that's never described as "alleged victim blaming" ... but in any event, people are saying that since she claimed that he drugged her his question wasn't appropriate. Ok fine. Let's roll with that ...

Tarshis, now 64, told CNN's Don Lemon that Cosby allegedly drugged her twice when she was 19 years old. "We went up to his bungalow and he made me a drink. Shortly after that I passed out," she told Lemon. "I woke up or came to very groggily with him removing my underwear."

Tarshis went into graphic detail about the alleged incident, explaining that she tried to make Cosby stop by lying about an infection. "I said, if you have sex with me your wife is gonna know it because you probably will infect her," Tarshis continued. "I thought I was very clever in saying that, but he was more clever and instead he made me have oral sex with him, which really was just horrible. To me it's much, much worse than had he just raped me the normal way." The second alleged rape occurred after the Cosby Show star invited her to see one of his shows, but Tarshis has no recollection of the incident.

Tarshis also explained why she didn't go to the police earlier. "Who's going to believe me? Bill Cosby, the all-American dad, the all-American husband. Mr. Jell-O that everybody loves. Who would believe me? They'd probably think I was out to get something," she told Lemon. "My emotions won at this point," she added of her emotional state at the time. "I felt a lot of shame. I felt a lot of guilt."

Bill Cosby Rape Accuser Joan Tarshis Comes Forward After Denial - Us Weekly

So here are some things that just don't add up to me ....

1. Again ... fool me once shame on you. But fool me twice?

2. Moreover, how is Ms. Tarshis alleging a second rape but she has "no recollection of the incident". WTF?

3. Ms. Tarshis claims that Cosby drugged her. Yet she still had the presence of mind to lie about having an infection to keep him from having sex with her. Thought she was "very clever" about that. But she was stoned out of her mind when it came to giving Cosby a blowjob and it never occurred to her to bite his penis.

4. She doesn't go to the police supposedly because Cosby is "Mr. Jell-O" she says. He's "the all-American dad, the all-American husband". So who's going to believe her she says? But these incidents alleged occurred in 1969. And Cosby didn't become a Jell-O spokesman until 1974 ... and the Cosby Show where he became the "all-American dad and husband" wasn't until 1984. On top of all that ... 1969 was still a time in the US when a white woman being willingly involved in a romantic relationship with a black man could result in him being lynched! To suggest that no one would have believed a white woman who claimed she was raped by a black man in 1960s America simply strains credulity.

OAW

[Powerbook]

I can believe that story. It sounds like Jimmy Savile all over again.

--
Allegations of sexual abuse

During his lifetime

During Savile's lifetime, sporadic allegations of child abuse were made against him dating back to 1964,[98] but only became widely publicised after his death. Savile claimed the key to his success on Jim'll Fix It had been that he disliked children, although he later admitted to saying this to deflect scrutiny of his personal life. He did not own a computer as he did not want anybody to think he was downloading child pornography.[1] His autobiography As it Happens (1974, reprinted as Love is an Uphill Thing, 1976) contains admissions of improper sexual conduct which appear to have passed unnoticed during Savile's lifetime.[99]

Former Sex Pistols and Public Image Ltd vocalist John Lydon alluded to sordid conduct by Savile, as well as suppression of widely held knowledge about such activity, in an October 1978 interview recorded for BBC Radio 1. Lydon stated: "I'd like to kill Jimmy Savile; I think he's a hypocrite. I bet he's into all kinds of seediness that we all know about, but are not allowed to talk about. I know some rumours." He added: "I bet none of this will be allowed out."[100] As predicted, the comment was edited out by the BBC prior to broadcasting, but the complete interview was included as a bonus track on a re-release of Public Image Ltd's 1978 debut album Public Image: First Issue in 2013, after Savile's death.[101] In October 2014, Lydon expanded on his original quote, saying: "By killed I meant locking him up and stopping him assaulting young children... I'm disgusted at the media pretending they weren't aware."[102]

In a 1990 interview for The Independent on Sunday, Lynn Barber asked him about rumours that he liked "little girls". Savile's reply was that, as he worked in the pop music business, "...the young girls in question don't gather round me because of me – it's because I know the people they love, the stars... I am of no interest to them."[103] In April 2000, in a documentary by Louis Theroux, When Louis Met... Jimmy, Savile acknowledged "salacious tabloid people" had raised rumours about whether he was a paedophile, and said, "I know I'm not."[104]

In 2007, Savile was interviewed under caution by police investigating an allegation of indecent assault in the 1970s at the now-closed Duncroft Approved School for Girls near Staines, Surrey, where he was a regular visitor. The Crown Prosecution Service advised there was insufficient evidence to take any further action and no charges were brought.[105] In March 2008, Savile started legal proceedings against The Sun, which had linked him in several articles to child abuse at the Jersey children's home Haut de la Garenne.[106] He denied visiting Haut de la Garenne, but later admitted he had done so following the publication of a photograph showing him at the home surrounded by children.[107] The States of Jersey Police said that in 2008 an allegation of an indecent assault by Savile at the home in the 1970s had been investigated, but there had been insufficient evidence to proceed.[108] In 2009 in a taped interview with his biographer, Savile defended pop star Gary Glitter, convicted in 1999 of possession of child pornography, who he described as a celebrity being vilified for watching 'dodgy films': "It were for his own gratification. Whether it was right or wrong is up to him as a person... they [viewers] didn't do anything wrong but they are then demonised." This was not published at the time, and the recording was not released until after Savile's death.[109]

In 2012, Sir Roger Jones, a former BBC governor for Wales and chairman of BBC charity Children in Need, disclosed that more than a decade before Savile's death he had banned Savile from involvement in the charity, because he felt Savile's behaviour was "strange" and "suspicious", and had heard unsubstantiated rumours about his activities.[110] Former Royal Family press secretary Dickie Arbiter said Savile's behaviour had raised "concern and suspicion" when Savile acted as an informal marriage counsellor between Prince Charles and Princess Diana in the late 1980s, although no reports had been made.[81]
After his death

Immediately after Savile's death the BBC Newsnight programme began an investigation into reports that he was a paedophile. Meirion Jones and Liz Mackean interviewed one victim on camera and others agreed to have their stories told. The victims alleged abuse at Duncroft approved school in Staines, Stoke Mandeville hospital and the BBC. The programme was scheduled for broadcast on 7 December 2011 but the film was never shown and the BBC broadcast tributes to Savile at Christmas 2011. Newsnight also discovered that Surrey police had investigated allegations of abuse against Savile. The later Pollard Review found that Jones and MacKean had found cogent evidence that Savile was an abuser and that the programme could have exposed him in 2011 but a flawed decision was made not to broadcast.[111]

There was no public mention of the Newsnight investigation into Savile at the time but in early 2012, several newspapers reported that BBC had investigated allegations of sexual abuse immediately after his death, but the report was not broadcast. The Oldie alleged there had been a cover-up by the BBC.[112]

On 28 September 2012, almost a year after his death, ITV said it would broadcast a documentary, Exposure: The Other Side of Jimmy Savile.[10] The documentary, presented by Mark Williams-Thomas who had been a consultant on the original Newsnight investigation, revealed claims by up to 10 women, including one aged under 14 at the time, that they had been sexually molested or raped by Savile during the 1960s and 1970s.[113] The announcement attracted national attention, and more reports and claims of abuse against him accumulated. The documentary was broadcast on 3 October 2012. The next day, the Metropolitan Police said the Child Abuse Investigation Command would assess the allegations.[114]

By 19 October 2012, police were pursuing 400 lines of inquiry based on testimony from 200 witnesses via 14 police forces across the UK. They described the alleged abuse as "on an unprecedented scale", and the number of potential victims as "staggering".[115] Investigations, codenamed Operation Yewtree, were opened to identify criminal conduct related to Savile's activities by the Metropolitan Police and the Crown Prosecution Service into why a prosecution had been dropped as unlikely to succeed in 2009.[14][15] By 25 October, police reported the number of possible victims was approaching 300.[11]

On 12 November 2012, the Metropolitan Police announced the scale of sexual allegations reported against Savile was "unprecedented" in Britain: a total of 450 alleged victims had contacted the police in the ten weeks since the investigation was launched. Officers recorded 199 crimes in 17 police force areas in which Savile was a suspect, among them 31 allegations of rape in seven force areas.[116] Analysis of the report showed 82% of those who came forward to report abuse were female and 80% were children or young people at the time of the incidents.[117]

The developing scandal led to inquiries into practices at the BBC and the National Health Service. It was alleged that rumours of Savile's activities had circulated at the BBC in the 1960s and 1970s, but no action had been taken. Savile was trusted with keys and unsupervised access to patients including the mentally and physically disabled at some hospitals.[118][119] The Director-General of the BBC, George Entwistle, apologised for what had happened, and on 16 October 2012 appointed former High Court judge Dame Janet Smith to review the culture and practices of the BBC during the time Savile worked there,[120] and Nick Pollard, a former Sky News executive, was appointed to look at why the Newsnight investigation into Savile's activities was dropped shortly before transmission in December 2011.[120]

On 22 October 2012, the BBC programme Panorama broadcast an investigation into Newsnight and found evidence suggesting "senior manager" pressure;[121] on the same day Newsnight editor Peter Rippon "stepped down" with immediate effect.[122][123] The Department of Health appointed former barrister Kate Lampard to chair and oversee its investigations into Savile's activities at Stoke Mandeville Hospital, Leeds General Infirmary, Broadmoor Hospital and other hospitals and facilities in England.[124]

Exposure Update: The Jimmy Savile Investigation, was shown on ITV on 21 November 2012.[125]

In March 2013 Her Majesty's Inspectorate of Constabulary reported that 214 of the complaints that had been made against Savile after his death would have been criminal offences if they had been reported at the time. Sixteen victims reported being raped by Savile when they were under 16 (the age of consent in England) and four of those had been under the age of ten. Thirteen others reported serious sexual assaults by Savile including four who had been under 10 years old. Another ten victims reported being raped by Savile after the age of sixteen.[126]
Aftermath
Savile's ornate black granite and steel headstone was unveiled on 20 September 2012 and stood for just 19 days.

Within a month of the child abuse scandal breaking, many places and organisations named after or connected to Savile were renamed or had his name removed.[127] A memorial plaque on the wall of Savile's former home in Scarborough was removed in early October 2012 after it was defaced with graffiti.[128] A wooden statue of Savile at Scotstoun Leisure Centre in Glasgow was also removed around the same time.[129] A sign on a footpath in Scarborough bearing Savile's surname was removed.[130] Savile's Hall, the conference centre at the Royal Armouries Museum in Leeds, was renamed New Dock Hall.[131] Two registered charities founded in his name to fight "poverty and sickness and other charitable purposes" announced they were too closely tied to his name to be sustainable and would close and distribute their funds to other charities, so as to avoid harm to beneficiaries from future media attention.[132] On 28 October it was reported that Savile's cottage in Glen Coe had been vandalised with spray-paint and the door damaged.[133][134] The cottage was sold in May 2013.[135][136]

On 9 October 2012, relatives said the headstone of Savile's grave would be removed, destroyed and sent to landfill.[137][138][139] The Savile family expressed their sorrow for the "anguish" of the victims and "respect [for] public opinion".[140]

Savile's estate, believed to be worth about £4 million, was frozen by its executors, the NatWest bank, in view of the possibility that those alleging that they had been assaulted by Savile could make claims for damages.[141]

An authorised biography, How's About That Then?, by Alison Bellamy, was published in June 2012. After the claims made against him were published, the author said that, in the light of the allegations, she felt "let down and betrayed" by Savile.[142]

On 26 June 2014, UK Secretary of State for Health Jeremy Hunt delivered a public apology in the House of Commons to the patients of the National Health Service abused by Savile. He confirmed that complaints had been raised before 2012 but were ignored by the bureaucratic system:

Savile was a callous, opportunistic, wicked predator who abused and raped individuals, many of them patients and young people, who expected and had a right to expect to be safe. His actions span five decades -- from the 1960s to 2010. ... As a nation at that time we held Savile in our affection as a somewhat eccentric national treasure with a strong commitment to charitable causes. Today's reports show that in reality he was a sickening and prolific sexual abuser who repeatedly exploited the trust of a nation for his own vile purposes.[143]
— Jeremy Hunt, Secretary of State for Health

In June 2014, psychologist Oliver James said Savile had the dark triad of personality characteristics: psychopathy, Machiavellianism and narcissism.[144] Richard Harrison, a longtime psychiatric nurse at Broadmoor Hospital, had said in 2012 that Savile was regarded by staff as "a man with a severe personality disorder and a liking for children". Another nurse, Bob Allen, stated: "I'd say he [Savile] was a psychopath... A lot of the staff said he should be behind bars." Allen told how he once reported Savile to his supervisor for improper conduct with a juvenile, but the issue was ignored by senior management.[145]

Jimmy Savile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[subego]

@OAW

1) People have done far dumber things.

2) What one can guess here, basing it off a single sentence of information, is that she blacked out (as before) and awoke to obvious evidence something had happened. Her presumption of Cosby's involvement is based on the previous event.

3) I think you're putting way too much thought into an off-the-cuff response to an unbelievably tacky line of questioning.

4) Likewise, I'm not sure "don't you understand... this was the guy in I Spy" is going to convey the point she was trying to make.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by sek929 

Would you say the proof...was in the pudding?

I'm just commenting so that you know someone appreciated that joke.

[Waragainstsleep]

Originally Posted by osiris 

But why do these people wait so long - the guy is 77 for chrissake? I think there should be a statute of limitations applied to some degree, or a statue of limitations - if you prefer to just look at it.

Why would you want a statute of limitations on rape?

[Waragainstsleep]

Saville has proven to be just the worst of the worst of so many stars of UK media in the 60s, 70s and 80s. Better hope Cosby isn't the tip of the US iceberg.

[ort888]

Bill Cosby - Spanish Fly - YouTube

[OAW]

It might be helpful to have all the public allegations in one place ....

The events detailed by Cosby's accusers took place over many decades. Five women have gone on record in describing them. Another woman, Andrea Constand, approached Montgomery County, Pennsylvania, authorities in 2005, but prosecutors decided they had "insufficient credible and admissible evidence."

"The desire on our part to move forward was pretty strong," Bruce Castor, then the Montgomery County district attorney, told CNN's "New Day" on Wednesday. "The problem with the case was she waited a year until she told police about it."

At the time, Cosby lawyer Walter M. Phillips Jr. told CNN the allegations were "utterly preposterous" and "plainly bizarre."

Constand later filed a civil suit. Her lawyers said they found 13 Jane Doe witnesses with similar stories. However, Constand's suit was settled in November 2006, and the witnesses were never called. Terms have not been disclosed.

Here are details on the other five named women:

Name: Joan Tarshis

Who was: a 19-year-old actress

When alleged events happened: Late 1969

At the time, Cosby was: a year removed from his hit TV series, "I Spy," starting work on a new sitcom, "The Bill Cosby Show," and one of the most popular comedians in America. His 1968 album, "To Russell, My Brother, Whom I Slept With," had won a Grammy as best comedy performance in March -- Cosby's fifth straight win in the category.

The accusation: Tarshis, who later became a journalist and music industry publicist, said she met Cosby while visiting Los Angeles. The two became friendly. One night after a taping of his sitcom, he invited her back to his bungalow and fixed her a "redeye" (a Bloody Mary topped with beer, her regular drink).

"The next thing I remember was coming to on his couch while being undressed," she told Hollywood Elsewhere. "I was sickened by what was happening to me and shocked that this man I had idolized was now raping me. Of course I told no one." It was the first of two incidents, Tarshis said.

When she went public: 2014

Name: Tamara Green

Who was: an aspiring model in her early 20s

When alleged events happened: 1970

At the time, Cosby was: starring on "The Bill Cosby Show." A year later, he would start guesting on the children's program "The Electric Company."

The accusation: Green, who later became an attorney, said she met Cosby at a working lunch with several other people. She was suffering from the flu and Cosby "went into some sort of office area at the back of the restaurant and he produced two capsules in his hand," she told the "Today Show's" Matt Lauer. She took the capsules, which at first made her feel "great" and then left her "almost literally face down on the table of this restaurant."

Cosby took her to her apartment and started "groping me and kissing me and touching me and handling me and you know, taking off my clothes," Green said. After telling Cosby "that if he didn't kill me and he tried to rape me, it was going to go very badly," he left two $100 bills on her coffee table and left.

When Green went public, a lawyer for Cosby told "Today," "Miss Green's allegations are absolutely false. Mr. Cosby does not know the name Tamara Green or (maiden name) Tamara Lucier, and the incident she describes did not happen. The fact that she may have repeated this story to others is not corroboration."

When she went public: 2005

Name: Janice Dickinson

Who was: a noted model

When alleged events happened: 1982

At the time, Cosby was: touring as a comedian and well-known for his Jell-O and Coca-Cola commercials.

The accusation: Dickinson says that she and Cosby had dinner in Lake Tahoe, Nevada, and he gave her a glass of red wine and a pill she believed was for menstrual cramps. "The last thing I remember was Bill Cosby in a patchwork robe, dropping his robe and getting on top of me. And I remember a lot of pain," she told "Entertainment Tonight."

Dickinson said she wanted to write about the incident in her 2002 memoir "No Lifeguard on Duty," but said Cosby's lawyers told her to remove details.

Marty Singer, the Cosby attorney, told TheWrap.com that her claim is untrue. "(N)either Mr. Cosby or any of his representatives ever communication (sic) with the publisher about any alleged rape or sexual assault about the book," he said.

When she went public: 2014

Name: Beth Ferrier

Who was: a model in her early 20s

When alleged events happened: mid-1980s

At the time, Cosby was: a touring comedian, advertising pitchman and, starting in 1984, the star of "The Cosby Show," the No. 1 show on television.

The accusation: Ferrier told the Philadelphia Daily News and People magazine that she met Cosby in Denver in the mid-'80s. He mentored her for a time but, one night, she said he gave her a drugged cappuccino. "I woke up in my car in the parking lot with my clothes all a mess," she said. "I wondered, I still wonder, 'What did he do with me? Why was my bra unhooked?' "

The two later conducted an "on-and-off consensual affair" that lasted several years, wrote People's Alex Tresniowski. "He kept luring me in," Ferrier told the magazine. "I felt like I couldn't say no."

At the time, Cosby's publicist told People that he had no comment.

When she went public: 2005

Name: Barbara Bowman

Who was: a teenage model and actress

When alleged events happened: mid-1980s

At the time, Cosby was: starring in "The Cosby Show."

The accusation: In 1985, Cosby met the then 17-year-old Bowman in Denver and visited her a number of times, giving her acting lessons and "flying me around to major cities to events," she told Newsweek. After she turned 18, Cosby "assaulted (me) a number of times." In an incident in New York, Bowman "had one glass of wine and then I blacked out. I woke up throwing up in the toilet. ... I was wearing a white T-shirt that wasn't mine, and he was in a white robe."

In an incident in Atlantic City, an angry Cosby "got on top of me and started taking his pants off and I was screaming and crying and begging him to leave me alone and I fought so hard and I was screaming so loud that he got mad and threw me aside and got away from me, and that was it."

The statement of Cosby attorney Schmitt, released Sunday, said, "Over the last several weeks, decade-old, discredited allegations against Mr. Cosby have resurfaced. The fact that they are being repeated does not make them true. Mr. Cosby does not intend to dignify these allegations with any comment."

When she went public: 2006. She has since written a Washington Post column published November 13.

Bill Cosby allegations tarnish his fatherly image - CNN.com

OAW

[OAW]

To summarize:

Andrea Constand: "Insufficient credible and admissible evidence." for criminal charges. Filed a civil suit in 2005 that was settled out of court.

Joan Tarshis: Two 1969 "drugged and raped" incidents which she never mentioned until 2014 after all of this started to dominate the news cycle. Claims to have had Cosby's unwanted penis in her mouth even though that is an extremely vulnerable position for a man to place himself in with an unwilling woman. Basically wants us to believe that no one would have believed her (a white woman) if she had claimed that Cosby (a black man) sexually assaulted her in 1960s America simply because he was a celebrity. In a country where at that time a black man could easily end up hung from a tree if he even LOOKED too long at a white woman.

Tamara Green: A 1970 "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2005 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Claimed to have a similar experience that ended up with Cosby backing off after she told him "that if he didn't kill me and he tried to rape me, it was going to go very badly." Cosby claims to have never met her.

Janice Dickinson: A 1982 "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2014 after all of this started to dominate the news cycle. But her 2002 autobiography described it as Cosby slamming the door in her face when she turned him down for sex.

Beth Ferrier: A mid-1980s "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2005 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Nevertheless she conducted an "'on-and-off consensual affair' that lasted several years" afterwards.

Barbara Bowman: A mid-1980s "drugged and raped" series of incidents which she never mentioned until 2006 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Cosby was paying her rent, paying for acting lessons, etc. Sugar Daddy arrangement gone bad? Or something more sinister?

OAW

[starman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OEEJP5rlao

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

I never heard of him until now.

He hasn't played the Vatican in a while, so I expect he wouldn't be on your radar.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by OAW 

To summarize:

Andrea Constand: "Insufficient credible and admissible evidence." for criminal charges. Filed a civil suit in 2005 that was settled out of court.

Joan Tarshis: Two 1969 "drugged and raped" incidents which she never mentioned until 2014 after all of this started to dominate the news cycle. Claims to have had Cosby's unwanted penis in her mouth even though that is an extremely vulnerable position for a man to place himself in with an unwilling woman. Basically wants us to believe that no one would have believed her (a white woman) if she had claimed that Cosby (a black man) sexually assaulted her in 1960s America simply because he was a celebrity. In a country where at that time a black man could easily end up hung from a tree if he even LOOKED too long at a white woman.

Tamara Green: A 1970 "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2005 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Claimed to have a similar experience that ended up with Cosby backing off after she told him "that if he didn't kill me and he tried to rape me, it was going to go very badly." Cosby claims to have never met her.

Janice Dickinson: A 1982 "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2014 after all of this started to dominate the news cycle. But her 2002 autobiography described it as Cosby slamming the door in her face when she turned him down for sex.

Beth Ferrier: A mid-1980s "drugged and raped" incident which she never mentioned until 2005 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Nevertheless she conducted an "'on-and-off consensual affair' that lasted several years" afterwards.

Barbara Bowman: A mid-1980s "drugged and raped" series of incidents which she never mentioned until 2006 after hearing about Ms. Constand's civil suit. Cosby was paying her rent, paying for acting lessons, etc. Sugar Daddy arrangement gone bad? Or something more sinister?

OAW

I sense some super interesting psychological shit going on with you solely because Bill Cosby is the target.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by sek929 

Would you say the proof...was in the pudding?

I have a gif response for this, but I can't search for it til I get home, you magnificent bastard.

[Thorzdad]

I happened to be down on my local university campus this week, and found myself walking behind a group of administrators as they were discussing upcoming speakers/events booked into the university's theater. One of them mentioned that Cosby was originally slated to appear this January, but it has been cancelled. One of them joked about Cosby having some "recent career problems". It wasn't clear if the university had cancelled, or if Cosby's people had cancelled.

[OAW]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

I sense some super interesting psychological shit going on with you solely because Bill Cosby is the target.

I am admittedly skeptical about "he said/she said" claims against high-profile celebs in general. In particular this case involves four women who've made no mention of this for anywhere from 20-45 years. And we only hear about anything until either AFTER the first woman filed a lawsuit or this all dominated the news cycle recently. Just seems awfully convenient to me. That being said 5 public allegations is very troubling. There's no sugar coating that. Just saying that when you look past the headlines and delve into the actual stories of these women things are not as clear cut as the mere number of allegations would suggest. We have Ms. Dickinson who is obviously either lying now or was lying in her autobiography we have Ms. Ferrier who claimed to be drugged and raped but continued an "on and off again" affair with Cosby lasting years. That just doesn't add up. I mean seriously .... who does that?

Clearly Bill cheated on Camille. A lot. But the stories of some of these women just don't add up to rape in my estimation. Ms. Green's story has no obvious holes. Ms. Constand has no story because of the NDA in the settlement. So I can't dismiss ALL of them as BS. But some of them certainly seem to be.

As I said in the beginning. Drugged and raped? Consensual sex later regretted. Or Sugar Daddy relationship gone bad? Perhaps the answer varies depending upon which woman we are discussing?

OAW

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by OAW 

We have Ms. Dickinson who is obviously either lying now or was lying in her autobiography

That's already been covered

Originally Posted by OAW 

we have Ms. Ferrier who claimed to be drugged and raped but continued an "on and off again" affair with Cosby lasting years. That just doesn't add up. I mean seriously .... who does that?

I dunno, a woman gets physically abused by her partner, yet defends him and keeps going back to him. Who does that?

[subego]

Originally Posted by OAW 

I am admittedly skeptical about "he said/she said" claims against high-profile celebs in general. In particular this case involves four women who've made no mention of this for anywhere from 20-45 years. And we only hear about anything until either AFTER the first woman filed a lawsuit or this all dominated the news cycle recently. Just seems awfully convenient to me. That being said 5 public allegations is very troubling. There's no sugar coating that. Just saying that when you look past the headlines and delve into the actual stories of these women things are not as clear cut as the mere number of allegations would suggest. We have Ms. Dickinson who is obviously either lying now or was lying in her autobiography we have Ms. Ferrier who claimed to be drugged and raped but continued an "on and off again" affair with Cosby lasting years. That just doesn't add up. I mean seriously .... who does that?

Clearly Bill cheated on Camille. A lot. But the stories of some of these women just don't add up to rape in my estimation. Ms. Green's story has no obvious holes. Ms. Constand has no story because of the NDA in the settlement. So I can't dismiss ALL of them as BS. But some of them certainly seem to be.

As I said in the beginning. Drugged and raped? Consensual sex later regretted. Or Sugar Daddy relationship gone bad? Perhaps the answer varies depending upon which woman we are discussing?

OAW

So far, we have 6 women who went public, and 12 others who were part of the 2005 civil suit.

That's a lot of sugar daddying gone bad. You'd think he'd learn to pick better at some point.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by subego 

So far, we have 6 women who went public, and 12 others who were part of the 2005 civil suit.

That's a lot of sugar daddying gone bad. You'd think he'd learn to pick better at some point.

Yeah, that's a whole lot of smoke for there not to be a fire.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by OAW 

I We have Ms. Dickinson who is obviously either lying now or was lying in her autobiography we have Ms. Ferrier who claimed to be drugged and raped but continued an "on and off again" affair with Cosby lasting years. That just doesn't add up. I mean seriously .... who does that?

This is perfectly normal for any abuse situation. In fact, that this is normal is pretty much the main reason abuse happens: it is NOT abuse of persons; it is abuse of POWER.

People have POWER over others (who seem to willingly submit, in many cases), and abuse that power in one or more of many ways - physical violence, sex, verbal denigration, public shamingt/harassing, whatever. Which channel is chosen is completely incidental and more or less irrelevant to the victim.

Their power comes from knowing that the victim is just that, and will keep being a victim until they realize they have other options...which may never actually happen. ("In good times and in bad, 'til death do us part" makes for some real brick-wall motivation to put up with pretty much anything for a loooot of people, for example. Does "just close your eyes and think of England" sound like an empowered relationship to you?)

And the stranglehold continues for decades after the actual incidents, because the person who has realized that they had other options all that time (leaving/cops/striking back/confession/whatever) is morbidly afraid of admitting that they could have used them but didn't.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

There are still people who think that rape and abuse are about sex?

Well, it is part of it. It's just not the most important factor.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

This is perfectly normal for any abuse situation. In fact, that this is normal is pretty much the main reason abuse happens: it is NOT abuse of persons; it is abuse of POWER.

People have POWER over others (who seem to willingly submit, in many cases), and abuse that power in one or more of many ways - physical violence, sex, verbal denigration, public shamingt/harassing, whatever. Which channel is chosen is completely incidental and more or less irrelevant to the victim.

Their power comes from knowing that the victim is just that, and will keep being a victim until they realize they have other options...which may never actually happen. ("In good times and in bad, 'til death do us part" makes for some real brick-wall motivation to put up with pretty much anything for a loooot of people, for example. Does "just close your eyes and think of England" sound like an empowered relationship to you?)

And the stranglehold continues for decades after the actual incidents, because the person who has realized that they had other options all that time (leaving/cops/striking back/confession/whatever) is morbidly afraid of admitting that they could have used them but didn't.

Well said.

My ex's mom married a psychopath. Among the beatings, there was constant emotional abuse, all very much designed to keep her "in her place" as unable to function without him. She's too dumb to get a real job. She's too ugly to ever find another man. When her hair starts falling out from stress, and she starts wearing a wig, double down on the ugly.

Now toss in three kids her husband was supporting.

Too her credit, she finally split, but it took 15 years, and him putting a gun to my ex's head when she was 6.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Well, it is part of it. It's just not the most important factor.

It's just one of probably several channels of abuse running in parallel.

A victim doesn't tend to be victim on just one channel.

[subego]

I want to mention, Polanski is definitely guilty, Allen probably is.

Look how many people leapt to their defense.

With Cosby, I hear crickets.

Whatever the case, I don't think people like him very much.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Whatever the case, I don't think people like him very much.

I don't think anyone is willing to go to bat for a washed up comedian with a history of settlements.

If you don't buy that Chongo has a theory for you.

[subego]

But even "sugar tits" gets people defending him.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

But even "sugar tits" gets people defending him.

So does Polanksi.

And despite what a crazy asshole Gibson is, I still think he's a good actor/director.

[subego]

More importantly though, I think people he interacts with on a personal level tend to like him... as long as he's not drunk.

[The Final Dakar]

Or doesn't bring-up his religious and political beliefs. He is a conservative christian, I believe.

[ort888]

Mel Gibson just said a bunch of awful stuff. It's not even in the same stratosphere.

[OAW]

Originally Posted by subego 

So far, we have 6 women who went public, and 12 others who were part of the 2005 civil suit.

As I highlighted above in the CNN article ...

"Her lawyers said they found 13 Jane Doe witnesses with similar stories. However, Constand's suit was settled in November 2006, and the witnesses were never called."

Lawyers in a civil suit can make all kinds of claims about what witnesses they may or may not have had. Since they were never called I certainly don't think it's fair to lend this claim the same level of credence as those who have made their allegations public.

Originally Posted by subego

That's a lot of sugar daddying gone bad. You'd think he'd learn to pick better at some point.

Indeed.

OAW

[OAW]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

I dunno, a woman gets physically abused by her partner, yet defends him and keeps going back to him. Who does that?

True story. When I was a teenager my aunt was married to this guy who decided to beat her to the point where my mother didn't even recognize her own sister in the hospital. My cousins and I were preparing to demonstrate to this fool the error of his ways in no uncertain terms. But my aunt instructed us not to go there. And so we stood down. You see she was the oldest of all her siblings so there was certain authority she carried that we simply respected. Let's just say I was raised in a time when "Cause I said so!" was all the explanation an adult need give to a child. If that. Unfortunately, she went back to him as soon as she got out of the hospital and the abuse continued. As is so often the case. But at no point did my cousins and I ever contemplate intervening again. Why? Because she chose to put herself back in that situation. Repeatedly. I remember thinking what if I or her sons ended up getting hurt if that fool decided to pull a gun? What if we got hemmed up in the system if the police got involved? And for what? Just so she could go right back to him while one or all of us was sitting in a jail cell with Big Tiny? You know what finally got her to leave him? When he started molesting her youngest daughter and Child Services got involved and gave her an ultimatum. Either he leaves or your daughter will be removed from the home. Only then was it a wrap on that fool! Now I love my aunt to death. But she taught me a hard lesson about life. One that I shall not soon forget.

In any event, what I'm trying to say here is that I get your point. Hell I've seen it firsthand! That being said I truly think it's a bit of a "false equivalency" with this Cosby situation. Somewhat similar in kind ... but not so much in degree. You see in a domestic violence situation like that (i.e. a marriage or long-term partnership) a big part of what drives the victim to stay is FEAR. Fear of losing one's investment in the relationship. Fear of further violence if one tries to leave. Fear of being on your own. Etc. But we aren't talking about anything like that in this Cosby situation. What these women are describing is not some sort of relationship they were in for some time that one day went south when Cosby decided to "drug and rape" them. On the contrary, what they are describing is Cosby deciding to "drug and rape" them right out of the gate. And yet they go back and carry on a relationship nevertheless. No long-term relationship to abandon. No worrying about who's going to take care of the kids or pay the mortgage. No threats of physical violence. No serious involvement between them so no "investment" to lose at all!

Which then begs the question in my mind at least. If a man "drugs and rapes" you on the first date so to speak ... again, right out of the gate ... how in the hell does he get a second?

OAW

[subego]

Your question about why he would get a "second date" is reasonable. Perhaps Lemon should have asked that.

Here's some total conjecture.

It's a semi-public event she's being invited to. Cosby casually mentions all the Hollywood players who will be in attendance, also as guests. A backstage pass to this has obvious potential career benefits to an aspiring actress. She presumes, even backstage, there will be enough people around for him not to try anything. She thinks, "as long as I don't let myself be alone with him, I'll be okay".

No idea if this is how it happened. The point though is there are plausible explanations for why someone would do this.

[The Final Dakar]

I see three more stories this morning. (New, not really) My lord.