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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Desktops > So, general feeling seems to be that the iMac Core Duo is great

So, general feeling seems to be that the iMac Core Duo is great
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WOPR
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May 21, 2006, 04:42 AM
 
That's the feeling I get, which is good after the debacle of the G5 models and their bulging and leaking capacitors and other problems. Now I just need to find the money to buy one...

If only I felt the same about the new portables...

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harrisjamieh
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May 21, 2006, 04:56 AM
 
Yes indeedy, they are great. They have a grand total of 0 mainstream problems (like whine and heat on the lappies). They are just fantastic machines, best computer I have ever owned!
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patpres
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May 21, 2006, 05:15 PM
 
I agree!
     
Big Mac
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May 21, 2006, 07:43 PM
 
Yeah, they'd be perfect but for the fact they have Intel inside.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
jamil5454
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May 21, 2006, 07:48 PM
 
I'm actually thinking of selling my PC and getting a new Core Duo iMac. Having Intel inside makes it more perfect... for me, at least.

Then again, I'm not passionate about my processor architecture.
     
WOPR  (op)
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May 22, 2006, 07:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac
Yeah, they'd be perfect but for the fact they have Intel inside.
Come on then, explain... what should they have inside then?

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badnewsblair
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May 22, 2006, 10:26 AM
 
Have one.

Love it!

Best machine I've ever had.
[ 15 inch Macbook Pro 2.8 GHz Core 2 Duo ][ 20 inch Intel iMac 2 GB RAM / 256 MB ATI XT 1600 ][ iPhone OG (3GS on Reservation)][ White iPod 5th Gen. 60GB ]
     
tooki
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May 22, 2006, 10:32 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac
Yeah, they'd be perfect but for the fact they have Intel inside.
Give it a rest dude. The "OMG it's not a PowerPC" whining is so 4 months ago...

tooki
     
amsalpemkcus
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May 22, 2006, 11:03 AM
 
Yeah, I concur, the CD imacs appear to be rock solid so far.

Anyone else notice a low rumble noise when it comes off sleep? Just curious whether it is HDD noise.
You could also hear it just as it powers up at boot.
     
badnewsblair
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May 22, 2006, 11:05 AM
 
Yeah.

It's the fans and the harddrive spinning up. The initial noise is the exhaust fan "blowing" the system clean of stagnant, warm air.
[ 15 inch Macbook Pro 2.8 GHz Core 2 Duo ][ 20 inch Intel iMac 2 GB RAM / 256 MB ATI XT 1600 ][ iPhone OG (3GS on Reservation)][ White iPod 5th Gen. 60GB ]
     
harrisjamieh
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May 22, 2006, 11:17 AM
 
Yeh, my iMac g5 did the exact same thing, so its not just a CD thing
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Josh Reid
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May 22, 2006, 11:50 AM
 
I've had my 20" Core Duo since early February....absolutely flawless, can't think of a single complaint. Love it.
     
ApeInTheShell
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May 22, 2006, 11:58 AM
 
We Need New Roads!
     
parsec_kadets
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May 22, 2006, 06:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac
Yeah, they'd be perfect but for the fact they have Intel inside.
Do you ever comment about anything else?
( Last edited by parsec_kadets; May 28, 2006 at 04:41 PM. )
     
gamegolds
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May 22, 2006, 09:08 PM
 
I've had mine now for a week. Fourth mac since 1992 and I absolutely love it. Quiet, fast beautiful and with bootcamp I have two machines in one.
     
larrinski
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May 23, 2006, 12:35 AM
 
I have had only one complaint with the intel switch and that is the isub driver still not out. But I had far more problems with my 1st gen imac than the new intel imac. A truly great machine...
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LagunaSol
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May 23, 2006, 12:40 AM
 
Best machine I've owned. Intel Inside is just an added bonus. I was able to dump the big ugly box on my desk called my PC and the smaller box on my desk called my G4 PowerMac and get the best of both worlds in a sleek, quiet little package. What more could one ask for? OK, Radeon X1900 maybe?
     
LeeG
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May 23, 2006, 10:20 AM
 
I have owned macs for 15yrs, all the way back to a IIsi. I have had powermacs for some time, this is the first consumer mac I have purchased.

The 20" iMac CoreDuo is hands down the best computer I have ever owned. It is near perfection in my mind. Great design, gorgeous screen, near silent, SUPER fast for all the iLife stuff, I am so happy I bought one. The built-in iSight I thought I'd never use, and I use it more and more. Great machine.

Lee
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WOPR  (op)
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May 23, 2006, 10:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by parsec_kadets
Do you ever comment about anything else?
He is as they say, a one trick pony. I notice he didn't bother backing up his trolling.

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ajprice
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May 23, 2006, 11:04 AM
 
Originally Posted by larrinski
I have had only one complaint with the intel switch and that is the isub driver still not out. But I had far more problems with my 1st gen imac than the new intel imac. A truly great machine...
Is that just the iSub driver or is there no driver for SoundSticks either? I have the original USB SoundSticks connected to my G4 quicksilver.

It'll be much easier if you just comply.
     
icruise
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May 23, 2006, 11:52 AM
 
I love my iMac. The only "problem" I had was that with 1GB of RAM I was getting quite a few beachballs and slowdowns (admittedly, I run a lot of programs, including a number of PPC programs in Rosetta). I upgraded to 2GB yesterday and so far it's been great. Not a slowdown in sight.
     
WOPR  (op)
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May 23, 2006, 12:44 PM
 
2gb seems to be the minimum if you use Rosetta much. Something else for me to budget for!

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harrisjamieh
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May 23, 2006, 12:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by WOPR
2gb seems to be the minimum if you use Rosetta much. Something else for me to budget for!
You certainly don't need 2 GB to use Rosetta. I have 1.5 GB in my iMac, and its fantastic. Photoshop is very adequate, so is FCP 5 under Rosetta (haven't done the whole crossgrade thing yet), along with many othr PPC apps I have. you certainly don't need a full 2 GB for it, and it certinaly ain't the minimum
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icruise
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May 23, 2006, 11:24 PM
 
You don't need 2GB to use Rosetta, but frankly if you use a lot of programs at once it really helps. I would like to have Safari, Mail, Firefox, NetNewsWire, Martian Slingshot, iTunes, iPhoto, iCal, Word, Excel, and Jamming (my dictionary program) open at once and still be able to open a few random programs, but 1GB of RAM just didn't let me do that comfortably. (Word, Excel and Jamming are the only PPC programs in the list). Now that I have 2GB, I can have Parallels open and running Windows XP in addition to the programs I outlined, and I still have free memory. So far, I'm pretty impressed with the difference.
     
Jasoco
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May 26, 2006, 07:58 PM
 
"Big Mac" seems to be one of those "never gonna accept it" Apple purists. Oh well.


Man, I can't wait! I've been saving up for months to buy myself a 20" iMac Duo. I'll be getting the gig of RAM, the better video card and Apple Care.

Unless Apple hopefully releases an update between now and then. I have $1250 saved up out of my total $2200~. So I'm getting there.

I plan to get it directly from the MacOutfitters. If they don't have the better video card, I'll have to make a snap decision if they can't install it in store. (I'd much rather walk in and have it the same day. I like instant gratification. )
     
LagunaSol
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May 26, 2006, 08:51 PM
 
Jasoco, you could save big bucks by going through Amazon ($1699 shipped, no tax - $100 rebate = $1599) and add a gig of RAM from NewEgg for another $90. You're under $1700 for the rig. The downside is you don't get the upgraded video RAM, but honestly, with an X1600 (not exactly a smoking gaming card) are you really going to need it? You may want to consider whether that 128 MB of VRAM is worth the extra $500 you're looking at.
     
Jasoco
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May 27, 2006, 02:06 AM
 
Yeah? Well I could save a bunch of money on my car insurance by switching to Geico, but I'm not going to.

$500? What you talking about? It's $75.

iMac - $1699
1GB RAM - $100 extra (Big whoop. $10 extra.)
128MB VRAM extra - $75 (I want to have the highest end I can get. I don't want to upgrade again for a while.)
AppleCare - $169

Besides, I like to support my local Mac retailer. (NOT an Apple Store.)

I don't see big enough of a price difference to use Amazon. Amazon can't get the thing to my house the same day. Walking into a store can.

I'm not even buying it yet though.
     
icruise
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May 27, 2006, 05:28 AM
 
Geez, Jasco. He's just trying to make a helpful suggestion. And it's one that I happen to agree with. I really don't think the 256MB graphics card is going to make much of a difference at all, and you can save a bundle by buying elsewhere. Don't forget that Amazon doesn't charge sales tax to most locations, plus they have a $100 rebate.
     
LagunaSol
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May 27, 2006, 10:45 AM
 
You said "$2,200," so that's what I was going on. $2,200 - $1,700 = $500, no? At least by the math I learned in school. OK, add the AppleCare and you're saving $300.

Essentially by ordering through Amazon you save the $100 (rebate) plus sales tax (another $100 or so) plus the $75 for the VRAM upgrade...so essentially you're paying almost $300 to get the extra VRAM, the usefulness of which is what I would question at that price. I really don't know that another 128 MB VRAM is going to give your machine any more longevity.

But it's your money. Personally, I went with my machine from Amazon (which fortunately had a $150 rebate at the time). The $300+ I saved will go towards my next machine, whenever that may be.
     
BikerJonTN
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May 27, 2006, 01:58 PM
 
I used the same logic LagunaSol describes when deciding from where to purchase my 20" iMac Core Duo. I chose Amazon. I paid $1700 up front. Amazon had a promotion for free AppleCare and $150 rebate at the time. I opted to forgo the 256MB video card for a large price savings.

Cost of machine I would have ordered (from the Apple Education Store):
$1599 (iMac) + $119 (AppleCare) + $68 (256MB video card) + 9.25% (TN tax) = $1951.20

Cost of machine I paid for (from Amazon):
$1699 (iMac) + $0 (AppleCare) + $0 (128MB video card) + 0% (Amazon tax) - $150 (Rebate) = $1549

Savings: $402.20
Losses: 256MB video card
PowerBook G4 17-inch 1GHz (March 2003)
iBook G4 12-inch 1.33GHz (July 2005)
iMac 20-inch 2.0GHz Intel Core Duo (January 2006)
     
Jasoco
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May 27, 2006, 08:08 PM
 
PA sales tax is 6%.

Listen, sorry if I seemed mean. I don't mean to. I hate making enemies. (Karma is a bi**h.)

The reasons I preferred my decision are..

1) I like things instantly. I can't wait for stuff to ship. I need it right away! Waiting is the hardest part.

2) I like to support my local businesses. It wouldn't seem the same not getting it from my friends at MacOutfitters.

3) I may not be as much a zealot as I was when I switched 6 years ago, but there's just something that keeps me from buying an Apple from a non Apple store.

4) There's just something I like about walking into the store and walking out with a brand new shiny computer. I've done it twice so far. First with a G4 LCD iMac. Big box. Hardly fit in the car. Second time was my mini. Tiny little box. I took it to work and showed it off before taking it home. I was really looking forward to having that feeling again. Just something unsatisfying about getting a box on the porch. Plus, the lingering fear no one will be home and the jerk delivery person will take it back and make me wait until Monday because OBVIOUSLY it'll arrive on a Friday. I HATE that. It has happened to me so many times and really really gets me down.

If that's not worth the extra $300, I don't know what is. Maybe I'm just weird.

Besides, I won't be getting it for a few months anyway. Or weeks. I have to decide. I don't know when they'll update the iMacs again. So I don't know whether it'll be this revision or next. Hopefully next.

I will be hooking up a second 20" Cinnamon Display to it also, so I was kinda hoping for the bigger VRAM. (I really don't want to put up with the system crawling to a halt when the desktop picture changes or I need to watch a large video. So the more the better, isn't it? I'm also preparing for the future. The best I can get right now so I'm not disappointed later.
     
jwoods
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May 27, 2006, 08:50 PM
 
What is a "Cinnamon Display"?

Nevermind me, just fooling around.
     
nebulousforce
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May 27, 2006, 10:17 PM
 
Being a very happy owner of a new 20 iMac ICD since 3.29.06 & I can understand both sides but to some degree I'd have to side with Jasoco. Unfortunately, where I live there is no Apple retailers anywhere! There was 1 many years ago pre-G4 and it shut down and I'm not sure but I think that it may have moved to New Orleans, I'm in Baton Rouge. I too like to support local businesses as I was once an owner of a small video game store and it really helps when you have a dedicated, faithful customer base. I could've went to BestBuy but I've heard mostly, negative things about their Apple service but with Boot Camp that's probably changed. I wanted a G5 in '05 but my savings didn't add up so I waited till '06 and I had decided to go for an iMac but I then guess what? In January Mr. Jobs introduced a new iMac and I was faced with the "Enemy Inside"! No more G5! No more PPC! Now I was stuck between an isight equipped PPC or ICD. I waited a while checked the reviews, bench marks and said to myself I don't want to be left behind in technology this time around so I took a leap of faith and haven't looked back. I found out the hard way that Apple will sneak in, so to speak, a software upgrade that requires what? VRam! I don't plan on using my iMac for games but I may want to span it to another monitor or do some graphic intensive things in the near future and I too don't want the crawl effect, etc., either. As everyone already knows it's not user upgradeable on all iMacs, bummer really. I'm sure that's a factor in Apple's profit margin and business model, smart lil' buggers aren't they? Since with a desktop a new video card is no problem to exchange for a newer faster one. Not only that, I plan to keep and use this iMac for several years and yes I'll probably buy something else newer and faster in the next 2 years. But if I don't, I've spent technically more than $75 for twice the VRam but so what? I may've saved quite a few dollars by going with the 128 standard but I, like Jasoco, don't want to be let down, maybe, because we didn't opt for the upgrade. Peace of mind? Maybe we're weird? I use synthetic motor oil in my vehicle for a not so similar reason. Why buy a vehicle with an HO engine cuz it's there when and if you need it. Gimmie an HEMI!
On the Apple store's web site I too was debating the purchase mainly because of the 9% LA sales tax (OUCH!) but to my surprise I checked my credit status and was approved for $800 @ 3 months interest free Master Card. My credit is rebounding but I almost had enough to buy it 100% cash & carry just had to wait another week for a paycheck. However, that influenced my decision to go with them even though I could've went with smalldog.com saved on the tax and still got the Vram upgrade but they didn't have the credit offer. I used the $800 to fully max out the iMac internally with the VRam and 500GB HD, with the exception of the 2GB of ram that I purchased from 18004memory.com over a month before. Better things come to those who wait and sometimes it pays for itself in the future cuz now, if I wanted to I can have a Win~Blowz system for the price of an OS and have two 'puters in one. I couldn't do that with the G5 and not take a huge performance hit with virtual PC. I was considering the thought of buying or building a Shuttle PC just to play some old school games but now I don't!
Don't get me wrong I'm impressed that many of you really tried to give him the best possible advise on his purchase and that's what forum's are for, right? If anyone wants the $75 VRam and save on sales tax maybe smalldog can help if you're willing to wait just several extra days for it to arrive and if you don't live in smalldog's home state. You may not get the rebate but most resellers have some type of promo going on, like discounted or free: Ram upgrades, printers, etc.
     
LagunaSol
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May 27, 2006, 10:22 PM
 
Cinnamon Display - sounds tasty!

Hey, no hard feelings, this really isn't a debate. If certain things (like supporting a local business and instant gratification) are more important to you than $$$, I say go for it! Personally, I'm always trying to squeeze the last drop out of a dollar bill. I even went for the "free shipping" option from Amazon (despite the fact I too am incredibly impatient) and agonized for the two weeks it took for my machine to arrive.
     
macintologist
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May 27, 2006, 10:32 PM
 
My iMac CD is sooo quiet. My roomate's PC is what makes all the noise in this room!
     
nebulousforce
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May 27, 2006, 10:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by WOPR
Come on then, explain... what should they have inside then?
What almost could've been...
Did Apple make a mistake by switching to Intel? We may never know, but Apple had more options than has been previously reported.
PA Semi's first processor - the PA6T-1682M - is due to sample in the third quarter of 2006 as a 2GHz, dual-core product with two DDR2 memory controllers, 2MB of L2 cache, and support for eight PCI Express. The product will ship in volume next year and be followed by single-core and quad-core chips. It also supports the Altivec floating point instruction set that currently provides a massive speedup for multimedia and scientific Mac software. At 2GHz, the chip consumes just 7 watts of power according to PA. Intel's Core Duo consumes between 21 and 25 watts.
One problem with moving to PA Semi would be that the company was not going to ship its low-power multicore product in volume until 2007. The wait might have been worth it for Apple, since it would require no changes to the company's software base and help it save face by avoiding Intel.
By choosing to move to microprocessors from Intel, Apple has created headaches for some of its most important software partners, who face a difficult and lengthy porting process. Apple has also had to provide a compatibility layer called Rosetta, from Transitive, to run old Power PC software. Such issues could have been avoided if Apple had found a compatible, and competitive chip supplier or two.
The Ultimate PowerMac w/16 yes sixteen cores!! We can dream can't we?
Chip start-up PA Semi has broadened its product roadmap to make room for a 16-core chip and more low-power products.
Comprised of a host of DEC veterans, PA Semi has yet to start shipping its first product – a dual-core Power processor that will run at 2GHz and consume only about 7 watts. That, however, hasn't stopped the well-funded firm from planning ahead – way ahead. CEO Dan Dobberpuhl today revealed that PA Semi has architected a 16-core design and a host of other cores for "different power points."
More info:
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/05/19/pasemi_apple/
( Last edited by nebulousforce; May 27, 2006 at 11:15 PM. )
     
jwoods
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May 28, 2006, 12:03 AM
 
I understand Apples decision, and in the end, it doesn't really matter what chip is inside.

If I were Jobs, I probably would have been shopping at AMD's door a bit more.....and there is NO reason that cannot happen in the future (since AMD makes X86 compatible chips). It's not just about the chip though....it's about the ability to get the product out in volume. Intel has AMD beat in this regard (and I'm not suggesting AMD is any slouch here).

Future Macs may very have both AMD and Intel chips inside. I could be wrong

Software: Headache, yeah. BUT!!!! How different is software that runs on both OS X and Windows from each other? I don't think we are talking two complete different versions here. One with these libraries the other with these. Course, I am not a programmer, but I would think it would be easier to support one, the other, or both now than it was when the products were intel and PPC based.

Blizzard has long supported both platforms (even when it was a Intel/PPC choice). I'm sure for them, it's cheaper now. I cannot say that as absolute fact. The PPC specific software houses might have headaches, but they knew this was coming before alot of the rest of us did. (The bigger names, anyway).

I think there is room for PA Semi. Another option in a two horse race is a good thing in my book. I wish them well.
     
Eug Wanker
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May 28, 2006, 12:24 AM
 
PA Semi's chip isn't out until 2007. But who cares anyway? It'd be stupid for a multi-billion dollar company to trust its corporate existence to a small startup company.

Anyways, yes, the new iNtelMacs are very nice. We got one for work. I have a MacBook with the same CPU, and it's blistering fast too (for stuff that isn't heavily GPU dependent).

I'm probably going to get an iNtelMac to replace my G5 iMac when it goes Conroe 3.0 GHz, and gets a next-gen optical drive and HDCP support.
     
nebulousforce
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May 28, 2006, 04:00 AM
 
Originally Posted by larrinski
I have had only one complaint with the intel switch and that is the isub driver still not out. But I had far more problems with my 1st gen imac than the new intel imac. A truly great machine...
I've had my old USB SoundSticks-1 for 4.5+ years I believe? Anyway, from what I remember I had little bit of trouble getting it to recognize them, working properly or all the time at first. But I believe there was a software update within a few days that I received my new iMac 20"ICD and hooked them up & it hasn't happened again. They work beautifuly and sound a little better than before on the 20"iMac ICD.
( Last edited by nebulousforce; May 28, 2006 at 06:04 PM. )
     
parsec_kadets
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May 28, 2006, 03:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by nebulousforce
At 2GHz, the chip consumes just 7 watts of power according to PA. Intel's Core Duo consumes between 21 and 25 watts.
One problem with moving to PA Semi would be that the company was not going to ship its low-power multicore product in volume until 2007.
You honestly think the best option for Apple would have been to stay with an architecture that has been moving at a snails pace for years? And for what? A CPU that's as fast as today's entry level PowerMac G5? And oh yeah, remember that Jobs made the announcement a year ago. Today we have hindsight to give us some 20/20 vision that suggests PA will actually pan out. But I wouldn't have been willing to take that bet a year ago, and Apple wasn't either. So they were supposed to wait TWO years for a startup to give them a chip that's as fast as what they already had, and it may or may not have been on time? Sure it consumes less power and would have been great in a PowerBook, but they would have lost so many customers by then that it wouldn't matter anyway. Face it, Apple put all the remaining PPC eggs in the IBM basket. IBM took them and didn't give a damn. End of story.
( Last edited by parsec_kadets; May 28, 2006 at 04:41 PM. )
     
Jasoco
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May 28, 2006, 03:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by jwoods
What is a "Cinnamon Display"?

Nevermind me, just fooling around.
Apple Cinnamon Display is too irresistible not to use.
     
nebulousforce
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May 28, 2006, 05:41 PM
 
Quote from parsec_kadets "You honestly think the best option for Apple would have been to stay with an architecture that has been moving at a snails pace for years?"

No, not really. I just copied the article from the Register, sorry if I didn't say so. I assumed that there were a few out there that didn't know of PA.
When I heard the announcement of the switch I wasn't happy with the it at first (Enemy Inside!) but with Boot Camp and Leopard not to mention Parallel, this opens up, pardon the pun "new widows' of opportunity for Apple to increase sales and have more users onboard their hardware. I mean come on, I bought an iMac 2.0GHZ ICD not a G5!

Current- iMac 20" 2.0GHZ ICD 2GB 500GB HD 256VR Tiger waiting for Leopard!
Previous- iBook G3 SE 466MHZ 576MB 60GB HD 8MB(!)VR Panther
( Last edited by nebulousforce; May 28, 2006 at 06:05 PM. )
     
Jasoco
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May 29, 2006, 01:42 AM
 
Can we please get back on topic? This is a thread about the iMac. Not Apple's choice of processors. There's plenty of threads elsewhere for that.
     
nebulousforce
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May 29, 2006, 02:32 AM
 
Originally Posted by Jasoco
Can we please get back on topic? This is a thread about the iMac. Not Apple's choice of processors. There's plenty of threads elsewhere for that.
Chill out. Out of the 40+ something posts here 5 or so went a little off base to the CPU but in reality most of them didn't technically follow through with; "So, general feeling seems to be that the iMac Core Duo is great"?
Eh no, lets talk about other stuff like speakers that don't work and how much an iMac costs and where to buy them the cheapest, from whom, and Cinnamon Displays etc.,...
Sorry I disrupted your train of thought there.
     
Severed Hand of Skywalker
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May 29, 2006, 11:54 AM
 
The mini's also don't seem to have any problems. I don't know why they go bad the second they are put in a laptop.

"Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh"
     
   
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