[suvsr4terrorists]

Hey everybody. I'm going to be hacking up my quicksilver in the next week or so to install one of these:



http://www.xoxide.com/logisys-35-dig...ler-black.html

Basically, my fans were really noisy, so I replaced my 120mm casefan with a aerocool turbine 3000, which helped, but the big noise killer was replacing the 80mm fan on my dual 1.33 ghz gigadesigns upgrade. The factory fan was noiser than all hell, it was definitely on it's way out. The only problem was the stock fan was very narrow, it was 80X80X15 or something, and the fan I replaced it with is thicker, more like 80X80X25. This meant I had to get new stainless screws, which I couldn't find at any hardware store since they're METRIC. I ended up getting metric bolts. I chose this fan , as it looks cool, it's quiet, and it pushes over 30CFM, which is what gigadesigns specified. Anyway, now I have two new fans, and my computer is a lot quieter, but it's STILL noisy!!!

Why?

That 60mm piece of crap intake fan! Seeing as how it basically blows directly onto the side of the gigadesigns upgrade, I'm not sure I even need it anymore, since hte 80mm fan is blocking almost all of it's airflow. Hence the temperature monitor. I'm going to see if unplugging hte hairdryer like 60mm fan makes the temperature go up at all on the CPU's heatsink. My quicksilver doesn't have the zipdrive in the lowerbay, so this temp moniter/fan controller should basically bolt right in, with some mods required for the front faceplate.

I currently have:

dual 1.33ghz G4 upgrade from gigadesigns
1.5 gigs ram
9600XT, overclocked to 500mhz
twin 160 gig 7200 rpm drives hooked up to an ata133 card, raid 0
120 gig hooked up to the mobo directly
and blue LED fireflies on every molex connector.

Considering the temp moniter has 3 temp sensors, I was thinking about putting one on the CPU heatsink, one on the 9600XT's heatsink, but I still have one left over. What do you guys think I should do with the third sensor? Hard drive temp? Internal case temp? Exhaust temp? Not sure.

[Link]

I don't even think you need it.

One reason I'd love to upgrade is to get rid of that crappy ass fan.

[yukon]

Alright, lets see here. Yeah, the fan on the upgrade was crappy, from the pictures they definitely had the headroom to do a proper sized fan, at least with the quicksilver. Your choice of fan replacement probably isn't the best.....I've never heard of the brand, it's specifications are at the old "standard, slightly wrong" numbers, and LED and clear fans are generally frowned upon (the plastic is different, the LED is unnecessary). I'd recommend a Panaflo M1A, the specs are different (worse) but you know the numbers are much closer to reality....there are other quieter fans, but they won't push enough air. I'm not sure about the 120mm fan, more clear plastic, odd design, and it's specs say it's putting out more air than the current silent favourite the orange Nexus 120mm....Personally I like buying powerful fans and undervolting them to quiet, it gives you more headroom and you still get the silence....I'd recommend replacing your 120mm fan with the nexus or a faster but well known quiet brand, though you just bought it.....try holding the new fans in your hand and see how loud they are, they'll be quieter than in the case but you can tell if they're loud.

I don't know the Quicksilver I'm afraid, I just know the cooling went a bit mad with overclocked G4s in the later models. So. Again, I recommend a higher rated 120mm fan than usual. With the more powerful and louder fan, you can remove the smaller crappier fans you have, tape up the holes, and enjoy the slightly quieter, slightly cooler (probably), and less whiny noise. I can't tell what the PSU is using or how it's shaped, try looking for modifications for the PSU.

I wasn't going to reply since I have a long essay on the way for a similar topic, but that multifunction panel you suggest looks awesome, I had no idea what to do with the zip drive bay other than a fan controller that would need me to mod the bezel. I've been having temperature troubles with my modifications (stupid summer). So thanks for the pointer, I'll check it out, looks good. Check back in these forums in the next couple weeks for a post from me.

If your videocard has a fan, replace the heatsink for a quieter and cooler videocard. Your third sensor should be a HD sensor, since that's the most important component (IMO), unless your drive reports the correct temperature in SMART (Temperature Monitor can help), I've found that new Seagate drives have trouble reporting temperatures consistently, at least through my SATA adapter. Basically, Apple's cooling design went crazy because they had to cool the hotter CPUs, your challenge is to organize it so that there's proper airflow in the case.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Originally Posted by Link

I don't even think you need it.

One reason I'd love to upgrade is to get rid of that crappy ass fan.

I don't think I need the 60mm fan either, but I'd like to watch the temps to see what happens when I unplug it. If it goes up drastically, I'll keep it in, and find another replacement fan. It just isn't worth 'guessing' about, considering how much the CPUs are worth.

[Link]

You know, I just had an idea. Why not use a ducted fan or a blower of sorts? Might take a while but there's all kinds of custom computer cooler parts -- I've seen some blowers that were meant to fit in a drive bay, but I'm sure there's a few out there that work at a 45-ish degree angle instead of a 90.

Wish one of these companies sold a HSF replacement for those of us who can't afford to go all out and buy a new processor board lol. Even if I ebayed what I've got, it'd be a hefty chunk of cash.... I bet it'd be so worth it!

I'm probably going to get one of these for now: http://www.eagepc.com/store.cfm?sear...=0&c=0&p=12049

If anything, I'll find one of those clear CPU fan "ducts" from a DA733 or something, snap that on to replace the stupid black duct -- it'll allow the fan to be seen too

[suvsr4terrorists]

Originally Posted by yukon

Alright, lets see here. Yeah, the fan on the upgrade was crappy, from the pictures they definitely had the headroom to do a proper sized fan, at least with the quicksilver. Your choice of fan replacement probably isn't the best.....I've never heard of the brand, it's specifications are at the old "standard, slightly wrong" numbers, and LED and clear fans are generally frowned upon (the plastic is different, the LED is unnecessary).

What do you mean by 'old standards slightly wrong'? It's a very quiet fan, with ball bearings, and it pushes 34cfm at only 24db. Not too shabby. Plus it looks cool.

. I'm not sure about the 120mm fan, more clear plastic, odd design, and it's specs say it's putting out more air than the current silent favourite the orange Nexus 120mm

The aerocool turbine fan is pretty nice. It pushes a bit of air and it's REALLY quiet, only 19db. What's so bad about clear plastic? The material I wouldn't think would matter that much, I always thought the design was more important.

try holding the new fans in your hand and see how loud they are, they'll be quieter than in the case but you can tell if they're loud.

They're both pretty quiet, the 60mm fan is awful. Ugh.

I can't tell what the PSU is using or how it's shaped, try looking for modifications for the PSU.

That's on my to-do list. The vents don't match up, so I need to get in there with my dremel to remove one of the finger guards.

but that multifunction panel you suggest looks awesome, I had no idea what to do with the zip drive bay other than a fan controller that would need me to mod the bezel. I've been having temperature troubles with my modifications (stupid summer). So thanks for the pointer, I'll check it out, looks good.

No problem. FYI, the logisys controller is the EXACT SAME THING as the lian li 3.5" controller, only the lian li uses an aluminum faceplate, and costs over twice as much. Not worth it, in my opinion. Right now the black version of the logisys is on sale at xoxide.com, so it's only $15. Pretty great deal.

If your videocard has a fan, replace the heatsink for a quieter and cooler videocard. Your third sensor should be a HD sensor, since that's the most important component (IMO), unless your drive reports the correct temperature in SMART (Temperature Monitor can help), I've found that new Seagate drives have trouble reporting temperatures consistently, at least through my SATA adapter. Basically, Apple's cooling design went crazy because they had to cool the hotter CPUs, your challenge is to organize it so that there's proper airflow in the case.

The 9600 series only has a big heatsink, so it has no fan whatsoever. Silence. Currently the two maxtor diamond plus drives are running at about 50 degrees celcius, which is a bit hot. I'd like to cool them down, and I'm considering removing the front speaker from the quicksilver panel, and installing an 80mm fan righ in the front to suck in cold air. It'd run right across the HDs and out the back of the case. We'll see how it goes.

Thanks for the replies, I post pics of the installation.

[Link]

Hehe. Viva la 9600.

LED fans are fine! In searching for "the right fan", sometimes they end up being BETTER than non-LED fans for CFM/dBness mostly because they're newer, and in more demand. It all depends on what you're looking for, and the RPM speed doesn't matter to me anyway.. I watch for temps.

Cash make sure that panel (I'm pretty sure it does though since I was considering one just like that) monitors the temperature of the machine. I might just buy a digital doc and hide it inside the machine to control the damn things though, I'd hate to accidentally fry something because I set the fans in low mode.

One reason I don't even bother considering "quiet PC" fans is that they're ALWAYS "geared down" -- they don't produce much airflow compared to the regular ones, and when it gets hot here I'd rather live with that noise.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Originally Posted by Link

You know, I just had an idea. Why not use a ducted fan or a blower of sorts? Might take a while but there's all kinds of custom computer cooler parts -- I've seen some blowers that were meant to fit in a drive bay, but I'm sure there's a few out there that work at a 45-ish degree angle instead of a 90.

Wish one of these companies sold a HSF replacement for those of us who can't afford to go all out and buy a new processor board lol. Even if I ebayed what I've got, it'd be a hefty chunk of cash.... I bet it'd be so worth it!

I'm probably going to get one of these for now: http://www.eagepc.com/store.cfm?sear...=0&c=0&p=12049

If anything, I'll find one of those clear CPU fan "ducts" from a DA733 or something, snap that on to replace the stupid black duct -- it'll allow the fan to be seen too

Good call, I'm just not sure if that fan is even needed anymore. It was originally there to suck in cold air and blow it across the GIGANTIC heatsinks, but I have a very SMALL gigadesigns heatsink with it's OWN 80mm fan bolted directly to it. So... it seems I might just be able to remove the whole assembly (stupid black duct, 60mm fan, etc). If I do need it, I'll probably go the route you suggested: Custom 60mm fan, or maybe even an 80mm fan with a duct.

[yukon]

"What do you mean by 'old standards slightly wrong'?"-
The numbers "34cfm at 24dBa", I constantly saw those exact numbers on fans. Companies have a tendancy to lie about specifications or measure incorrectly (like "decibles measured from next door"). Since the generally agreed upon best 80mm fan available has worse specifications, it's a good indicator than the numbers are wrong. If it runs quietly, then there's no problem, just a concideration.

"The aerocool turbine fan is pretty nice. It pushes a bit of air and it's REALLY quiet, only 19db".-
Yeah, decide how loud it is abstracted from the specifications given to you by the manufacturer. If it's quiet enough for you, no problem.

"What's so bad about clear plastic"-
I forget since I just avoid it now, I believe it was harder and more brittle, so it would vibrate more and the plastic was more likely to shatter if hit or just break. Unless you put in a window, LED/Clear is of little benefit. In any case, clear and lit fans are geared towards people who like the appearance of the inside of the computer more than it's function and noise, generally not me.

"They're both pretty quiet, the 60mm fan is awful. Ugh"-
Keep in mind that the two fans add to the noise. Concider changing them again in another couple years if you're still using the machine and plan on using it more. And 60mm fans aren't good, replace the 60mm or undervolt it to reduce the whine.

"get in there with my dremel to remove one of the finger guards".-
Yes, remove the plastic to reduce turbulence without lowering shielding. Remove the metal if you plan on using a wire grill. I'll explain in my little essay, just sent it in for checking, added an attributed clear-plastic quote.


"maxtor diamond plus drives are running at about 50 degrees celcius"-
That is hot, hotter than I like. There are cooling products available, but they're not good and generally gimmicky. I like Seagate drives, for reliability, noise and temperature, but Maxtor is my second choice.

"removing the front speaker....installing an 80mm fan"-
keep airflow direction in mind as it could decrease cooling, and remember that a fan on the front is making noise closer to you. Sounds like a good idea anyway, cooling drives is important.


The controller looks good, unless I mod the bezel then It'll be hidden behind a small door, which is fine for me. I can paint it chrome if I have to have it ;-)

Upgrading fans from lower to higher size is a good idea, great when they fit. Fan funnels are available but they add to the height and are restictive, but that might help.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Care to explain the wire mesh? I was just going to leave a gaping hole in the back of the PS.

[Link]

Some people think that leaving gaping holes in the back of their PS exposes them to EMI or something. Tis' just a damn 8cm diameter hole, don't worry bout it.

[suvsr4terrorists]

EMI?! Who cares. EMR would suck... but if that's the case, there'd be a huge ass warning on the side of the quicksilver saying "NEVER OPEN WHILE OPERATING YOU COULD DAMAGE YOUR SPERM!" or something like that.

[yukon]

Wire grill and mesh is good to stop EMI/RFI when it's steel and RFI when it's not (RFI is more important here than EMI and RFI). The G4 is well shielded already, making a gaping hole in the case can cause electromagnetic interference to interfere with the computer parts inside, or at least they will be broadcasting EMI to the outside. It can be a problem for privacy, but this is the power supply, the most EMI comes from the PSU and it's mainly just noise (not carrying data).....this may seem like no problem, but EMI can interfere with your wireless peripherals, wireless network, the radio near your computer....try putting your radio antenna near a CRT for some static, there's actually a program that can play music on your radio this way by displaying certain patterns on a CRT at certain frequencies.

By "wire grill", I meant one of these, not wire mesh, though that's good too for better shielding and maybe even rudimentary air filtration-

[suvsr4terrorists]

Originally Posted by yukon

By "wire grill", I meant one of these, not wire mesh, though that's good too for better shielding and maybe even rudimentary air filtration-

I guess, but the back of the power supply is the exhaust, so it doesn't need any filtration.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Update: Mad props to Xoxide! I noticed the middle section of red LEDs wasn't working on my alien fan, and so I sent them an email just explaining how I'm impressed so far, but the middle set of LEDs wasn't lighting up, or blinking, just sorta remaining dim all the time. Got an email back just a few hours later, and they're sending me another one, no questions asked, no need to return the one I have. Neat!

[suvsr4terrorists]

In other news, how big is the fan in the power supply? 80mm? Is it hard to get to? Anyone have any pics? Now that I have two extra fans I might as well put one in the PS. Anyone have specs for the factory PS fan?

Thanks!

[suvsr4terrorists]

I found out the fan IS 80mm, but I'm wary of taking the power supply apart. Does anyone know how to discharge a PS on the quicksilver? I know turning them on and off a few times on a PC does the trick....

[osxpinot]

Give it a paint job similar to this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...ory=14911&rd=1

[suvsr4terrorists]

No.

[hpence]

reminds me of a cash register seen at a local McDonalds...

[suvsr4terrorists]

Sweet. Parts came today. I'll see if I can start hacking it up soon. I'm also thinking about putting a fan in front to blow on the HDs.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Well, I haven't started hacking the case apart yet because my tools aren't here in my apartment, but I did do a preliminary hookup to see how things run. Basically, if I leave that leafblower 60mm fan on, the temperature of the bottom of my heatsink right between the two CPUs is at 56-57 degrees celsius. If I unplug the damn thing making my computer really really quiet, so I can actually hear the hard drives access, the temperature goes up to a steady 58 degrees. This is with the case OPEN. Now, it might be a different story with the case closed, because as far as I can tell that noisy 60mm fan is the ONLY intake fan on the whole machine. Once I get things hooked up, I'll try it again and keep an eye on the temperature, see how things work out. I'm not too worried, because I plan on cutting a big ass hole in the front of the case, right where the useless speaker is, and installing an 80mm intake fan, blowing directly across the hard drives. I'm not to worried about the CPU being up in the top of the case, because the power supply blow out, so if anything, once I remove all trace of that 60mm fan, it should hopefully suck air in just because the case has an 80mm exhaust on the PS, and a 120mm exhaust also. So... we'll see. Another idea is to order another one of these:

http://www.xoxide.com/aerocool-120mm...00-silver.html

And install it right in front, which I think would look pretty freakin sick on a quicksilver, and force a ton of air into the case, almost silently. I'm contemplating it.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Scratch that last idea, the 120mm fan is WAY too big. I'd have to get rid of the power button, and move one of the hard drives... .etc... it would suck. Too bad, because that would have looked awesome, with a big chrome fan suckin inwards right in front. heh. Watch out for fingers.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Alright, here's pics of my progress:


Gut the machine. Completely. I used the PDF for disassembly. Handy.


After I took off the cover, I discovered that apple had retardly chosen to reduce the size of the 3.5" bay opening, for some reason that doesn't make sense at all to me. I had to use a dremel to open it up, mostly on the bottom, but the top edge needed to be removed also.


Test fitting of the temp monitor.


I then used a sharpie to mark my cuts, use a dremel cutting wheel on the plastic front panel, then a razor blade to clean them up. After doing this, I switched to a sanding disc to smooth out the imperfections on this and the metal chassis.


Cutting the fake filler panel apart.


Removed the 60mm intake fan. God that thing is noisy. Right now I'm leaving the case open until I figure somethign else out, if I shut the case, the temperature on the CPU heatsink goes up to 70 degrees C, and I can't find specs for G4 chips to see if that's too hot. Better safe than sorry.


I removed the power supply, and used the cutting disc to remove the fan guard from the PS itself, because it doesn't match up with the plastic grill in back. I could have just removed the plastic grill, but this looks better.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Finished product. Also, if you have a sonnet IDE controller, there IS a spot to hook up LED HD activity lights. There's actually 4 pins, but just hook up an LED input to two of them til it starts working. The display shows the temp for the CPU heatsink (inbetween the two chips), the vid card heatsink, and the intake for the power supply (case temp).

One thing I found out is that the 9600XT is very capable of overclocking, but it puts out a LOT more heat. I had mine overclocked to 500mhz, which is 25% faster than stock, but instead of running at 47-50 degrees, it would run at about 70 degrees. FYI. I'd still o/c it for gaming, but then clock it down for normal use, as that's hot.

[Nivag]

good work! what pdf did you use to gut the QS?
me thinking of doing something to quieten my QS some more, i've done the simple things such as chop the fan grills and swap the processor fan.

[suvsr4terrorists]

I just removed the speaker, which helped. The speaker port is now a cold air intake. I don't have a fan hooked up to it, but it seems that air is sucking into it, and now my hard drives are only about 42C.... ALSO, I switched back to the loud original 120mm fan. Turns out that stock noisy piece of crap moves like 80CFM, and the aerocool 120mm fan only pushes about 37cfm.

The 120mm fan is responsible for exhaust, and also keeping the hard drives cool. So yeah, if you ever replace your 120mm fan, use one that has a lot of CFM.

- Rob

[suvsr4terrorists]

With the case closed, my CPU temp was about 69C. I reinstalled the 60mm intake fan, and now the CPU reads about 65C. Wow. 4 degrees of difference.

I think I'm going to have to rethink my plan of attack and overhaul this thing some weekend.

[suvsr4terrorists]

New idea. I reversed the 60mm CPU fan, so now it'll act as an exhaust fan. So now the 120mm fan is doing exhaust, and so is the 80mm PSU fan, and the 60mm 'cpu' fan. NOTE: Again, I have a gigadesigns upgrade, so I already have a 80mm fan bolted right to the CPU's heatsink. I wouldn't try this with a stock CPU at all. So right now, every freakin fan in this thing is either doing exhaust work or circulating air. Where's the intake? Well, I figured with the speaker now gone, the front 'port' might act as an intake vent, allowing fresh air to come right in, cool the HDs, then rise up and cool the CPU and stuff. I'll keep an eye on it the next hour and see how it does.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Nevermind. That didn't work either. The heat sensing 60mm fan was blowing at max speed, it was really loud, and the cpu got up to 71. Now I used scotch tape to help 'duct' the exhaust from the 60mm 'intake' fan directly out of the case, since it's rubber 'duct' is only a duct on one side. Now all the CPU heat that leaves one side of the heat sink should be sucked RIGHT out of the case. Closed it, now we'll see what happens.

[suvsr4terrorists]

Well, that 60mm fan is total garbage. It blows directly against the side of the 80mm CPU fan, so it's basically pointless. I'm going to see if I can rig up some sort of ducting to help out somehow.

[afrotesticles]

Redid it. 2nd try. Hid all the wiring, installed better fans. Loud as hell but works good. >sigH<

Show: 120mm Extreme Turbine Fan from aerocool, chrome with nosecone and 16 blades of death
60mm evercool billet aluminum intake fan with custom 'evil' manifold
80mm Logisys Alien CPU fan
Front speaker removed, 40mm blue led intake fan installed with custom bullet bill mounting system
Logisys 3.5" fan controller that ultimately controls no fans because they didn't mention it uses PWM to modulate fan speeds, so I'd have seizures if I hooked it up because all the fans would be 'blinking'. Lame. Oh well, at least it monitors CPU, GPU and case temperatures. Installed in lower 3.5" bay, modded front chassis and bezel for OEM look
Round silver IDE cables
Blue Fireflies on almost any molex connector
All extra wiring routed behind optical drives, underneath stock IDE cable, and underneath motherboard for a cleaner look and better airflow
Wrapped power supply cable
Blue Aluminum heatsinks stuck on almost any chip on the mobo I could find, and currently all over my radeon 9600XT so I can overclock it up to 520mhz (stock is 400)
Army Men inflitrating inside the case

Go: Gigadesigns Dual 1.33ghz G4, the older G4s that have L3 cache and better performance. Newer G4s lack l3 cache, which slows them down quite a bit.
1.5 gigs of 2700 DDR Ram
9600XT, O/Cd
20" widescreen Apple Cinema Display 1680X1050
Twin 7200rpm 160 gig drives hooked up to a PCI Sonnet Temp ata133 raid controller card, raid 0 (scary and fast)
Backup 120 gig drive
USB 2.0 card
10.4.3

[afrotesticles]

Just did teh wiring last night:
Before:
After:

[afrotesticles]

[DeathToWindows]

ok, that does look cool.

Nicely done.

[PimpTheiMac]

http://forums.macnn.com/59/marketpla...-dual-1-33-g4/

This system is now for sale.

[imitchellg5]

That is a killer system. Wow!